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Mon Aug 11, 2008 12:13 pm

Okay, stupid newbie question:

I'm looking into ACVW's because I want a car that is simple enough to fix myself....oh, and that lifelong vintage VW infatuation thing....but to JUSTIFY fulfulling the infatuation, I must have the satisfaction of doing my own maintenance.

So, I have long been attracted to the Squareback, and it is also certainly most suited to my needs as a mother of mid-size children and therefore a person often occupied in hauling people and things around.

In conversation with another VW enthusiast who does all his own maintenanace and repair, he expressed some frustration with the Type 3 engine as "hard to get to"....and enthused about being able to "loosen a few bolts" and lift the whole body off a bug, thus making everything pretty "easy to get to"...

I do realize that the Type 3 parts may be a touch tougher to get 'hold of than those for the ubiquitous bug....

SO:

I realize I'm speaking to a somewhat biased audience here, but would I be better off as a clueless newbie to go with a bug (or, in fact, a Ghia since there's more room to maneuver around the engine...and it's so pretty...) while I learn about these things, and save the Squareback longing for later?

Incidentally, how's the gas mileage on a Squareback? Please pardon my cluelessness...

Mon Aug 11, 2008 12:18 pm

ive had bugs busses notchbacks and squarebacks, and I do think the squareback was the easiest to actually work on. you lift the engine lid and everything is accesible.

if someone actually unbolts and removes the body to work on a bug engine, they are crazy and do not let them touch your car

my sqbk's always got pretty good mialage, 25mpg around town or better

Mon Aug 11, 2008 12:42 pm

The difference in complexity between a Bug and Type 3 is not an impediment. The T3 is different, and that alone makes it a little more of a challenge simply due to lack of familiarity. For example, anyone can look and see how to unbolt a Bug fender. You need the manual tofigure out the "hidden" bolts for T3 fenders (inside the car, under a taillight), but if you get a Bentley book you will have all the answers you need. Things take a little longer, but with a few exceptions, the car is put together like a Bug and you will do fine.

Exceptions? The EFI is reliable, but if it's been hacked or damaged, it does call for more patience to troubleshoot that a simple Solex carb. The dash is much more cramped and you will wish you had small hands when you go to work under there.

The engine is easier to get at, easier to get out, and no harder to get parts for with ebay and the Samba classified (and generous Samba members) at your service.

Tranny and suspensions are identical or nearly so.

Mileage varies but count on mid-20s to 30.

Can't beat a square for practicality!

A Ghia, lovely as it is, is not for a mother with children, unless you strap them to a roofrack!

Mon Aug 11, 2008 1:53 pm

One thing that I don't like about working on type 3s is that you have to lean into the back of the car to work on the engine from above. I find that after leaning over the squareback engine I usually have a pretty bad back ache.

The fuel injection that many of these cars has can require a lot of patience due to the steep learning curve and the difficulty of diagnosing problems caused by 40 year old wires and connections. After market carbs can also require patience as they have to be tuned properly to work on your engine.

That being said the type3 is my favorite vw to drive. The combination of comfort, ride, handling, fuel economy and looks is hard to beat. In my opinion a type3 should beat a bug in all of those categories.

They can also be very reliable once problems caused by the hacks of former owners and old rotten parts are sorted out.

Have you considered getting a bus?
A squareback is larger than a bug but it's still a small car. Seating in the back can be pretty cramped especially if tall people are up front and they need the seats slid back.

Quote: I'm looking into ACVW's because I want a car that is simple enough to fix myself....oh, and that lifelong vintage VW infatuation thing....but to JUSTIFY fulfulling the infatuation, I must have the satisfaction of doing my own maintenance.

If you get an old VW you should definitely do your own maintenance or you will go broke. Keep in mind that on a 40 year old car the maintenence will be simpler but there will be a lot more of it. Much of this maintenance will likely involve major repairs. It doesn't matter how reliable a car is, after 40 years and hundreds of thousands of miles there will be problems.

While in general an old car is easier to work on, in some ways it isn't. For instance on a newer car you can often plug in a scan tool and the car will tell you what is wrong with it. That's not going to happen with an old VW.

Mon Aug 11, 2008 1:56 pm

First, glad to see another woman willing to get dirty and greasy! :D

The previous owner of my Squareback was a woman. She did most of the repairs, even greasing the front end. So, woman can work on Squarebacks. Oh, and there is aveyinc (even her daughter helps out, who is pre-10 (forgotten :oops: ), and Anniehum, who all work on Squarebackes. aveyinc was restoring a '66, even.

I have worked on both on a Fastback, and Squarebacks. Squarebacks are the most easy, because you have room to sit/lay and work. Room to work is a bit tighter in some areas than a Type 1, but on others it is roomer, and no lid to whack your head on.

On a Type 3, the ride is so much nicer and quiet compared to a Type 1, more room, and spacious. You can even camp in a Squareback.

Mon Aug 11, 2008 3:30 pm

You should get the car that you want.

Mon Aug 11, 2008 3:53 pm

Im 29 and my squareback is the first car ive ever owned. I bought it four months ago and had never even changed the oil in a car before. Really, my friends and family dont trust me to use a screwdriver. I knew nothing of mechanics or electronics. I got the idiot guide and the bently manual for my year and with their help as well as a LOT of reading on the samba so far Ive been able to....

Change the oil
set the valve clearance
set the points
adjust the idle
repair ignition switch
repair door locks
remove tint
track down and repair a host of electrical problems
replace various missing parts
reposition seat to the place it belongs
reinstall backseat hinges
install a stereo system
fix two gas leaks
replace a couple bulbs
replaced a relay switch
and some other little stuff I cant recall.

So far my engine hasnt needed much (knock on wood) but I feel relatively confident if/when it does that Ill be okay.
Dont be afraid to ask questions here, and try it yourself before paying someone else....the more you do the more confident youll be.
Also I love my type three more than anything else on earth, buy one you wont regret it.

Mon Aug 11, 2008 5:22 pm

as the owner of a bug bus, and Type 3, I dig the Type 3 over em all, easy accessibility, easy to tune, and more power thatn a bug., and no crappy chinese sit. all german

Tue Aug 12, 2008 9:29 am

No fear about the space issue in a squareback....my kids are genetically inclined to tinyness (paternal grandmother was 4'6", father 5'6", I'm 5'5" and the tallest woman on either side of my family by far) and should be pretty comfy back there. Clearly the seats aren't going to be pushed too far back if I'm driving...

I am not thinking of getting a bus. They're cool, no doubt about that, but a little too persnickety IMHO. Also, I just like a littler car....good for those of us with a poor sense of spatial relations...

kz

Tue Aug 12, 2008 10:15 am

The square will haul everything with a full length roof rack, be easier to Park and much faster than a Bus! :roll:

Tue Aug 12, 2008 4:15 pm

I guess I am in the minority on this one but as the owner of a Type 1,2,and 3.
I would say my 69 bus is the easiest to maintain. It has the removable apron so the motor pulls Straight out. There is plenty of space around the engine. And I never need a jack to get under it and work on things.

Being a mother you will enjoy all the space.

That said, They are all pretty easy to work on. I'm sure you will enjoy whatever one you choose.

Tue Aug 12, 2008 7:45 pm

66311 wrote: You should get the car that you want.

I agree, get the car YOU want. Having owned several bugs over the years, rebuilding a VW Thing, and helping a friend with his t-1 ghia, the T-3 is as easy / hard to work on as any of the others listed (doesn't make a difference). Try to find the most complete, rust free car you can, as it'll save you money in the long run. :D