TheSamba.com :: View topic - Drive your own damn car and stop back seat drivin' mine!

Sun Jan 06, 2008 11:53 pm

I am pretty new to the world of VW and have found it to be quite an interesting, fun, exciting, frustrating, disappointing and a constantly learning experience (in other words a great new hobby). I am a fan of this site and have received help several times when I got stuck from other members here. I think everyone here is great and what a wonderful forum this is for people who are VW enthusiast.
At this point you are probably wondering what the subject of this post has to do with my statements so far. Well I have an opinion about a person's car and the journey you take with it to whatever extent of restoration you aspire to. And my opinion put simply is, IT IS YOUR CAR!. You are working on it for yourself. It is something you should do so the final result is a car that makes you happy. And it shouldn't make one damn bit of difference what anyone else thinks about how it will look!
I see too many posts where people are excited about trying some new custom look on their car (like new dash, after-market seats or custom body work etc) and they are looking for some advice on how to achieve that look. The post I read do not ask how someone thinks this mod might look, just for some help on how they can achieve it. More often than not they are met with jeers and insults as to how stupid an idea it is or how bad it would look. You know what I have to say to those people, IT IS NOT YOUR CAR! You are not the ones who will be driving it, you don't have to have it in your garage. If you don't have anything nice to say, don't say anything at all.
And to all the people who lament the mutilation of a rare car, get over it- IT IS NOT YOUR CAR! If you want to have a rare car restored to factory specs with all numbers matching parts completely original, I say more power to you. I love the look of a classic in original condition, but that is your individual choice. Personally I find a lot of the original things on my bug to be ugly and a places for improvement. My 73 super is going to get highly changed with all kinds of crazy extras and custom modifications, and if I had a 1950 split window instead of the 73 super you better believe I would still be doing the same thing! A car is a thing, it is meant to be used and enjoyed. Do whatever you have to to get the most enjoyment you can out of it.
Don't listen to the haters who say you will only be devaluing the car by making outlandish modifications. SO WHAT! The car is your toy, not your investment. Anyone who is building their dream car is not doing it for the money, especially if they want to make it a driver. If your financial future hinges on your ability to re-sell your VW at a profit then you are probably going to find yourself in troubled waters down the road (I put you in the same category as all the comic book guys who are convinced that their collection is an investment that they will someday reap a windfall on).
I know this seems a rant, but it is not. It is just my way of supporting everyone and all their dreams of the future of that special VW. Just putting my opinion out there and lending my support to all you builders in the VW world. It is a great hobby, with a great community and we should all support each other.
Please feel free to comment on this. Tell me yea! I feel you brother! Or tell me I have no idea about what I am talking about! Hell Feel free to tell me this whole thread is a pile of shit and waste of time if you need to.
Finally, please post pictures of you cars here. I love all the varieties and variations of form and function that the old Bug has gone through. I love the completely classic to the completely out there. Let's see some diversity! And when my wallet catches up to my dreams and I finally get mine finished up the way I want, I will post some picts myself.

Mon Jan 07, 2008 12:13 am

Mon Jan 07, 2008 12:51 am

my best friend is into old domestic cars. has a 52 chevy. he's a purist. i'm not. i want to change MOST things on my car, he wants to keep his all original. we've gotten into arguments over it. but we ALWAYS end on "Well, its your car" or "to each his own" and its all good.

i love going to car shows, not just VWs. all kinds. and i can really appreciate the hard work, money, and time people put into their vehicles. race cars, classics, muscle cars, VWs, choppers, sport bikes, harleys, lowriders, ricers. whatever. like you said. its YOUR vision. your an artist and the car is your canvas. your a director and the car is your film. etc.

that said, here are my two VWs, all 100% stock original everything...can't you tell? :wink:

peace

Mon Jan 07, 2008 12:56 am

nice square man , i dig the stripe

Mon Jan 07, 2008 1:05 am

thanks.

do you like my upside down bumper?

Mon Jan 07, 2008 1:13 am

i agree in the whole "its your car, do what you want" idea. which is an idea and philisophy that i practice. however there is alot one can gain from others experiences, who may have learned the hard way, as to what works and what doesn't.

also there is the just plain rediculous out there, see the abortion thread in readers rides section for plently of examples.

i will still laugh and point (in good fun) at things that i consider ridiculous, unsafe, or just plain dumb. it helps if i can talk to the owner of a particluar car and inform him about some of the things he may have done to his car that could be achieved in a better, safer or more efficiant way (or any combonation thereof). if the individual doesnt want the advice or chooses to ignore it, that is his or her perogotive, and i wont try to force the issue.

a few examples of what i mean, i have a buddy who has slammed the shit out of his bug. he likes it, i think it looks dumb. nothing against lowered cars (and i do have plans to lower mine in the near future), but his is way to low to be praticle in my opnion, expecially since it is his daily driver. he knows how i feel and he likes his car the way it is, more power to him. that didnt stop my from laughing my ass off when he got hung up on a driveway on a recent club cruise. he was literally stuck. also i have another buddy who purchased his car with a mild 1776 engine in it. it had alot of the tradional cheapie go-fast goodies on it, including an aftermarket fan shroud. after i (and a few others from my club) explained to him the cooling benifits of a stock doghouse and the ineffecincy of the aftermarket shroud he decided it was better to run a stock shroud. so a few of us from the club gave him a hand to help him convert over to the doghouse. with his shroud off and the stock shroud both in hand we showed him exactly what we were talking about regarding the cooling vanes and what not. he appreciated the advice given, and in myopnion, did the smart thing to help his engine cool better and hopefully live a longer life.

Mon Jan 07, 2008 1:55 am

"Or tell me I have no idea about what I am talking about! Hell Feel free to tell me this whole thread is a pile of shit and waste of time if you need to. "

This whole thread is a pile of shit. LOL Just kidding. I liked this sentence best though. Shows you can take it as well as dish it out.

You have to expect opinions as this is a public forum. I just hate it when it descends into poor manners and hurtful comments. I just had to explain to one guy the difference between arguing and debating. Generally I find young guys argue while more "mature" guys debate.

Mon Jan 07, 2008 2:30 am

very well said mac-vw
Im all for the indivuality aspect of customising ur own vw
i love to see customised splits even tho the purists say leave them original....
id like to see more hebs on 17s lowered slightly with different painthjobs
but i also really appreiciate a well restored stocky be it an oval or 75 super
it just makes me laugh when i see a post about some asking what sort of rims they should get or what colour to paint
if u havent got ur own ideas in mind that u like urself theres a prob
alot of ppl dont like my bugs, well pffft to them theyre mine and how i like them and i know im not gonna see others done the same
its when they all start looking the same u just shake ur head and think why
i mean no offence to the rat freaks amonst us but comeon how many earlys with faded peeling paintjobs slammed on stupidly narrow frontends with radars does it take for a look to get old
really makes me think of this pic

Mon Jan 07, 2008 4:50 am

Yep, well stated mac-vw.
I'm not one to tell others how they should do their rides. At the same time if I don't like the way they have it done I'm not going to suggest changes. Nor will I change my plans for my ride based on their outlook on it.

Mon Jan 07, 2008 4:50 am

I couldn't have said it better myself. This is a great site but it makes be crazy how some people can't just live and let live.

Mon Jan 07, 2008 5:18 am

I've been on internet forums for many years. I am a moderator at a popular Harley forum. I see all types and they are the same on all the boards I visit. People aren't going to change. When you post a question or a topic, you are going to get all sorts of responses. Even if you ask to not get certain responses. You will get them anyways.

I just post my question, wait for the responses to pile up, ask a few more questions, weed thru all the bullshit, pick out the responses that are helpful, and move on.

What is bothersome, is when you ask a specific question, expecting a response from certain individuals, and get blown off for some reason. You know they are reading your posts, but for some unknown reason, they choose to not respond.

Mon Jan 07, 2008 6:08 am

mac-vw wrote: I am pretty new to the world of VW and have found it to be quite an interesting, fun, exciting, frustrating, disappointing and a constantly learning experience (in other words a great new hobby). I am a fan of this site and have received help several times when I got stuck from other members here. I think everyone here is great and what a wonderful forum this is for people who are VW enthusiast.
At this point you are probably wondering what the subject of this post has to do with my statements so far. Well I have an opinion about a person's car and the journey you take with it to whatever extent of restoration you aspire to. And my opinion put simply is, IT IS YOUR CAR!. You are working on it for yourself. It is something you should do so the final result is a car that makes you happy. And it shouldn't make one damn bit of difference what anyone else thinks about how it will look!
I see too many posts where people are excited about trying some new custom look on their car (like new dash, after-market seats or custom body work etc) and they are looking for some advice on how to achieve that look. The post I read do not ask how someone thinks this mod might look, just for some help on how they can achieve it. More often than not they are met with jeers and insults as to how stupid an idea it is or how bad it would look. You know what I have to say to those people, IT IS NOT YOUR CAR! You are not the ones who will be driving it, you don't have to have it in your garage. If you don't have anything nice to say, don't say anything at all.
And to all the people who lament the mutilation of a rare car, get over it- IT IS NOT YOUR CAR! If you want to have a rare car restored to factory specs with all numbers matching parts completely original, I say more power to you. I love the look of a classic in original condition, but that is your individual choice. Personally I find a lot of the original things on my bug to be ugly and a places for improvement. My 73 super is going to get highly changed with all kinds of crazy extras and custom modifications, and if I had a 1950 split window instead of the 73 super you better believe I would still be doing the same thing! A car is a thing, it is meant to be used and enjoyed. Do whatever you have to to get the most enjoyment you can out of it.
Don't listen to the haters who say you will only be devaluing the car by making outlandish modifications. SO WHAT! The car is your toy, not your investment. Anyone who is building their dream car is not doing it for the money, especially if they want to make it a driver. If your financial future hinges on your ability to re-sell your VW at a profit then you are probably going to find yourself in troubled waters down the road (I put you in the same category as all the comic book guys who are convinced that their collection is an investment that they will someday reap a windfall on).
I know this seems a rant, but it is not. It is just my way of supporting everyone and all their dreams of the future of that special VW. Just putting my opinion out there and lending my support to all you builders in the VW world. It is a great hobby, with a great community and we should all support each other.
Please feel free to comment on this. Tell me yea! I feel you brother! Or tell me I have no idea about what I am talking about! Hell Feel free to tell me this whole thread is a pile of shit and waste of time if you need to.
Finally, please post pictures of you cars here. I love all the varieties and variations of form and function that the old Bug has gone through. I love the completely classic to the completely out there. Let's see some diversity! And when my wallet catches up to my dreams and I finally get mine finished up the way I want, I will post some picts myself.

Please do and post them in the correct forum... Reader's Rides :wink:

Mon Jan 07, 2008 7:55 am

mac, I have to agree that the car belongs to it's owner and therefore is his to do what he wants.

Often times the folks asking for opinions or how to do things are asking because they don't know the answers. And they don't know whats involved. The beauty of this forum is that you can get everyone's opinions, insight, knowledge, expertise and stupidity and then choose for your self which way you want to go.

There are a lot of young folks on here that are just starting out in the car scene or with VW's and they don't have alot (or any) money to spend. But they have big dreams and think it's easy to just drop the axe on the car and end up with a show winning concourse car.

Sometimes it's good to point out to these folks that it is a lot of work and a big expense to achieve the goal they have in mind. And sometimes, you just have to point out that they are dreaming so far out in left field that it just isn't going to happen.

A 63 VW with a 1776 and dual carbs that has been slammed will never win the 24 hours of Lemans. It will never win an SCCA championship and it will never win a regional race of any standing. So, would we be doing that owner a favor by encouraging him to give it a try?

Or how about encouraging some 15 year old kid that has a roll of duct tape and a hack saw...Should we encourage him to hack the roof off his oval and secure it with tape because he wants a chop top?

And once in a while there are the guys who want to run an open stinger and make a lot of noise and just be a menence to society. And while this may sound like fun when you are doing it, it is a big annoyance to other folks who may go out of their way to get the old cars off the streets. Politicians listen to respectable citizens and the rest get shafted.

It only takes the unsafe actions of a few to create head aches for the rest of us.

I'm not saying don't customize your ride any way you want. I'm just saying we should encourage each other to do it right and in a way that won't end up with the car being carted off to the masher because someone got in over their head.

And we should do our best to let guys know what the real cost of some of these modifications are.

I get a lot of grief from the guys who like to run them low. This is because I think we need to point out to the guy who has $100 in his pocket and wants to slam his car, that he doesn't have enough money to do it. It takes more then just bolting on a lowered beam.

I'm not trying to tell anyone not to do it, I just want them to understand they may need to spend a lot more money to get the results they are after. And if they don't have the funds, skills and tools to do it, they will end up with a mess.

Some modifications can be made in steps as you have the money to do them and some should be fully completed before trying to roll your project.

So all in all, I think it's good that we have people on here with differing opinions and different experiences. Listen, learn and take what works for you.

But most of all, enjoy your ride and the experiences it brings you.

Don't get angry with those that don't agree with you. Try to understand where they are coming from and why they have the opinion they have. It may just be BS, or it may save you from a lot of head aches. If you listen to what they have to say and think about it, then you can decide for your self which way you want to go.

And in the end, you are the one who has to live with the results. And you are the one who has to fund the project. Sometimes we fall short of our goals, but if we can still have fun and not put others at risk, who cares?

Mon Jan 07, 2008 8:33 am

Words of wisdom, drscope. You hit the nail on the head, to the point where I have nothing to add. 8)

Mon Jan 07, 2008 8:54 am

without pics this thread is useless.

Mon Jan 07, 2008 12:10 pm

mac-vw wrote:
Finally, please post pictures of you cars here. I love all the varieties and variations of form and function that the old Bug has gone through. I love the completely classic to the completely out there. Let's see some diversity! And when my wallet catches up to my dreams and I finally get mine finished up the way I want, I will post some picts myself.
I have to say that this is one of the better threads I have come across in awhile...
While it's true these are our cars and we have the right to do anything we please with them, I still believe we have to be responsible caretakers of our Vw's and act as positive representatives of our hobby. As it was pointed out by some of the other posters, some of the rides that are "created" can IMO really cause headaches for the hobby as a whole. I'm speaking of legislation that restricts the hobby to the point where it may not exsist.
One of my favorite examples is a co-worker who has a huge "PowerStroke" deisel pickup. He has converted it to the point that it looks like one of those huge " Monster" trucks that you see crushing cars. He drives it everyday and has an 40 mile one-way commute. I asked him how gets the truck to belch the jet black smoke from the stacks he installed in the bed behind the cab. He said diesel is propane injected and accounts for the plume of smoke he loves so much. I can tell you for sure he does not give a damn what anyone thinks! Might his actions affect how the general public views the hobby which include our beloved VW's ? I think so.
So, mac-vw, what is your VW dream? Although it would hurt through to the soul to sell my Ghia to someone that might cut it into a Baha, it would be that new owners right to do so. However, that new owner should have the maturity not to interfered with the general publics' ability to peacfully co-exsist. So in a nutshell, yes you can do whatever floats your boat. But there might just be consequences.

Sorry I was a bit long winded and by the way here's another a pic of my Ghia, built just the way I wanted it 8)

Mon Jan 07, 2008 12:24 pm

Shouldn't this be in the Rants?

Mon Jan 07, 2008 1:27 pm

here here!

Mon Jan 07, 2008 1:50 pm

Well this is getting more attention than I thought it would. It is good to see that I have struck a chord with some people. As to some of the replies:
If this is in the wrong forum, I am sorry. As I said at the beginning I am new here and am learning how things work and will try to do better as I post more threads.
As to giving people advice on their cars, I am 100 percent in favor of telling people if what they plan on doing is unsafe. I think that a car should be first and foremost a safe piece of machinery on our roads for both the driver's protection and everyone else on the road. I also support telling someone giving advice as to how difficult and/ or time consuming a particular modification might be. In fact I think that is what most people seeking advice would like to know.
I am only trying to say that if I am posting a question, for example, that says "I have a car with a ruined dash and want to install a new custom fiberglass dash and wants some advice on how difficult this process might be." I am not looking to hear "You are and idiot for wanting to install a fiberglass dash in a beetle, that is a stupid look and only the original dash should be put in a beetle. How dare you post such a dumb question here!" I am looking for advice on the process, cost, possible headaches and to possibly hear from someone who has had some success with it.
Since I started this thread I felt I had a responsibility to respond to a few things pointed my way so there you go.
I guess I am trying to say in the end is let's not stifle creativity, but again just my opinion. That and $3.50 will buy you another gallon for your mean machine :D

Mon Jan 07, 2008 2:25 pm

mac-vw wrote: Well this is getting more attention than I thought it would. It is good to see that I have struck a chord with some people. As to some of the replies:
If this is in the wrong forum, I am sorry. As I said at the beginning I am new here and am learning how things work and will try to do better as I post more threads.
As to giving people advice on their cars, I am 100 percent in favor of telling people if what they plan on doing is unsafe. I think that a car should be first and foremost a safe piece of machinery on our roads for both the driver's protection and everyone else on the road. I also support telling someone giving advice as to how difficult and/ or time consuming a particular modification might be. In fact I think that is what most people seeking advice would like to know.
I am only trying to say that if I am posting a question, for example, that says "I have a car with a ruined dash and want to install a new custom fiberglass dash and wants some advice on how difficult this process might be." I am not looking to hear "You are and idiot for wanting to install a fiberglass dash in a beetle, that is a stupid look and only the original dash should be put in a beetle. How dare you post such a dumb question here!" I am looking for advice on the process, cost, possible headaches and to possibly hear from someone who has had some success with it.
Since I started this thread I felt I had a responsibility to respond to a few things pointed my way so there you go.
I guess I am trying to say in the end is let's not stifle creativity, but again just my opinion. That and $3.50 will buy you another gallon for your mean machine :D

I moved it here because others started posting pic of their "rides" it did not belong in the beetle tech forum.... and I was not going to put it in the rants ( even though it is sort of a rant... it would just go down the toilet in a hurry if it was in there like everything else the sewer rats get a hold of :lol: )

I meant if you ever do post pics of your project... please put them in readers rides... I move threads here everyday because others put them in the WRONG FORUMS.