TheSamba.com :: View topic - Rear Drum Brakes , comparing type 3 vs type 1

Fri Aug 14, 2009 3:38 pm

I need to get my manx to stop better. REar drums from a type 3 are larger I have been told. Does anybody have the physical dimensions so I can compare a type 1 to a type 3, I am looking for

Drum diameter on both, shoe width as well, both for 5 lugs application please.

Fri Aug 14, 2009 3:54 pm

They are the same dimensions as a 356 Porsche. 45 mm wide x 280 diameter. T-3 rear brakes will lock up 33" tires. There is nothing to compare just do it. It is a very worth while upgrade.

Fri Aug 14, 2009 4:07 pm

I have a set of Type 3 rear brakes, and the new bits and pieces like wheel cylinders and drums, in my motorhome.

Ghia discs on the front.

any idea what I should use for a master cylinder with this combo?

Fri Aug 14, 2009 4:33 pm

Type three rear brake drums and shoes are approximately 1 inch in diameter larger than type one... And the type three shoes are approximately 1/2 inch wider than type one shoes... You gain about %30 more braking energy with type three over type one..... You have to get type three backing plates, shoes, wheel cylinders, spring kits and drums... In other words, and COMPLETE rear brake assembly...

I put type three on rear of auto-x race car and use type one stock brakes on front and with a high energy braking experience (locked brakes) I get about equal skid patches on all four wheels....

IF you want more rear brake power YES type 3 drums are a good option....

And the winner here is its all stock VW parts (all bolt on) and absolutely no modifications to anything to get them to work....

you can use stock master cylinder But I prefer the bus/buggy master cylinder...

http://www2.cip1.com/ProductDetails.asp?ProductCode=C13-6114

And use BILLET reservoir ... The plastic reservoirs (screw in) for the BUGGY/BUS master cylinders leak....

Dale

Fri Aug 14, 2009 6:29 pm

I have that Master cyclinder already, just need to find the backing plates and drums now

Fri Aug 14, 2009 6:46 pm

wheel cylinders

http://www.chircoestore.com/catalog/product_info.php?cPath=86_87_95&products_id=624

brake shoes

http://www.chircoestore.com/catalog/product_info.php?cPath=86_87_102&products_id=615

drums

http://www.chircoestore.com/catalog/product_info.php?cPath=86_87_97&products_id=622

this is the only place I found that has them.

Fri Aug 14, 2009 7:02 pm

I know your interested in 5 lug, but heres some pics i took of the difference between my type1 & type3 4lug when i did the upgrade.

Sat Aug 15, 2009 7:48 am

Actually almost any supplier has MOST of the "replacement" parts you will need (shoes, drums, wheel cylinders)....THE ONLY problem is BACKING PLATES, those you will probably have to pick up used (check in sale area)....

And yes early type three has wide five drums....

Dale

Mon Sep 07, 2009 12:54 pm

the 411 brakes are the same as the type 3 you just need the type 3 drum as those are different!

Mon Sep 07, 2009 2:52 pm

But, buy the time you buy all these parts, you can go with Disc cheaper.. shoes , wheel cylinders, drums and brake lines. price ll those parts against a disc set up

Mon Sep 07, 2009 6:03 pm

Not everybody is into disks thought....

Dale

Mon Sep 07, 2009 7:40 pm

well dale your Right . I should just keep my mouth shut rather than tell some one want a more powerful braking system, That it just maybe more cost affective to go Disc. But then this is a off road forum and who the hell would ever use disc brakes on a off road car ..
I feel so much better now knowing this, yet so sad it took 45 years of dealing with these cars to find this out

Mon Sep 07, 2009 8:01 pm

Sounds like someone is a little salty.

Mon Sep 07, 2009 10:55 pm

and that would be ?? he who doesn't think every one want disc ? or He who doesn't give a shit ? LOL

Tue Sep 08, 2009 7:56 am

towd wrote: and that would be ?? he who doesn't think every one want disc ? or He who doesn't give a shit ? LOL

Just wonder why the cranky attitude........

The thing is with some disk systems its a lot of work getting it right and replacement parts can be some what of a guessing game..... With the larger type 3 rear brakes its ALL VW parts and all bolt on..... Some times ease of getting parts and simplicity of installation wins out over technology especially when things tend to not fit right and need a lot of tweaking to make it work because kit was developed and produced with about 75% of the quality and research that should have been done... Not all kits, but some.... Have not heard of the problems upgrading to type 3 as you find with people trying to upgrade to disks...... I see a lot of WAAAH!!! my disks don't fit, or the the bracket is wrong, or what valving do I use, or where can I get replacement rotor or.... I know, not all kits, but some, and its a guessing game who has best (most complete) kit...

Dale

Tue Sep 08, 2009 10:33 am

you need more hands on time.

Tue Sep 08, 2009 12:03 pm

I guess it must just be me, but I have never had problems with a front or rear disk brake kit. Installing or replacing parts.

I do not live where I can drive in the sand, but I do live where the mud can be deep. Drum brakes suck in mud, even if they are T3's. Mud gets into the drum/backing plate area and reduces the braking effectiveness. This does not happen with a disk brake setup.

If I can get a set of T3's cheap, yea I will run them. But if I am going to buy everything new, I will buy a disk setup. Sometimes, moving up into the late 19th century is good.

I am thinking of setting up a set of wide five disks with e-brakes for my RGB Baja build. Lots better stopping power on the highway running 31 10.50's.

Tue Sep 08, 2009 1:29 pm

towd wrote: you need more hands on time.

Sour Grapes.... Because not everybody agrees with you........

Dale

Tue Sep 08, 2009 10:42 pm

i vote disks when i first got my car i overhauled the braking system new shoes, master cylinder,wheel cylinders,reconditioned everything else and ive done a lot of brakes on alot of vehicles so i know what im doing (i think)but after two months of adjusting the breaks and seeing them getting weaker and weaker i decided to pull them of and turns out they were totally shot all the way down to metal,but it wasnt their fault it was mine seems that i have a sickness that being i looooove mud,luckily i went to some counseling the other week called bugorama and picked up a rear disc break kit for 25 dollars yes 25 dollars now im soooo happy,sorry this is getting to long moral of the story is IF THE CAR IS GOING OFFROAD GO DISCS CAUSE IF SAND OR DIRT GETS INTO YOUR DRUMS THERE TOAST

Tue Sep 08, 2009 11:01 pm

LOL,, only one ... objects .... to saying anything about disc over t3 drums as per the cost .. not a valid reason for a smart ass comment.

with that it appears to be my fault, taking this thread off topic, my apology to the op.

with good fortune God will kill by morning.