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Sun Nov 25, 2007 4:47 am

Good to see this VW fire hazard topic posted. Reminds me I need to go over my bug to look for problem areas.

In the past I have seen the clear plastic filters crack or leak at their glued or heat welded seam. Also being plastic they are suseptable to heat failure in the engine compartment.

I noticed the picture on page 6 of the blue aluminum filter that has nuts on each end of the barrel due to it's servicability and it reminded me of a steel and glass serviceable filter I once bought and installed on a different application for an engine. The vibration caused the nuts to loosen and it began leaking.

I saw one VW owner who had one of these glass serviceable filters on it and as soon as I saw it I told the owner about how the nuts can vibrate loose. I also pointed out to him that since it had a glass barrel the engine compartment heat could possibly break the glass or even just a bump in the road could cause it to hit and break.

The only way I would have a filter in the engine compartment is if were all metal and hermetically sealed. Currently on my VW I have a clear plastic filter up front below the gas tank. Even this keeps me wondering about it but it is only seeing ambient tank pressure, not pressure from the fuel pump.

Mon Nov 26, 2007 1:06 pm

So for us total newbies, if we're going to order fuel line about how many feet should we get? I have a '72 Super myself. I found the 5mm German stuff here:

http://www.jbugs.com/store/merchant.mvc?Screen=PROD&Product_Code=N203551&Category_Code=8241

And then it was suggested to replace the fuel filter, diaphrams, and tie down the carb fittings; anything else? My fuel filter is in my engine compartment; is relocating it really as simple as putting it in the middle of the fuel line under the gas tank?

Mon Nov 26, 2007 1:41 pm

Mon Nov 26, 2007 4:25 pm

Lilgoden wrote: So for us total newbies, if we're going to order fuel line about how many feet should we get? How long do you plan on driving/keeping the car? I usually buy 10' at a time. Lasts me about 2 years, as I replace the rubber lines once a year.

Lilgoden wrote: My fuel filter is in my engine compartment; is relocating it really as simple as putting it in the middle of the fuel line under the gas tank?

As stated above, yes.

Mon Nov 26, 2007 5:32 pm

About 5ft will replace all braided fuel lines. The one under the tank, where the hard line exits the tunnel by the transmission and in the engine compartment. Also do use new clamps of the correct size.
David

Sun Dec 09, 2007 3:53 pm

I've been thinking about making something like this:

http://www.speedwaymotors.com/pl/946,1010_Sprint-Car-Fire-Bottle-Fire-System-25-lbs.html

Admittedly, 300.00 to 400.00 (depending on which size you choose) would be a small price to pay to save your car, but I'm wondering it a store bought extinguisher could be converted to such use. Mount the extinguisher on the tunnel, aluminum tubing to the engine compartment and set it off from inside the car.

Anyone already done this?

(I haven't read this whole thread in a while, so excuse me if it has been done and described the procedure).

Sun Dec 30, 2007 8:07 pm

Two things to watch for:
Old fuel lines and that damned little plastic cover on the battery!!!
the later of the two is how I burned my backseat and brandnew headliner!lol

Fri Jan 18, 2008 10:47 pm

Installing a filter under the gas tank is not that hard, but be sure that the tank is near empty and drain all the fuel out of it before replacing the fuel line filter.

The gasoline comes out of the tank with a great volume! I only had a gallon or two in mine and it ended up all over me and the garage floor! Plus the location is kinda hard to get to, you have to jack the bug up, then wrastle yourself way in there to get the job done. I found that using a lift at a garage makes the entire process so simple.

Sun Feb 03, 2008 8:18 am

dualref wrote: Installing a filter under the gas tank is not that hard.

True, but by the tranny is alot easier to change out. Visual inspection of the filter and lines are easier too.

Never had any problems with the cheap fuel filters. I change them out regularly and use the better made Israel ones when I can get them. Seem to be thicker plastic and nicer quality than the Taiwan stuff.

Mr Hoover and Glenn,Thanks for the fuel line pass through tip!

Sun Feb 03, 2008 5:17 pm

One more note - and I think that was covered earlier - use "safety wires" Go to hardware store a get a roll or stainless or galvanized wire - I dont know the gauge - maybe 20 gauge or something. The have it on the racks and call it "hardware wire" or something like that.

Anyway - run a loop of it under the hose clamp on one side of the fuel filter and then under the clamp on the other side - then twist the ends together. This prevents the hose from slipping off the ends if you dont have bulbed ends on your filters. (I do this even if the ends are bulbed) Also any carb that has a press in fuel fitting should have this except you loop the wire around a screw on the carb, then under the hose clamp. I think I stole this tip from Glenn.

Something else I do it zip tie the fuel lines together at the fuel pump. Pretty unlikely that both are going to come off at the same time. Maybe a little over kill? Yep. But do I worry anymore? Nope.

Tue Mar 04, 2008 3:02 am

I lost an old Bug to fire, and the reason was that a fuel line broke and sprayed gas onto the exhaust manifold. I had an extinguisher, I emptied it on the fire, it put the fire out, and within 2 seconds, the fire flared right back up since the extinguisher didn't cool the exhaust manifold, and gas was still running down on it. I haven't had a beetle since that one, and I'm looking at getting a '71 at the moment, and I already told my wife, first thing I'm doing is putting all new fuel lines on it to prevent a loss like that. I was careful with everything on that car, from the bodywork to the interior work, I just never thought of something as stupid as a fuel line. It was dryrotted, it broke, and everything else I ever did to the car suddenly became meaningless. Needless to say, to me, the cheapest thing you can do to make your bug live longer is to put new fuel lines on it. Even if my motor had blown in that car, it wouldn't have taken the interior with it, or the whole back end of the bodywork.

Tue Mar 04, 2008 1:31 pm

You're welcome. But you're still doing it wrong :-)

By inserting a fuel filter in the flexible line in the tranny bay you've increased the mass of the line, guaranteeing an increase in the magnitude of its motion.

By putting the filter under the fuel tank, you are putting it between two CHASSIS components. That is, between two parts of the vehicle that are bolted solidly together. The power train moves at a DIFFERENT rate than the chassis.

Just another of those 'unimportant' details. Such as the axle boot in the photo where the seam is installed at 2 o'clock... instead of at 9 or 3. (With split boots the idea is to install the seam on the NEUTRAL axis, which means horizontally).

I started posting stuff like this to the internet when the VW magazines regularly rejected the information as articles. Hot VW's were supposed to be fun -- everything was Quick & Easy. The last thing the editors wanted was some old phart pointing out that the cause -- and the cure -- of firey Volkswagens had been known since 1958... along with lotsa other pesky details, such as how to correctly install split-boots and so on.

The odd thing is, a lot of folks who do things wrong don't like having that pointed out, going so far as to attack the messenger. They would actually prefer to see their ride go up in flames -- or their magazine fail -- than admit they'd been doing something wrong.

So be it. After leading the horse to water, the rest of the job is up to the horse.

-Bob Hoover

Thu Mar 06, 2008 6:48 am

Bob Hoover wrote: The last thing the editors wanted was some old phart pointing out that the cause -- and the cure -- of firey Volkswagens... -Bob Hoover

Thanks for tips on my fuel line/ boot setup. Your sound and respected advice is always appreciated here, even from an old phart :wink: :D .

Thu Mar 06, 2008 8:25 am

When I fixed my bug's fuel lines, it received a "through-fitting" in the firewall and I used a Napa 3206 filter(metal casing with raised areas in the nipples), mounted in a cushion lined clamp. Being mounted to the fan housing, on the suction side of the pump, it moves with the engine, and creates no movement of the hoses. The only movement of the hoses is between the "through-fitting" and the frame horn. I believe this addresses all the issues of relative movement between any parts of the car.
When I inspected this area of concern, I found no trace of the grommet and the steel pipe had a significant groove developing where it passed through the firewall. Caught in the nick of time.
Fred

Fri Apr 11, 2008 8:47 pm

Man i had no idea that a beetle could catch fire so easily i better do some up grades to save my ole beetle.

Thu Apr 24, 2008 9:45 pm

FLAMES SHOOTING FROM MY BAJA!!! I just brought home my baja last night, took it out today and had a friend video tape a run by the house...after looking at the vid I noticed FLAMES coming out the rear...I am honestly scared to turn it on...when I parked it everything was fine, but could the filter have caused this? Or is unburned gas escaping the pipe somehwere? I uploaded the video below, check it out.

Tue Apr 29, 2008 10:18 am

a battery box? I was just working on my 1969 bug and did not like the fact that the metal seat frame was so close to the battery's top posts.

Tue Apr 29, 2008 12:37 pm

VEEDubs wrote: FLAMES SHOOTING FROM MY BAJA!!! I just brought home my baja last night, took it out today and had a friend video tape a run by the house...after looking at the vid I noticed FLAMES coming out the rear...I am honestly scared to turn it on...when I parked it everything was fine, but could the filter have caused this? Or is unburned gas escaping the pipe somehwere? I uploaded the video below, check it out.
WTF

Tue Apr 29, 2008 9:01 pm

BrookShadow_RC wrote: a battery box? I was just working on my 1969 bug and did not like the fact that the metal seat frame was so close to the battery's top posts.

About 30 years ago, my first bug in highschool was a 68, it was running badly, so I took it to my mechanic cousin who said I'd be better off burning this POS, we laughed and headed off up a mountain road to a party - still wasn't running good, one heck of a miss. Halfway up the road, the back seat ignited, we threw it out, stomped on it to the laughter of a bunch of friends and realized that the terminals had shorted (causing the bad running earlier too!). From that point on, I knew bugs had a soul and that it's feelings were hurt by my cousin's comments. The bug was aptly nicknamed the "Fire Bug". Unfortunately, after more than a few harrowing moments, my brother blew up the engine a few months later and the rest is history.

Moral - change your fuel lines, clamp them good, move your filter and cover your battery - or get a short side terminal or an optima and mount it sideways.

Wed Apr 30, 2008 10:41 am

Yes, I had a 1969 bug in highschool (20+ years ago) and one day the fuel line slipped off the carb and caught fire. Luckily there were some folks at the park where this happened and one of the moms had a fire extinguisher and put the flames out.

After $200 bucks, she was back and running, with a 2 ft burn spot on the back. My nick name after that was "flaming beetle". I can laugh about it now, and try to prevent it from happening again!