TheSamba.com :: View topic - Bus Center Pin Replacement (Long, MANY pics)

Sat Oct 18, 2008 11:17 am

///Mink wrote: So I'm right in the middle of this job on my March '57 SC and I noticed a couple of oddities.

First off, my Bus didn't have any kind of upper cap - Just a spring washer and 3 flat shims on top of that. Is this correct for earlier Buses? It did not appear to have been apart before, but what do I know?

Second, my upper bushing was flush with the top of the beam, not 1.4mm above. This seems to make sense if there is no "cap" on earlier beams.

Anyone??

http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/album_page.php?pic_id=206373
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/album_page.php?pic_id=202405

Tom, see if these pics/descriptions help.
the bushing does not stick out on the early beams, they do not use the cap, and are just like you describe, but i thought that may have stopped with wolsfburg production or soon thereafter, but i was never sure about it. also, you have to use the old spring washer and shims if you can, the spring washer that comes with the bushing kit is too large. i thought i used shims from another application if the old ones were trashed, but i forget where they were from, a generator perhaps?

Sat Oct 18, 2008 11:20 am

hazetguy wrote:

http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/album_page.php?pic_id=206373
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/album_page.php?pic_id=202405

Tom, see if these pics/descriptions help.
the bushing does not stick out on the early beams, but i thought that may have stopped with wolsfburg production, but i was never sure about it.

Thanks, Jon - that's it exactly. I will reassemble it the way it came apart. Thanks again for this great writeup.

Sat Oct 18, 2008 7:13 pm

Major Woody wrote: How much movement is unacceptable?
My center pin has enough play to permit about 1 mm play in the arm with the draglink and tierods removed. Is this ok?

I don't know the answer, but I just did this job and have a little info I can share. Initially I also had about 1 mm of up and down motion felt at the far end of the swing lever w/ all tie rod ends disconnected. After the replacement there is now no detectable up/down motion at the end of the lever. Doing this job appears to have reduced the play in the steering wheel from about 3 in. total travel (i.e., +/- 1.5 in.) to about 1 in. total travel.

Fri Apr 24, 2009 12:39 pm

Great write up

Basically just saving this so I can refer to it later
Thanks

Fri Apr 24, 2009 12:53 pm

What Would Hazet Guy Do?

Wed May 13, 2009 1:22 pm

Does anyone know if a 15/16" or a 31/32" could be used with good results??

I can't find a 24mm straight hand reamer for anything, they're all chucking and the flutes are too short.

Thanks.

Wed May 13, 2009 1:49 pm

mattoreg wrote: Does anyone know if a 15/16" or a 31/32" could be used with good results??

I can't find a 24mm straight hand reamer for anything, they're all chucking and the flutes are too short.

Thanks.

I wouldn't. You can rent the correct reamer from Wolfsburg West - that's what I did.

Wed May 13, 2009 1:54 pm

I tried finding one, too, to no avail.

Wed May 13, 2009 1:59 pm

well 121/128 would fit the best I would think :wink: , but I would try a 15/16. slightly smaller would be better than slightly larger 31/32.

if it was too tight a fit, you could carefully hone the pin with some fine grit wet paper. I wouldnt want to have any more resistance than a slight press fit by hand.

a 15/16 reamer is .00738" smaller than 24 mm. I dont think it would be too hard to adjust for seven and a half thousandths of an inch.

Wed May 13, 2009 3:57 pm

sled wrote: a 15/16 reamer is .00738" smaller than 24 mm. I dont think it would be too hard to adjust for seven and a half thousandths of an inch.

That's what I was thinking... That is damn close and available. I could buy one for what wolfsburg wants to rent me one.

15/16" = 0.9375" = 23.8125mm
and 0.9449" = 24.0000mm

Could 0.1875mm make that much difference? I'm having to tough time believing it would. Does anyone know the inner diameter of the febi bilstein bushing hazetguy had pictured?

Wed May 13, 2009 5:21 pm

Did you try these guys for the reamer?

http://www.metricmcc.com/

They have them in their catalog. Part #206 A

Wed May 13, 2009 6:24 pm

sled wrote: well 121/128 would fit the best I would think :wink: , but I would try a 15/16. slightly smaller would be better than slightly larger 31/32.

if it was too tight a fit, you could carefully hone the pin with some fine grit wet paper. I wouldnt want to have any more resistance than a slight press fit by hand.

a 15/16 reamer is .00738" smaller than 24 mm. I dont think it would be too hard to adjust for seven and a half thousandths of an inch.

.00738" might not seem like much but to a machinist like me that is a mile. I don't make ANYTHING that sloopy no matter what my tolerance is. I personally would just bite the bullet and rent/buy the correct one. Do the job once and do it right the first time. My .02.

Wed May 13, 2009 6:28 pm

$148.26 each :shock:

Wed May 13, 2009 6:38 pm

scvw wrote: sled wrote: well 121/128 would fit the best I would think :wink: , but I would try a 15/16. slightly smaller would be better than slightly larger 31/32.

if it was too tight a fit, you could carefully hone the pin with some fine grit wet paper. I wouldnt want to have any more resistance than a slight press fit by hand.

a 15/16 reamer is .00738" smaller than 24 mm. I dont think it would be too hard to adjust for seven and a half thousandths of an inch.

.00738" might not seem like much but to a machinist like me that is a mile. I don't make ANYTHING that sloopy no matter what my tolerance is. I personally would just bite the bullet and rent/buy the correct one. Do the job once and do it right the first time. My .02.

I have the 24mm reamer than MMC sells and often I have to take 2-3 passes before it cleans out all of the burrs and the pin drops in nicely. I can imagine at .00738" under you would need to hammer the pin in place and then good luck getting it out.

Thu May 14, 2009 4:59 am

I got mine from a local tool company. straight flute, 24mm, high speed steel, smooth shank. I think it was $50 when it was all said & done.

I think its chinese, but I'm am only going to machine brass. And no more than it will be used, $50 is plenty.

Thu May 14, 2009 7:13 am

I'm wondering: why a straight flute and not a spiral flute?

Thu May 14, 2009 8:34 am

I use a straight flute chucking reamer, I put it on the mill and cut flat spot on the end to fit in my hand holder/ Got it from MSC Direct. I have loaned it out when people buy center pin kits from me. It's done at least 50 pins and still works fine

Thu May 14, 2009 8:56 am

Chucking reamers dont have the taper built into them that a hand reamer does. Makes starting/aligning the reamer more difficult, since it was designed to be mounted in a machine.

Also curious about using the spiral reamer also - Any Machinists want to comment?

I read yesterday that reamers should never be turned backwards when removing (unlike a Tap). They should be turned CW and pulled back at the same time. Turning them CCW dulls the cutting edges

Thu May 14, 2009 10:22 am

I always used to rent mine from WWest and it worked very nicely.
I wanted to buy one and could not find a solid 24mm hand reamer.

On the recommendation of a thread on the Samba I bought one of
the adjustable reamers. The adjustable reamers suck for this application.
The cutting flutes are not long enough, and I found the reamer starts cutting the bottom bushing before it starts centering in the top one and when you
are half way done cutting the top bushing the reamer is no longer in the lower bushing. This obvious creates a very sloppy cut that is not aligned.

I installed the pin and there is some slop at the top of it because of this.
I would avoid these at all costs. It was waste of money, time and parts.

Where does WWest get their reamers from...has anyone asked them?
They must have a supplier if they are renting them.

T

Thu May 14, 2009 10:27 am

I too have used an adjustable reamer and it was a pain in the ass to setup. I wouldnt ever use it again. I also would not use a rented reamer as you have no idea who did what to it when it was rented out. Was it used properly? Is it sharp? Was it dropped? People generally dont treat other peoples tools as well as their own.