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Wed Dec 21, 2005 9:07 pm

hi, um, I don't quite know where to post this, but the vw bus'es came with 3 speed fully automatics right? some of them any way. I would like to adapt a 3 speed auto to a corvair engine, but I don't want to trans rotate the corvair engine to run clockwise (they normaly run counterclockwise for those who don't know) Is it possible to do this? any one know? I need some help, if you can't please tell me who can, thanks

Wed Dec 21, 2005 9:20 pm

I wonder if the vw transmision and transaxle could handle the corvair engine? if you could trans rotate the vw transaxle, wouldnt the transmission run the same way?

Wed Dec 21, 2005 10:10 pm

would a transmission rebuilder or machine shop be able to modify and build the transmission and transaxle to my needs? any input?

Thu Dec 22, 2005 12:34 am

A few thoughts -
There are two components to the VW Vanagon Automatic. The transmission itself, and a differential. They do not share fluids. As far as I am aware the differential's ring gear can be flipped to the opposite side of the housing to reverse it's rotation just like with VW's 4 speed manual transaxles. What's wrong the original Corvair auto? Don't like 2 speeds? GM over the years has manufactured a number of auto transaxles in 2,3, and 4 speeds, with both hydromechanically and electronically controlled valve bodies. Some models are capable of long and reliable service behind 500hp engines, utilizing the TH400 and 4L80E gears and clutch packs, others are more compact. One of interest could be found in a special edition of the early 80's Chevy Citation called the 'X-11" It's light and compact, shifts promptly and firmly, and could take anything a Corvair Turbo motor could ever dish out. I should think one of these would be cheaper and easier to adapt since it would undoubtedly bolt right up to the Corvair case. You'll just have to figure out the proper flex plate to use.

. . .Well I guess there was SOMETHING in there about Vanagons - sorry there, guys

Merry Christmas to all, by the way! :D

Thu Dec 22, 2005 1:13 am

Zerko
Brotha the chev 2 speed is bullit proof, one of the best built.
Leave it alone man, it all just good there. :D

Thu Dec 22, 2005 6:38 am

Like stated above you probably could flip the diff just like what is normally done to run RDX boxes/mid engines etc.. and what they did back in the day for the corvair conversions. The other option would be to scrounge up the cam etc.. that they used to enable the corvair motor to run in the correct (for VW) direction. I think theres a guy in Michigan thats a big corvair/buggy guy, I bet he could steer you in the right direction, and I belive that the 3 speed autos are pretty tough units themselves, there is some info out there on modifiying the govener etc.. that I have seen. I have also heard rurmor that they are being used in some high horspower buggies as well allthough I don't know what sort of mods are used/needed.
My dad ran Corvair engines on our airboats back in the late '70's when ! was a wee little fella, But that was when corvairs were plentiful.

Thu Dec 22, 2005 8:15 am

Ask your question on the Baywindow forum, I think there are a few people over there that still know about corvair conversions.
Myself I've never heard of anyone converting a Vanagon to a corvair engine, even an aircooled.
http://www.type2.com/library/enginem/corvair.htm

Thu Dec 22, 2005 2:46 pm

thanks everyone for their input, I appreciate it. the reason I am trying to do this is, my mother just recently purchased a 1965 corvair coupe, it is an automatic with a 110 hp motor, she has also purchased a 180 turbo motor for it, which I am going to put a CO Judson Supercharger on, well they never made a turbo with an automatic due to over heating issues, and the corvair powerglide won't perform right and just can't take it, she does not want to learn to drive stick, so what I am thinking is, get a three speed and try it out? sound pretty good to me? if it works it works if not she'll just have to learn to drive stick or settle for a 140, but like I said thanks for the input, if ahve any more feel free to keep posting, Merry Christmas all!

Thu Dec 22, 2005 4:14 pm

I was just informed by Kennedy Engineered Products,

http://kennedyeng.com

that if you modify the transmission it won't run right, so I guess I will have to modify my engine to run clockwise like the Volkswagen, thanks everyone for their help and god bless, have a Merry Christmas Everyone!!

Fri Dec 23, 2005 11:01 am

One thing you might look into is running an Audi 5000 turbo (or non turbo) automatic transmission. It is like the Vanagon automatic, except it faces the other way. If it were to be mounted turned around in the rear, normally it would have three speeds backwards and one forward. But if the shaft were to be turned the other way, it seems that it would end up with three forward speeds. In theory this sounds right. I have no idea if the hypoid ring and pinion gears like to be run backwards or not, but maybe worth some thinking about.

David Clymer

Sat Dec 24, 2005 4:07 pm

thanks, I'll be sure to take a look into this, it might work, from what year?

Sat Dec 24, 2005 6:00 pm

About that Audi automatic, a buddy of mine worked at Andial Porsche at the time those transmissions entered the market. He believe he was doing testing and analysis for Audi. I had asked him recently what could be done to beef up the VW Vanagon auto in anticipation for the Subaru EZ30 conversion I want to do. He mentioned that the clutches and other components from the mid 80s’ Audi were beefier and interchangeable into the VW auto’s housing. Interesting, I had never heard this before. Other than being a bit noisy, the VW auto is a pretty good little transmission if you keep it’s temperature down.
On another tack, had you thought of electronically controlling a manual transmission? Electronic clutches are pretty cool. This would rob you of less horsepower, make less heat, allow you a selection of cheap gears, and maintain the advantages that the standard box otherwise has over an automatic in slaloms and road course work. It’s the only way to fly if you’re doing autocross or Rallies.
Oh, and no "learning the clutch" :D

Sat Dec 24, 2005 8:35 pm

Zerk-shane wrote: thanks, I'll be sure to take a look into this, it might work, from what year?

Any Audi 5000/100/200 3 speed automatic from 78-91 would share the Vanagon automatic section but with a reversed ring and pinion and a different housing. The 1984 and newer cars have taller final drives: 3.73:1 for the non-turbo, and 3.08:1 for the turbo. The earlier cars have very short final drives, so I'd avoid those. Keep us posted. I'd be interested to hear how your conversion works out. BTW, what will you use to adapt the Corvair engine to the Vanagon (or Audi) bellhousing?

Phil G: Yes, I'd always heard that the Audi turbo automatic had stronger internals than the Vanagon automatic. Back in the 1980s Oettinger in Germany built 3.2 liter Wasserboxer 6 cylinder Vanagons that all came linked to a Vanagon automatic differential housing and an Audi turbo automatic section. However, there are people on the Subaru/vanagon list that swear the Vanagon and Audi automatics are identical internally. I actually will be building an EZ30 Vanagon (already have the engine) and will be going this Audi automatic route. Now if I could just get ahold of the specially made 3.08:1 final drive Oettinger was using in those trannys. I think 4.09:1 is going to be way too low geared for such a powerful engine.

Sat Dec 24, 2005 10:35 pm

the Audi Turbo autos had 2 additional clutch bands in them compared to the Vanagon or non-turbo Audis, for additional holding power. I know because I have one to put in my 3.3L H6 conversion, with a modified torque converter.

John
Aircooled.Net Inc.

Sat Dec 24, 2005 11:21 pm

Excellent feedback on the VW/Audi differences. Good to know about the final ratios and extra clutches. Really nice to know others are going the 3.3 route also. Honk and wave as you slip by at 100, I'll know who you are . . :D I was planning on using a friend with a wholesale license to get me into the Country Club and Kade auctions here in Southern California where all the insurance companies and banks ditch their wrecks, repos, theft recoveries and so on with the hope of finding a complete car. I can get all the odd bits like the muffler valve in one shot that way. Are you sending your harness to Small Car for modifications or doing that yourself? I'll be taking the slow route - 1 or 2 years - to get everything together before the deed, since this car at 84k mi. runs pretty good as is. I've got a boat to finish and two other drastic car projects right now. The Subaru EZ30 would be a pretty cool power plant for the Corvair. Talk about light-years ahead of the original motor . . Imagine that with an auto clutch and paddle shifter - look out 911's. A guy I know just finished another interesting conversion - a 3.4 liter 993 Porsche motor into a 64' 356C. He's already stomped an SC down on Coast Hwy. last week - ya' gotta love old sleepers. My oldest brother used to make a living building stockcar engines. Many years ago he did one of the transverse smallblock conversions in his Corsa. He used a Corvette 3-duce 327 that later had four 48IDA's on a Formula 5000 manifold and it was just awesome! It's a shame that such a nice little car came with such crap engines. I've owned two of the Turbos, and a few others. They are so 'Bangin' rocks together' compared to engines these days, but I guess there's the original equipment issue the collector types would worry about when the subject of conversions came up.
Ok, gotta go put out cookies and milk for Santa - cheers.

Sun Dec 25, 2005 1:13 pm

john@aircooled.net wrote: the Audi Turbo autos had 2 additional clutch bands in them compared to the Vanagon or non-turbo Audis, for additional holding power. I know because I have one to put in my 3.3L H6 conversion, with a modified torque converter.

John
Aircooled.Net Inc.

Thanks for the clarification, John. I'm glad to know the turbo transmission does indeed have more holding power and that it's not just the same exact trans as the Vanagons have. Are you using the stock final drive ratio with your EG33?

Phil: I'll be having the harness made up rather than doing it myself. From what I've seen, making up the harness is a realistic undertaking for anyone who can read the wiring diagrams and has conceptual knowledge of the Subaru engine management system and the Vanagon chassis electricals. However, it's time consuming, and with the EZ30 I'll be spending plenty of time designing a good rear mount design (Porsche 996 mounts) and a way of supporting the rear muffler.

As far as I know, only one EZ30 (3.0 from Legacy Outback) has been done so far, as opposed to the EG33 (3.3 liter from SVX) which has been done many times, so the conversion parts don't really exist

BTW, did I understand you correctly that your Vanagon has only 88,000 miles? Sounds like you have a tight and original van.

Dave Clymer