TheSamba.com :: View topic - When should you replace those suspension components?

Tue Jul 12, 2005 8:59 am

I spent this weekend ripping out my whole front suspension. I did not start out expecting to do this but that nagging inner voice kept saying " Hey! You are already replacing the springs and brakes (big brake kit) and the upper ball joint boots are torn and one tie rod end boot torn-needs replacing. So why not just replace all the rubber up front while you are at it-Brand new car man!" So many bruised knuckles and broken backs later one side is off and the other kept on by on frozen and stripped ball joint hex nut. :cry:

The lower ball joints have boots intact and seem fine. The upper control arm bushing outsides look semi-coroded but rubber inside Ok (not new but still working type thing). Lower control arm bushings looked frayed while in but appear to be Ok as well on the inside.

Since I am so deep in work already I am going to replace everything but here is the question: Did I need to ? It is an 89' Westy with 189K, whole life in california. Is there a time in a Vanagon's life where you should replace this stuff regardless of how it may or may not look? I am not a wear specialist so I do not trust my opionion but it will put me back a few billz. What you think? Is rubber the way to go or polyurethane? :?: :-k

Tue Jul 12, 2005 10:03 am

It's always a good idea to replace all that stuff at close to 200K, I would say. Just don't use cheap parts, though. That will waste your time. I understand when they start to make noise they are worn. I also understand spraying lube will stop the noise. I am sure that is only temporary as the noise tends to come back.

Unless you are some sort of racing nut I would only put in the rubber. Maybe, use the plastic for the steering rack mounts, if they have any. It is a camper, you do not need viabration inducing parts added to a van that already naturally has a lot of noises.

Wed Jul 13, 2005 2:58 pm

I don't think urethane is available. I'd use it but that's me.

Get genuine VW rubber. Aftermarket stuff has a tendancy to self destruct in 50k miles or so.

Are you replacing the upper joints or just trying to re-do the boots? If you are replacing (not expensive so you may consider it anyway), then cutting off the offending bolt head will allow the joint to drop off and you can replace it.

Good that the bottoms are in good condition as they are only able to be replaced with the proper "C" shaped adaptor... local parts store rental "ball joint press" will NOT work!

The tie rod ends seem to fail less often than the inner ends. If there is any lateral play at the rack it will not hold an alignment worth pig-spit. Those rods are not as cheap as I would like but they are not hideously expensive, either. I suggest they should be changed so long as you are in there... I used a pipe wrench to get them loose and for the final tightening as the wrench size was not available in my "kit."

Personally, the bushes are pretty hardy. I'd wait until you have a real issue before messing with them.

Bearings, seals, ball-joints and tie-rods need more attention, in my experience.

Mike!

Thu Jul 14, 2005 9:20 am

Well, I am replacing EVERYTHING. Already ripped out the whole front suspension, so I might as well. Now, as it looks, only the upper ball joints and tie rod ends were needing replacing (cracked boots). This could have been done without taking the suspension out.

I do not know how to REALLY tell if these components are worn so I just replaced them all. If I did it again I would NOT bother with the lower ball joint and control arm bushings. They were not that bad. Damn spring almost killed me! Popperd the spindle out and hit me in the neck! I am stupid sometimes. :roll: Neck is sore, I am alive. BUT it should be more than badass now with all new components, syncro.org springs, billstein shocks, Big Brakes and 16" Go Westy Rims/Tires. Absolutely all that I can think of to make it corner like a porche and not get thrown around the freeway when the wind is blowing. My westy had a bad lean too, this should be ok now.

Only thing else I can think of are some polyurethane sway arm bushings. Cannot find.

Thu Jul 14, 2005 10:15 am

You forgot to upgrade the front sway bar and add a rear sway bar! Go to http://www.swaybars.com which is the sales site for http://www.addco.com

While you are at it you should also replace the brake flex lines with Stainless Steel Teflon lines for MSDS. http://www.msdsinc.com

Thu Jul 14, 2005 10:26 am

BTW: I recently put in syncro.org springs in my Westy. It did NOT cure the lean. This weekend we are making shims. Hope it helps. BUT, I know it will not do anything for me going around right turns. UGH.

Thu Jul 14, 2005 10:58 am

I am in the midst of ordering spacers from syncro.org that will apparently cure the lean. 10mm polyurethane on the rear.

http://www.syncro.org/bushings.htm

Waiting for price from steve.

Look like you have the ultimate setup there. How is it working. BadAss or SoSo. ie worth it? Are you still getting pushed around by the semi's?

The rims, tires, shocks, and a good alignment made my van go from downright frightening to manageble. Hopefully this other stuff will make it good.

Thu Jul 14, 2005 1:09 pm

When you tighten up the control arm bushes, do it with the full weight of the vehicle on the ground.

I have NOT had a sway in the wind issue when I use reinforced tires... I most certainly do when I use regular p-metrics.

Proper alignment is critical too.

good luck, let us know how it worked out.

If you have a lean that new springs do not fix, you may have a bent control arm.

Mike!

Wed Jul 20, 2005 10:12 am

It is REALLY hard for a shop to press in the control arm bushings and lower ball joints. REALLY hard to find a place that knows how. Cost me $204. My place still says they wish they didnt take the job.

We shall see if it is worth it.

Moral of the story: Dont replace the lower ball joint and upper/lower control arm bushing unless you REALLY need to.............

Wed Jul 20, 2005 10:34 am

My 85 Westy started out at 18.5 inches in the front and 16.5 inches in the back. I have D load 185/14s and OK shocks. Snycro.org only had rear springs available and no spacers. I put the rears in and my van went to 17.5 inches in the back. No lean measured. After a couple of weeks the rear was sitting at about 17 inches. DAMN. And it was leaning some after a few weeks too. Double damn.

Now, it is to be noted that my left side upper spring guide was missing. Must have broke off and fallen away. Not so bad, I cut one off the parts van and welded a screw in so I could bolt it in. At the same time I made a spacer plate out of aluminium. It does not ride or drive much different.

Point here, is I am not sure the springs are worth it. My expert German Master mechanic dad says I need some air suspension in the back. That is what I will look into next.