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Wed Jul 13, 2005 11:01 am

Howdy...

I posted this in the Beetle section, but I guess I'm being ignored over there now. Hoping to get some insight from the sand rail/dunebuggy folks...

I've been redoing the brakes on my rail buggy...I bought what I thought were the correct brake drums for the rear because the ones that were on there had been turned too far out of spec and would have been unsafe to reuse.

So I ordered replacement 5-lug drums...the ones that were on there before were 5-lug...well -- here's a link to the other discussion:
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=123234&sid=366349d6a53658647f5f6c0222383f9a

Short version is I was told I have a "long axle" (swing axle) rear end...and that the correct drums for those would be 1968 IRS 4-lug drums.

So my options are to buy 4-lug drums and probably new wheels...or get the new 5-lug drums turned down enough to fit over the brake shoes.

If I get new wheels, can anyone tell me which wheels I'd need for the 4-lug drums? Does the Bentley list the diameter of those drums so I'll know how much I need to have the 5-lug ones turned down? The wheels on there now are 4-lug...4-130mm pattern. I guess I could reuse those if I need to.

I apologize if I'm not supposed to cross-post for help. I was hoping maybe some folks here that have more experience with mix-matched parts might have more insight and may not have seen the post in the other forum area.

Thanks for any advice...I'm really at a loss.

Wed Jul 13, 2005 11:28 am

Why not change the backing plates and use the earlier shoes? If you need backing plates, I have a pair $20.00 shipped to you.

Wed Jul 13, 2005 12:05 pm

axishp wrote: Why not change the backing plates and use the earlier shoes? If you need backing plates, I have a pair $20.00 shipped to you.

Well...I was told these are the correct backing plates for the long axle stubs on there now. I had used the 40mm shoes before but it was really clear those shoes weren't right. That's why I'm confused...the earlier shoes do fit on these backing plates correctly...but the drums do not fit over the shoes.

I wish there was an easier way to figure out what I have and what I need. Would pictures help? I can take LOTS of pictures if it would help make more sense of this...

Thanks for the offer...if it turns out I need them (without having to change out everything else in the rear end), I'll take you up on it...

Wed Jul 13, 2005 4:02 pm

This is a dumb question, but do you have your adjusters backed off?

I had the same trouble with mine, even after backing off the adjusters. I ended up having to open the bleeder valve to let off presure, then they went right on.

Long story short, I replaced the wheel cylinder later on because it was hanging up and making the brakes drag.

Wed Jul 13, 2005 4:23 pm

I believe you can use the early model wide 5 drums and 30mm brake shoes and backing plates with the long axles if you put a spacer between the drum and nut (as shown in the pic). The spacer is hardened and available at any good VW parts store.

Wed Jul 13, 2005 5:24 pm

Shep wrote: This is a dumb question, but do you have your adjusters backed off?

I had the same trouble with mine, even after backing off the adjusters. I ended up having to open the bleeder valve to let off presure, then they went right on..

Ahhhhh-HA! I went and checked the adjusters...they had about 2 threads exposed on each side. I took them out, adjusted them all the way down, then put them back...the drum fit!!! BARELY, but it did slip on...there is not much clearance at all. They will be fun to adjust...may not have much room. I haven't tightened the beast of a nut to the 200+ ft-lb yet...I am going to need a LARGE piece of pipe from what I've read...

BTW, it's about 110°F in my garage right now...I think I lost a couple of pounds just in the few minutes I was out there! Whew!

ellobo wrote: I believe you can use the early model wide 5 drums and 30mm brake shoes and backing plates with the long axles if you put a spacer between the drum and nut (as shown in the pic). The spacer is hardened and available at any good VW parts store.

That is also great info...thank you! I have the wide 5 drums on there before and there was no spacer there. I do not know why that is...I think I need to get the issue of Hot VW's from a couple of months ago and read up on my swing axle...:(

Thanks again for the help and especially patience with my newbie mistakes!!!

Wed Jul 13, 2005 9:45 pm

FYI: Thing drums are 5 lug with long splines and use 4 lug sized shoes.