TheSamba.com :: View topic - '70 Convertible

Fri Sep 23, 2005 9:44 am

Alright, Shmo... last night I went ahead with the BFH method of fabricating. God, I hate to do that, but.... you are right. After the shocks were installed you can hardly tell because it is all underneath. Hopefully I won't run into too many other situations on this car that requires smacking away with the BFH! :shock:

Fri Sep 23, 2005 10:11 pm

After making new spacer bushings, the shock mount fitting is done.

Fri Sep 23, 2005 10:17 pm

I know double shear is stronger than single shear, but would the top shock mounts be strong enough with the 1" diameter tubes removed? I had several fit issues due to the smaller tubes being welded in out of position. Grinding and bending just to barely get the bolts through. and some aren't parallel. I think I would actually enjoy cutting them out... but I like the way they look.

Fri Sep 23, 2005 10:19 pm

i would think so. dual shear is most important when you are using a coil-over shock and supporting the weight of the vehicle. when you are using torsion bars, they take up the weight and the shocks just dampen the movement.

Sat Sep 24, 2005 7:48 am

You can absolutely cut them out...if you ever have thoughts of going to coil over someday, you can always build something similar (that's straight) in no time.

Sat Sep 24, 2005 8:17 am

Did you all see that vert in the last issue of Hot VW (Sand Baja piece)? What are your collective thoughts on his outside-the-body upper coilover shock mounts? I mean, as best as you could tell from the small-ish picture. Would be nice to get them o/s to avoid squishing the little fingers of the back seat passengers (if the car is so set up).

Sat Sep 24, 2005 10:57 am

Back on the rear bump stops, I had someone recommend fabricating the bump stops so they contact the trailing arm outside the shock mounts, not inside. Obviously the inside location would be easier to fabricate due to the location of the existing cage tubes. Any thoughts on which location would be preferrable, and why? I was really leaning toward having them contact the arms inside of the shock mounts... still chewing on the design I guess. :roll:

Sat Sep 24, 2005 5:19 pm

I finished installing the shifter today. I also ground away the stock spring plate stops off of the castings to gain more travel before I fabricate my bump stops. So far I have 14" of travel, but that is without the CV's and axles installed. I have to clean and repack the CV's before putting the axles back in and check for binding in the CV's. I have read here on the board and heard elsewhere different amounts of angle for stock 930 CV's. McKenzie's told me 28 degrees was max, but I have read a post on here that said it was more like 24 degrees. I will post the angle numbers I can use without binding after I have the axles and CV's installed and measured.

Sat Sep 24, 2005 5:56 pm

if i'm not mistaken, 28 is for the race prepped 930, 24 is for stock. did mckenzies mention wether they were talking stock or not?

Sat Sep 24, 2005 8:14 pm

It was probably prepped... you know - old fart's syndrome... :oops:

Is there a way to tell if your CV's are race prepped by looking at them, or is it just by angle of travel?

Sun Sep 25, 2005 6:54 am

You can tell if they have been prepped. If there are no rough, sharp edges inside, they have been prepped. I think Brad put a link to cv prep under the sticky, look at how it was done, then look at yours, you should be able to tell. If yours were new, I would say that if you could move them REALLY easy, almost like they would fall apart if you did not handle them carefully, they are clearanced. If it's tough to move them at all, they are not.
If you have joints that have not been clearanced and you are measuring the axles angle with an angle finder, then your max is really going to be at around 21 or 22 degrees. You have to take in account how many degrees the axle go aft as well. For ever degree the axle goes aft, it counts as nearly a half of a degree in your maximum amount of angle. You probably already know this, I just wanted to make sure you didn't go too far, no reason to buy extra 930 joints if you don't have to.

Sun Sep 25, 2005 7:05 am

Thanks Scott... I will check out the other post, I hadn't seen it. I did know it's an accumulated angle, not just up and down.

Tue Sep 27, 2005 7:19 pm

So any opinions on the bump stop location? Inboard or outboard the bottom shock mounts? McKenzie's said they have seen guys end up with dented trailing arms running the bump stops to the inside. I think the cross section being narrower on the inside would be a stronger area, but it is closer to the mid point of the length of the arm. I am probably making this out to be more than it should be again...

Fri Sep 30, 2005 8:28 pm

Okay, not generating any responses to the bump stop question... so how about a dumb question!

Is there any difference between the inner and outer CV joints, or axles? Or can they be installed either way and it doesn't matter? I am installing them and they appear symetrical without doing any measuring. I have the 930 CV's and SAW's PowerBarz 2 axles... since this is my first IRS I am not very familiar with them... let the ribbing begin!

Fri Sep 30, 2005 8:51 pm

I have asked a few people about the correct rotation of the cv's and no one seems to know. Mine have a line around the CV on one side. The axles appear symetrical.

Fri Sep 30, 2005 9:24 pm

When I removed the CV's and axles I did not take the CV's off the axles. So, assuming that the PO had them on correct.... but what I was wondering is whether or not there is an inside and outside, since I didn't mark which CV came off of the trans and which came off the stub axle.

On another note - I bolted a 3' bar to the two lower engine mount holes across the bell housing to align my trans and weld the mounts. This enabled me to measure to the torsion tube, and vertically, to get the trans in straight. I did this without the axles installed. Now that I have them in, and the bolts look like they are at the same position in the spring plate slots, it appears like one axle has more fore/aft angle than the other. I know I should get the wheels on and set the alignment/toe first, but I thought they would look the same at this point. Sometimes I think I dwell too much on small details....

Fri Sep 30, 2005 10:17 pm

It sounds like you are like me and over think everything. I sit and think about everything I do. I sometimes make drawings etc. Funny thing is 90% of the time I do it differently when I actually start doing it.

CHeck that you didnt overlook the simple stuff..like is everyhting fully seated (diagonals into the pivots, cv's into stubs etc.)

BTW--Where did you get your transmission mid mount. I'm going to go that route. I swore I was done buying VW parts, but I think it might be a good idea for me to put that mount in.

Fri Sep 30, 2005 10:47 pm

The mid mount at the bell housing came with the car when I bought it. The one near the nose I bought from McKenzie's. Their stuff is pricey at times, but I live 3 miles from their shop. Sometimes convenience wins over price when the quality is the same...

I have had many nights of staring and sketching instead of working. Still doing that with the bump stops!

Sat Oct 01, 2005 12:05 am

CV's are all the same, but I always mark them so they always go back in the same location. I used machine stamps. Same with the axles. I took mine apart after every race to get the cages mag partical inspected, so having them marked made the reassembly easier.
The grove on the CV goes into the flange, (stub and trans).

As far as your bump stops go, inboard of your lower shock mount.

Sat Oct 01, 2005 9:07 pm

I cut off the 1" tube supports for the top shock mounts. The rear suspension in assembled without torsion bars to test the measure the travel...

The shifter is in and working, above the tunnel.

I have tie downs supporting the rear suspension while I fabricate the bump stop and limit strap mounts.