TheSamba.com :: View topic - June 1952 molested split slow and painful refresh

Sun Dec 20, 2009 2:21 pm

I wonder how a "slammed on earlies" car would work in that snow.

Sun Dec 20, 2009 4:22 pm

I see that Global warming is wreaking havoc in your country as well..
its cool, it will melt. :lol:

Sun Dec 20, 2009 4:23 pm

OH i forgot to mention, you are doing a great job. keep posting up dates

Mon Dec 21, 2009 11:46 am

Keep up the nice work!

Tue Dec 22, 2009 12:29 am

Looking good! I have not yet had the time to check the door window winder mechanisms. If I remember correctly I should be able to find one extra pair... I hope to find time to check next week.

Thu Dec 24, 2009 6:31 am

Hello people.
I just want to thank you all that helped my split to be what it is now. Without you i could have not done it, rebuild it, get the parts, get the best deals and the best advices. So i wish you only the best for the new year to come. For you, your family and loved ones, your pets, cars and for whatever thing and person you want. As my wishes came true this year, i hope you have at least half of my achievements or at least a bit of my joy typing this in the next year. I am not only happy being a Splitsville citizen without even leaving my country, i am grateful for having this: Thesamba and you guys.

I took some time to think of all the events that happened this year. Some of you had problems, financial difficulties or fighted diseases. Some of you won, some of you maybe not, and went to a better place leaving us continue your work. I was not there for you, but still thought of you as a part of a family we have here at the Pre53 corner and wished you the best all time.

This year was the greatest VW year for me ever! and thank you guys for making it possble! Merry Christmas and a Happy new year !

Mihai Apostol

and a little song for you guys :lol:

Thu Dec 24, 2009 8:48 am

Thanks for the song, Mihai. Your joy in your restoration really shines through and puts a smile on my face :D. All the best to you and your family at this holiday time.

Thu Dec 24, 2009 10:44 am

Thanks Miha, have a great new year as well/ and a Merry Christmas

Tue Dec 29, 2009 2:43 am

just a question, looking in your thread...

If you had not separated the inner and outer part of the rear window clip, would it still be possible to make the weld just inside of the pressing along the roof?

I'm planning how to make the switch on my split, and I'd rather not mess with the pressing going along the whole roof. One swedish guy made the weld at the rain gutter but then had to work to get this pressing lined up...

If I do not need to separate the outer and inner skin of the clip, I'd rather not...

Wed Dec 30, 2009 7:00 am

to answer your questions, the Mircea made the weld from the outside , i only separated the 2 pieces because there was heavy rust there, and it was the best opportunity to address it.

there is a possibility for example to try and open the rain gutter pressing, and hammer it down back after installing the split section. this way you will only have to do a straight line of welding above the rear views that is easy to hammer down from inside. you then can reinforce the rain gutters by putting extra MIG welds here and there to hold the pieces in place.

i think that this is the best way to do it. if you need i might have some pics showing the area at the rain gutter and can show you what is what. my split rear section did not had the rain gutters, or i will have done it as i said. i had to do those vertical welds, but you can avoid them

Wed Dec 30, 2009 3:05 pm

One of my favorite restoration stories of the year, and one I was lucky to play a small role in. I'm looking forward to new pictures and more progress on this car in 2010.

(stock rocks!)

Wed Dec 30, 2009 3:34 pm

Amazing build. Great work.

Fri Jan 01, 2010 5:02 am

eurodub wrote: to answer your questions, the Mircea made the weld from the outside , i only separated the 2 pieces because there was heavy rust there, and it was the best opportunity to address it.

there is a possibility for example to try and open the rain gutter pressing, and hammer it down back after installing the split section. this way you will only have to do a straight line of welding above the rear views that is easy to hammer down from inside. you then can reinforce the rain gutters by putting extra MIG welds here and there to hold the pieces in place.

i think that this is the best way to do it. if you need i might have some pics showing the area at the rain gutter and can show you what is what. my split rear section did not had the rain gutters, or i will have done it as i said. i had to do those vertical welds, but you can avoid them

What I'm afraid of is that the later 53 roof inner pressings along the roofside does not line up with the split ones... If so, it cannot be corrected, atleast not by my own skills... To make the weld just inside this line (as you did) seems the best way from my perspecive...

So you mounted the outer and inner roof sections before welding the clip into the roof, or you did that afterwards?

Fri Jan 01, 2010 11:19 am

I have welded the outer and inner roof skins after welding the clip into the roof.

i am 99,9% positive the roof pressings will lin up. the cars are both early (52,53) and there is something else you should know.. the 58-59 rear clip that was installed on my split was lined up with the split roof pressings.
it's really more easy to do just a long weld rather than 3. it's your choice, i am sure it will come out just nice in the end, but it can save you some work time.

Fri Jan 01, 2010 11:47 am

eurodub wrote: I have welded the outer and inner roof skins after welding the clip into the roof.

i am 99,9% positive the roof pressings will lin up. the cars are both early (52,53) and there is something else you should know.. the 58-59 rear clip that was installed on my split was lined up with the split roof pressings.
it's really more easy to do just a long weld rather than 3. it's your choice, i am sure it will come out just nice in the end, but it can save you some work time.

It's an early 51 (with bump in roof for antenna) and a late 53 oval... The Swedish guy said the line-up problem was in the front...

Is it not more prone to rust to do the weld in the gutter? Or perhaps it is easy to seal...

I asked him in this thread; http://www.meanbugs.com/punbb/upload/viewtopic.php?id=2692&p=5 // google translated; http://translate.google.com/translate?js=y&pre...&tl=en

Google translated just the interesting part (with a little help to make it more readable)...

car_l wrote: I also read that you could unfold the rain gutter, but I did not think it seemed easier, I cut just the outer skin with a thin grinder very gently

roof rack is only there for the winter, should NOT be on the car then ...

I seamed one edge, both when I changed the rear window of the front window, so firmer than the weld edge.
Led, I have not done, only spotweld very many points during a long time so that the roof would not warp ...

Perhaps it is better to put the seam furhter in front? have no idea at all actually? Lined a bit better rear seam than the windshield ...
johan_l wrote:
Been thinking a bit more on how to cut ... If one were to cut close to the "fold", would you get the inner part into the opening, or is it too small? Thinking that it is pretty stiff just at the fold, it is easier to grind than a inside the gutter... And there is some rust i that area on my split...

Must be a rather common operation, to replace this clip so someone ought to know...

And adds that I should make the switch on a 53 body, so the only rear window will be exchanged... not the windshileld...

Sun Jan 03, 2010 6:16 am

johan, it's you call how to do it. but you have a complete clip out there.

i'd replace it as it was done when they used to enlarge the rear views: unfold the rain gutters, insert outer skin (split skin for you), fold the gutter back carefully, and then.. your choice:
- welding the upper cut shut , but be careful to do a continuous weld, not just spots or else it will crack.
- place a sheetmetal beneath and apply steel rivets and then lead, as it was done on my split.

afterwards is your choice to reinforce that raingutter with a few holes welded shut by mig welder, or left as is.

Think about this... they enlarged the rear view on my split many moons ago and it held very nice until i changed it back. use the less weld you can, and take advantage of that full clip. remember i could not do it as mine was not full size.

another important issue is that if you use factory pressings you will avoid welds that show, you will avoid making welds that you will need to care for as to clean and prevent rust. i would think doing the same with the dash section , i know it is difficult but it is best to do it once, and best.

look how nice the guys worked... aircraft tech right there! :lol:
(i still keep this sheet of metal with rivets, it remids me of the way they did back then)

Sun Jan 03, 2010 9:03 am

Thanks for all advice. I'll think it over and check the condition of the clip. I know the rain gutter method is described in original VW workshop literature of a method of replacing the complete roof section, so it should be ok to open up and reseal... Just worried of what tool to use in that case...

For the other seam (horizontal) I'm thinking of using the tool below, don't know the english term for this method... http://www.jula.se/handverktyg/tanger-och-avbitare/falstang/

(I have the one with also hole punch in it)

just spot weld, grind down spots and then lead the seam... Just not sure if it will worked on a curved surface... But I can try it a bit on the roof I wont be using... Otherwise, using a backing strip and plug weld as described should also work?!? http://autobodystore.com/door_rust.shtml

As you say, if it is possible to reach from behind, rust wont be a problem... And the strength of spot welds should be enough and the warping minimal...

Wed Jan 06, 2010 10:39 am

for Johan, i am sure your split will turn out ok. i did not have your tools, so i had to weld the split skins edge by edge.

an update for the new year... i just got myself a pair of split semaphores.
well, i thought hey were, but one was really something else. a shortened "thing"that did not looked anything like i saw before. the weird thing is that i found them here in my country, where no other split survived from what i know of. and that split was pastel green just like the split clip i used :)

well, you folks might say "wow split semaphore! ... " but this is what i got. an arm and a split semaphore AL143.001.1 base with heavy rust and some holes an idiot made to put a light bulb in there :shock: the good -if you may call it is that it did have the original head style bolts.
i have some other later/non vw semaphore parts, and in time i will buy the other one, to have a pair for my split. abused, bent, incomplete, rusty, no matter what condition, i will restore them :)
will have to get this one acid dipped then sent to cad plating (if only i could find someone to do plating in my country... :( )

bye

Wed Jan 06, 2010 12:24 pm

I've done it this way; weld between the crease and the drip rail.
The inner panel was still attached and it took a little wiggling to get it in because the inner panel was wider than the outer panel, but it worked!

Thu Jan 07, 2010 2:49 am

rainierdeklark wrote: I've done it this way; weld between the crease and the drip rail.
The inner panel was still attached and it took a little wiggling to get it in because the inner panel was wider than the outer panel, but it worked!

So, if you had put the seam on the inside of the crease it may not have been possible to get the inner panel to go through the opening?

This the crease line up for you? If it does, I may try to do at the same way. Actually, I can cut a smaller hole (just inside crease) on the 1953 body to start with, if I get it in I'll make the 1951 clip smaller, otherwise, I'll make the hole in the 53 body larger...

Sorry for using your thread for this discussion...