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Thu May 24, 2007 1:26 pm

kimosullivan wrote: EZGZ wrote: Germany is a land locked country and had little or no oil resources of their own.

Germany is not land locked. Germany borders both the North Sea and the Baltic Sea. Magnesium is primarily produced by electrolysis of magnesium chloride recovered from sea water.

They only found oil in the North Sea in the 70's, Germany had no oil this is why they wanted Africa and russ as they had lot of oil, but then vw did not make a lot of vw back then, and the technology back then to make
lots of aluminium or the material to do it, that is way lot of plans of the time where made out of wood and canvas .....................................................................................................................................................................................................
A vw engine was only made to do 100 thousand miles then bin it and to have 25hp or up to 50 hp so there was no need for a aluminium case.......and over time more aluminium has gone in to the as41 case this is why they have got heavier over time and have more aluminium then the old as21 case had ...Time to bin that gene berg book and (move on}......................................................................................................................................................................................................
The Aluminium case's are good but they are sand cast and not pressure cast like mag case's are, if they did make a pressure cast Aluminium case it would be the best case... this is why you do not see a type 4 sand cast case as it is pressure cast, if they made a mix Aluminium case and harden it like they do to jet engine parts and to turbo trim blades, we would only be talking about how to tig it :?: but at the end of the day the old vw market is small, so we can only have a sand cast case ..that is stronger and heavy but brittle or a mag case that is flexey but will crack over time and is soft..........(a no win)..........

Thu Jul 26, 2007 3:59 pm

more on that case that i received..... it is AE166769 and other numbers on side of case are 111-101-101-b and 111-101-102-c .....

anyways is that yet a "good" as41 case.....

my plan with this case would be a 2332/2276.... i would send it to rimco most likley.....

questions now..

1st is it worth it...(case work fine for what i want)

2nd would it be any better then an alum case that is clearanced out and bored out for like 500 bucks....

3rd im hoping for aleast 150-180 hp maybe 200+ someday.......

just really wondering if it would be worth investing machine work in this case (pending it hasnt been abused,align bored alot etc)

Thu Jul 26, 2007 4:00 pm

also glenn is the as41 case marked AE something still decent...

Thu Jul 26, 2007 6:10 pm

bump.. no comments... glenn u around... im calling you out!! lol jk

Thu Jul 26, 2007 8:47 pm

A good AE case is good. Does that help? ;)

Thu Jul 26, 2007 8:57 pm

sure but doesnt answer all of my questions.... i mean is it worth sticking machining time and cost into it or would i be better off buying a new alm case that is already ready....

plan to build either a 1914 or 2276.. maybe 2332 i want something that will with stand 180-200+hp....

Fri Jul 27, 2007 3:18 am

bpritchert87 wrote: also glenn is the as41 case marked AE something still decent...
An AE case is a 1600 without case savers. Personally I'd rather use a AH case, but you can get case savers installed.

bpritchert87 wrote: bump.. no comments... glenn u around... im calling you out!! lol jk
BTW, I don't rear every post. And calling me out is a bad idea ;).

Fri Jul 27, 2007 6:32 am

lol thanks... i suppose i could have them installed.... and i was just given ya crap... lol i know that you too have a life and dont always sit on here....

Sun Sep 16, 2007 1:08 am

I will post some figures when I can find them, but there was a mis-understanding over the AS41 case re-introduction. It had been reported by Marnal at the time that it was a new alloy composition (which it was, after AS21); however that is not the case. After a fire at VW Mexico's foundry, production of cases moved solely to VW Brazil. VW Mexico was however the main purchaser, and was ever price conscious. VWB wanted to introduce a new alloy, AS41B which was stronger than AS21, but this would have cost more, and VWM were not prepared to pay for this - This was at a time that everything on the Mexican built bug that could be removed to save costs was (rear heating, chrome trim, screen vents...). VWB have confirmed that the new AS41 case has the same alloy content as the old AS41 version, and if anyone should know it's them (although, different people, different story..).

It would be interesting if someone could contact VWB and see if they would consider a run of AS41B cases (properly machined!), as VWM is no longer buying in bulk for engine production.

I was always told that aluminum cases were a waste of time as they weighed twice as much without the benefit of being heat treated (again, to save $).

Fri Sep 21, 2007 10:17 pm

Quote: They only found oil in the North Sea in the 70's, Germany had no oil this is why they wanted Africa and russ as they had lot of oil, but then vw did not make a lot of vw back then, and the technology back then to make
lots of aluminium or the material to do it, that is way lot of plans of the time where made out of wood and canvas

I know this is straying off topic, but, the Hall-Héroult process was introduced in 1886 which made massed produced aluminium a possibility. Germany had become the world leader in aluminum production durring Adolf Hitler's rise to power. This was mostly for aircraft production. But as the war expanded, they suffered shortages of critical resources, like petroleum and aluminum. One of the reasons for blitzkreig was the inability of the Wehrmact to sustain an protracted campaign.

Sat Oct 06, 2007 1:32 pm

About the Aluminum Cases fro Autolinia in Brazil.
The reason that they started making the Aluminum Cases is
1. The magnesium for the cases was the only use of Magnesium in their foundry.
2. They wanted to Elliminate the magnesium due to the fire risk and to reduce overall operating costs.
3. Most of the new cases being ordered were going to the USA for Aftermarket purposes and were being redesigned to the customers requirements. Many of the new requirements could not be met using Magnisium. Too much shrinkage ...

All the Autolinia cases are cast in Perminant metal molds.

I buy the cases from Autolinia and build 2332's for use in Industrial machinery for mining. They run at about 125-150 HP all day long 24 hours per dayat 5500-RPM parts wear expecially the lifters and cams but the cases have little problems. They do weigh twice as much as the Magnesium ones but the Magnesium cases wont be available long so ..... Get used to it. It is a strong case. save some weight somewhere else...

Jim

Fri Nov 02, 2007 7:42 pm

Can any1 answer me if the Autolinea (1600cc stock) Al case is a bad choice for a 1955cc (90,5x76) Turbo EFI with about 350 hp?!
Here the AS41 cases are more expensive than Autolinea's aluminium cases...so i'm thinking about to get an AL case!

Thanks

Sun Nov 04, 2007 8:42 pm

no one?!

Mon Nov 05, 2007 10:36 pm

I used the auto linea supercase for my 1915.I got mine in march had no probs with the build.Motor is in a buggy.

they seemto be working out fine now from waht i have been told.

Tue Nov 06, 2007 2:26 pm

77charger wrote: I used the auto linea supercase for my 1915.I got mine in march had no probs with the build.Motor is in a buggy.

they seemto be working out fine now from waht i have been told.

Thanks, dude!
I'm thinking about get a AL case, but i have heard bad things about its...

Cheers!

Tue Nov 06, 2007 8:07 pm

I dont know about the standard alm case.went with the supercase cause of what you get for the price.If you buy the standard case and have it machined it will probably cost more.And in the future i want to go stroker crank.

I did read alot of bad when they first came out so i was leary at first but talked with the guys at vw parts and they pointed out the improvements and told me what the previous problems were(there were more than a few).And that by that time they were finally on track and workin out good and was told they are sellin alot more of them(i paid 480 for mine in march they are 600 now!)said expect another one soon I missed the old 525.00 price by 2 days!!

I had dropped off a case this week at rimco to see if it was salvagable it wasnt i asked the guy at rimco what he thought about the alm cases now he said they are working out good too and strong.He said just check and make sure everything is deburred and no loose shavings(both not a prob on the last 2 i bought).But told me the first ones were very bad.

Should state also that when assembled i had alot of deck height around .145 with A pistons and a 69mm crank.I had the bottom of barrels trimmed at heads up performance to lower the deck height(i think around.095?).They told me that the raised rood cases have more meat on the cylinder surface so you dont have to use as many/thicker shims for a stroker motor.I tried it with a 90.5 piston and cylinder and the deck height was around .075 with an A piston.

go figure

Thu Nov 22, 2007 1:19 am

Hello,

a simple? question to other alu case owners:

I have a CB alu case with 1/2"x20 case saver threads.

(My dealer delivered it without case savers. He told me, the delivered ones were wrong and now i`m waiting 4 weeks.....)

Is that normal? CB doesn`t offer 1/2"x20 case savers as spare, only the 12 and 14mm.

Thanks,
Wolfgang

Mon Nov 26, 2007 1:47 am

Hello again,

wanna warn everyone with a alu case!!! (indifferent CB/Empi/bugpack)

Every oil bore for the main bearings is out of line to the bearing bores/grooves.
It seems, the cnc-programmer made it vice versa, because if you put the bearings "wrong" in, it fits!!!!!!! :shock:

Check that and enlarge the bore, before you assemble your case!

Otherwise your main bearings and your cam/lifter could die because of lack of oil.

Wolfgang

Wed Feb 06, 2008 12:00 am

It's my understanding that the AS41 was used from the early days IE 25hp thru 1974 & then in 75 with EFI & higher oil temps from pollution standards & running them leaner & hotter...VW went to a Stronger AS21& is the best case for the mag cases in my opinion is the thickwall back#3 made in germany! the as21 is made to handel hotter operating temp's don't know what those numbers are but I always go with...185-190 Great...200-210 warm time to back off...225 plus your asking for problems...250+ your toast! & i can remember seeing a VW service notes saying the AS41 will lose there strenght? IE soften due to heat anealed...best case for the HP engines...In my opinion...two piece ARPM...put's the the Brailzian Alum. ones to shame...those are soft...I have seen early & I have a CB pent roof & the stuff is soft compared to alloy used in ARPM's case which I think has a higher copper content...pure aluminium is very soft..that's called 1100 & when you get into the 7071 it's tuff but welding can be a problem...So my VOTE is ARPM old school Berg crank IE swedish Forging & case hardened & Jet rods Forged titanium....but it still boils down to use ? I'm going with the best of the best in my mind which is Nickies 95MM & 86 berg crank & an nice set of factory heads welded...because the amount cooling fins & exhaust port boss is still there!!! & with bronze alloy seats mild cam lifts with ratio rockers & Amsoil...cuz they still have a lot of proper additives for flat tappets cams....this why a lot of cams "possibly" went flat in past years...also bad Rockwell Hardness testing did catch the batch from Scat??? but that's another story....just my two cents worth...work for VW back in the day...1969-1973 IE was the greese monkey @ the local dealer when in hi-school...plus there was an old German "head wrench" that took under his wing...he trained @ wolfsberg.....so it goes... :?: :?

Thu Feb 07, 2008 8:56 pm

Not quite right about the Magnesium.
The Letters mean "A" Magnesium/ Aluminum alloy "S" is for silicon. 4 is 4% aluminum and 1 is for 1% silicon.
Both alloys are still available and have working temperature ratings of up to 300F degrees for AS-21 and about 290F for AS-41.
AS-41 is a stronger alloy but AS-21 has more ductility and more heat conductivity. You would have to keep the 300F for at least an hour for any detrimental effect to take place.
Neither alloy is normally heat treated. Both cary F designations to be used as fabricated.

There are many Magnesium alloys with temperature ratings exceeding 600F and up to twice the compressive and tensil strength.