TheSamba.com :: View topic - 914: Bug guy thinking about a 914

Fri Jul 18, 2008 7:38 am

Hey Folks,

I have the opportunity to pick up a 914 Targa from a friend of mine who just wants to get rid of it.

Thing is - I am a Bug guy and a VW enthusiast and have never owned a Porsche. Now I know that it is a VW engine in it, but are Porsche 914's much more difficult to work on than Bugs? Are they more expensive to have repaired, etc.? I can do the basics on my Bug - adjusting valves, oil change, timing, etc. Body work and things of that nature are beyond my skill level.

With this particualar 914, the body is in great shape. I think the wiring harness needs to be reworked to get it running. How complicated is that? As far as I know, that's it. I guess what I am asking is can a VW enthusiast handle a 914? Or is it completely different?

Cheers!

Fri Jul 18, 2008 12:32 pm

Everything that you'll need to know is right here: http://www.914world.com/
visit that site and ask away. They're a great bunch and will help out a new guy for sure.

I came to Porsches through owning a Karmann Ghia for many years and found a lot of similarity and even quite a bit of identicality (if that's even a word . . . ) between the VW and the 914.

Front suspension is similar to a Super Beetle or 411, rear is different, brakes and such are more like the later 912/911 series than a VW, shared/similar electrics and on and on, but you can ease into the 914 with a VW background for sure.

Now, the parts can be expensive, but the 914 site that I posted above can help with that. Tons of good used parts are always being bought and sold there. Group deals on new parts and an index of what VW parts will interchange all make it easy and mostly inexpensive to keep your car going.

There are the inevitable "hot spots" where rust can gather and destroy the car, one is known as the Hell Hole. That's the area of frame bulkhead directly beneath the battery tray. There tends to be rust inside the "longs" in under and behind the rocker panel covers. The 914 guys can fill you in.

So . . . scamper over there. THAT'S where the real info is waitin' for you. What you'll get here is a boat load of opinion, over there you'll get the facts. As Sgt. Friday would say, " . . . just the facts . . . "

Luck and good bye ! ! ! ! !

TC

Fri Jul 18, 2008 12:52 pm

Thanks TC....will do!

Cheers!

Fri Jul 18, 2008 10:34 pm

Yes, buy it. I just purchased my first 914 friday and it is awesome. Very simple design and setup like the Bug. The only thing i need to do to mine is a good sanding and paint job and new sheet metal underneath the car, shouldn't be to bad, if you can weld it is easy to replace sheet metal like the longs or battery tray(which i will also replace, holds the battery up, but i don't like how it looks)

Sat Jul 19, 2008 6:31 am

turnaround89 wrote: Yes, buy it. I just purchased my first 914 friday and it is awesome. Very simple design and setup like the Bug. The only thing i need to do to mine is a good sanding and paint job and new sheet metal underneath the car, shouldn't be to bad, if you can weld it is easy to replace sheet metal like the longs or battery tray(which i will also replace, holds the battery up, but i don't like how it looks)

How is it setup like a bug?

A 914 is unibody, has a 911 design front end, type 4 motor, 901 tranny, 4 wheel disc brakes, and can cruise at 100mph all day long.

yeah, the switches have the same bug symbol inserts...

Sat Jul 19, 2008 6:48 am

"Very simple design and setup like the Bug."

"How is it setup like a bug? "

The car's design and set-up is a simple one; as is that of a Bug. I suspect that this was his intended meaning. Not a shared design or layout, but a shared ethic and approach to the design and layout.

Betcha . . .

Plus,HOPEFULLY he's already pulled an Elvis and left the building. Probably e-mailing and PMing his ass off right now over at the 914 site. Anything written here now is just the fading echo of clicks on a keyboard to him.

Wed Jul 23, 2008 5:25 pm

I have had my 914 on the road for three weeks and love it!! Get it and you will not be disappointed.

Good luck!!!

Rich

Thu Jul 24, 2008 12:09 pm

It's always been funny to me when bug people shy away from 914s because parts may be more expensive. Not that this is happening here. However, I have an announcement to the bug folks: You own the cheapest vehicle in the world to work with, so everything else is going to be more expensive. Even that rotting '84 Honda civic down the block is more expensive to work on than your car.

914 parts seem cheap compared to buying parts for modern cars. There are a few pricey items, mostly related to the fuel injection system and seals, that make me cringe. But even those parts are still usually cheaper than having to be the same part for my girlfriend's '91 Toyota Camry.

I think people get spoiled by cheap beetle parts - though I know prices are going up there as well. But when you have companies like Empi selling a set of new window cranks for $10 or whatever, it can skew your sense of reality.

914s are still a total sports car bargain. At least they are right now. In ten years it could be a very different story. I don't think the 914 is going to have the prestige of a 356 in the next five years, but there are similarities. 356s used to be thought of as glorified beetles by the 911 weenies, and it was only in semi-recent history that they were embraced by the same weenies and we saw the prices skyrocketed. Try pricing out even a rough 356. You can find a few under 30k, most are more.

In the past decade the 914s values have nearly doubled. Not a bad investment. Nice '73/'74 2.0s are going for nearly or more than 10k. Who'd of thought? Deals can still be had, but I don't know for how much longer.

I mean look at the market for old Beetles. You used to be able to pick up an OK runner for a few grand. Where did those days go?

Good luck on your 914 purchase. If it's any sort of deal, then it's probably a good buy as long as it's not rotting from the inside out. :)

Thu Jul 24, 2008 1:54 pm

I owned a 914 very fun to drive, like a go kart
Shifter is the weak area in these cars, very vague. M aybe if all the parts were new but mine shifted like crap
Oh and driving around semi and large SUVs, get an air horn because they are gonna drive over you since you are so low!!!!

Thu Jul 24, 2008 1:57 pm

MLTIGGER2 wrote: I owned a 914 very fun to drive, like a go kart
Shifter is the weak area in these cars, very vague. M aybe if all the parts were new but mine shifted like crap
Oh and driving around semi and large SUVs, get an air horn because they are gonna drive over you since you are so low!!!!

At the very least your shift rod bushings were worn. If it was an early 914, the ball end at the gearbox side may have been worn out as well.

914 shifting can be pretty crisp if you address the worn out bits.

Cheers,

Thu Jul 24, 2008 2:07 pm

yes, it was an early one 1.7 litre

Thu Jul 24, 2008 2:13 pm

MLTIGGER2 wrote: yes, it was an early one 1.7 litre

You can get the early /4s shifting well (the sixes had a better design), but the mid/late cars had a much improved shift rod setup.

:)

Fri Jul 25, 2008 12:14 pm

"It's always been funny to me . . . "

Roadglue, if that really IS your real name—very nice post ! ! ! ! !

You really hit on something there.

TC

Fri Jul 25, 2008 10:36 pm

TC/TeamEvil wrote: "It's always been funny to me . . . "

Roadglue, if that really IS your real name—very nice post ! ! ! ! !

You really hit on something there.

TC

Roadglue is my god given name, though my mom named me Randy. It's confusing, even for me!

Sat Jul 26, 2008 7:37 pm

Anyone have any recommendations on a rebuild kit for a 914 engine?

Sat Jul 26, 2008 7:44 pm

gilbequick wrote: Anyone have any recommendations on a rebuild kit for a 914 engine?

What size 914 motor and is it injected or running carb(s)? What are you looking for performance wise? Stock or something with more hp?

You'll need to find a good machinist to inspect your case and rebuild your heads. If there isn't someone near you that is very familiar with Type 4 motors, then you can ship it all off to someone who is.

More often than not you can almost reuse everything from the pistons, cylinders, valves, etc. Your machinist can inspect everything, refresh that which can be and then order the the new bits (like rings, etc). Most of the money will probably go into the heads though. It just depends on how badly worn your parts are. So yeah, most of the cost comes down to labor. You can save a lot if you're able to do the disassembly and then even more if you're able to put it all back together.

Good luck!

Sun Jul 27, 2008 9:48 am

roadglue wrote: What size 914 motor and is it injected or running carb(s)? What are you looking for performance wise? Stock or something with more hp?

It's a 1.7 liter that's been enlarged to a 1911. This ins't an engine I have, but one I'm thinking of buying. Right now it's got a single progressive carb setup, which I haven't read too many good things about.

Sun Jul 27, 2008 10:21 am

gilbequick wrote:
It's a 1.7 liter that's been enlarged to a 1911. This ins't an engine I have, but one I'm thinking of buying. Right now it's got a single progressive carb setup, which I haven't read too many good things about.

I personally like larger displacement T4's built on the stronger and shorter stroke 1.7/1.8 crank (it has larger rod journals than the 2.0 crank). The 1.7 heads have small valves and lousy flow though compared to the 2.0 heads, however, they're not prone to cracking around the spark plug holes like the 2.0 heads are.

If I was going to rebuild that motor, this would be my dream combo:

- 1.8 heads fitted with larger valves, ported and port matched to dual 40 IDF webers, semi-wild cam (I can't make a recommendation, sorry), lightened flywheel (just by 15 - 20%) and make sure you're running at least 8.5-1 compression. I'd balance the snot out of the crank, rods, pistons and have the crank balanced to the flywheel/pressure plate.

That's a very loose sketch of what I'd do. You'd need to find someone to flow the heads and figure out a cam based on that and the compression data.

Sorry if I'm rambling on too much. You never said that you wanted to build a high rev'ing screamer. You could always just stick with what 'cha got. Might as well just stay with the single progressive carb if you aren't planning on doing anything with the cam and heads. I've been in a few 914s running a single weber progressive and they've scooted along just fine. Dual carbs aren't going to do any good on a 1.7 running stock everything.

Is this for a 914 or buggy, etc?

Sun Jul 27, 2008 8:50 pm

Actually, I haven't pulled and Elvis and left the building i am still here, but have been driving the 914 a lot, way more fun then my baja bug. Its quicker more agile and there are less in town, then the VW bug so i like driving it more because you get a lot of looks. Personally the 914 is a simple car like the bug, if you can fix a vw bug then you will have no problem fixing a 914.

TC/Team Evil - sorry i don't check this site every five minutes like some people, i have a life and check this once a week, maybe. And yea, i also check out the 914 site because i own a 914, same reason i check this site because i own a vw. If i owned some other car i would check those sites as well for info, also there aren't pricks like you over at 914.

Sun Jul 27, 2008 9:46 pm

turnaround89 wrote: if you can fix a vw bug then you will have no problem fixing a 914.

Yep! I'd say the only thing more complicated is the fuel injection system. I'd say the 914's suspension is a lot easier to work on, but I have to admit that I don't have a lot of experience with that on a bug. :P