TheSamba.com :: View topic - Baja Rear Suspension Torsion v. Coil Overs

Tue May 10, 2005 7:17 pm

Still getting my brain around the whole project before I actually start anything. To the rear we go; 3x3 trailing arms; will beat the hell out of it off road. So, coil overs or torsion bars? Or both???

Also, where do you all find those nifty large oval shock-through-the-body grommets (? -for lack of a better term). Couldn't find them in the McKenzie's bible.

Thanks as always.

Tue May 10, 2005 8:34 pm

if you've got the money and the skill, there's no reason not to go coilover. and no, you do not need to run them in conjuntion with torsion bars

Tue May 10, 2005 9:10 pm

I wasn't able to find any of the shock grommets your are referring to either. I was forced to build my own, and I was surprised how well they turned out. here is what I did.

I purchased some thick black rubber. I also think wetsuite Neoprene material might work well for this. I sliced a 2-inch hole for the shock to pass through right in the middle, and trimmed the outside to the shape I wanted. make sure it is large enough to cover the hole you cut in your cars bodywork.

For the attaching ring, I used some heavy gauge stainless (I think it was 16 or 18 gauge but I am not sure). I traced the pattern out leaving roughly 3/4 inches around the inside, drilled countless holes along the perimeter and finally torched the pieces out with the use of a plasma cutter. I attached them to the car with stainless #8 sheetmetal screws. They look and perform perfectly.
SHMO

Wed May 11, 2005 12:09 pm

Let's assume, for arguement sake, that I have neither skill nor money. Let's also assume I'm worried about little fingers getting pinched-off by compressing springs (there will be a rear seat for the kids). What would I be giving up if I stuck with torsion bars (assume SAW 27mm) and did not go with coilovers? I suppose the new torsion bars would cost more than a set of springs, but still worried about fingers and getting a good seal where the shock passes through the body. Oh yea, no way will I ever afford to run duals back there, if thats a thought.

Also, SHMO, thanks for the tip. I've got lots of neoprene as a couple of my wetsuits seem to have shrunk for some reason (at least I keep telling myself that).

Wed May 11, 2005 12:20 pm

Well, with no skill and no money i say leave it alone and drive it. 3x3 kit=$1000.0 minimum,shocks$400.00 to $1400 depending. coilover conversion kit=$200.00, plus all the fab work,limit straps, and all the crap i cant even remember right now. brake lines, Believe me, it will be money wlee spent but then you have to think about the front end. what good is having 15 inches of travel out back if you have 7 up front.

Wed May 11, 2005 12:57 pm

baja5 wrote: what good is having 15 inches ... out back if you have 7 up front.

Hey! What kind of a site is this?

Wed May 11, 2005 1:25 pm

Funny,

but I second what baja5 said. If you are unable to do any of the work yourself, and if money is tight, building a car like you are describing might not be a good idea. Just buying the parts alone will cost you some considerable dough. plus, nothing was even mentioned about the chassis work needed to tie all this stuff together. Now, if you are forced to farm out a fabricator and a mechanic to install it all, SHIKES!

If there is anything you don't want, its a partially assembled pile of expensive parts that will never take you or your family anywhere. Trust me, I have swooped up my fair share of projects that people couldn't complete. Have you considered buying an already complete car, or perhaps one with most of the work already done?

SHMO

Wed May 11, 2005 2:07 pm

I was kidding about skills. Will be doing it all myself (except for final computer alignment). I do everything myself (especially did so during adolesence). I even mount and balance my car tires (stock size). If they had home surgery kits, I'd do that too (wouldn't that be neat? - Oh look, I've been eating too much, guess I'd better lipo my love handles tonight). I may be a lawyer, but I had two years of engine mechanics back in the day and worked as a welder too (although I've never had the opprotunity to dive into a VW motor...yet) - born with a steel spoon in my mouth). Any excuse to buy more tools. And, of course, with you all as a bottomless well of information from which to draw, it makes it much easier to make the correct decisions.

Picking up vert #2 in two days. Still fear it will be too nice to slice and dice. We shall see. I've already bought too many baja parts to back down now!

Speaking of tools, any of you know where to pick up a 002 jig? ...Cheap!

Wed May 11, 2005 2:28 pm

How can you be a lawyer with no $$$$? Court appointed defense lawyer?Aren't all attorneys rich?

Wed May 11, 2005 2:59 pm

baja5 wrote: Court appointed defense lawyer?

Now whys it gotta be like that? I thought we were buds. "Defense lawyer," geeszch. Prosecutor for life! A prosecutor that rides motorcycles and has VWs. Go figure. Oh yea, a wife in school (that means no income form her for at least one more year), plus two more mouths, always with their open mouths pointing up to the sky (kids). I'll never be rich. But then again, if I wanted $, then I wouldn't be a prosecutor. Its almost one of those "higher calling" things. Besides, I've got some societal debt that I accumulated back in my "wild years" that I feel I need to pay back.

Wed May 11, 2005 3:08 pm

Right on, we need a few more people to make sure they get locked up and the key lost. i know the feeling of having mouths to feed. when i had my son my wife quit her job to be a mom. There went the salary and the gas card.But i'd rather have her doing it than someone i dont know at a daycare center.

Wed May 11, 2005 3:37 pm

Bingo. Wife went on bed rest eight weeks before our almost six-year-old was born. That was the last time she produced income (I've learned, the hard way, not to say "last time she worked"). Then number two came along and she continued to be a stay at home mom. Now, its a full-time student. Just one more year and there will be some nursing income (hope she doesn't dry up, ba-dum-dum).

Thu May 12, 2005 12:13 am

So when will you be starting your project? I am already looking forward to all the free legal advice. :wink:

SHMO

Thu May 12, 2005 8:14 am

You're in luck SHMO, I'm a member of the WA Bar too. Let's see, draft a will ... bondo my welds. It could work.

That reminds me about your nay-sayers. I too smoothed a number of welds on our sandrail (mostly light tabs). Looked great and they have held up to the worse the bottom of Baja (redundant for you Spanish speakers) has to offer. Of course the rest of the rail is in constant need of repair as Baja is tough on equip.

Picking up the Beetle tomorrow. The baja parts will start rolling in after next weekend. But I don't think the wife will let me tough it (Baja project - get your minds out of the gutter) until I remodel her kitchen. That is the price I must pay for buying a second counvertible. That, and the constant "Yap yap yap yap yap I can't believe you bought a second convertible. You don't get to watch The Daily Show because you bought a second convertible. Instead, I'm watching American Idol." If she finds the new Glock I've been hiding from her, she'll probably use it on me. A fate much better than being forced to watch American Idol, however....Or Survivor. Yitch.