TheSamba.com :: View topic - The Build: 223HP Type 4 & 915 Tranny into a '68 Double C

Fri Jul 30, 2010 8:10 pm

nice work, WAAAYYYYYY beyond my capability's.. but I still gotta laugh at the crappy old oiled up rusty heater boxes..hehe.
no matter your skill, no-one wants to pay for those!!!!

Sat Oct 09, 2010 7:52 pm

Anymore news on this Jake? It's been awhile and I see a lot happening on
the site but not much news here... We feel left out :(

Sat Jun 18, 2011 8:17 am

Finally!! We started on this in August of 2009, then my Dad passed away, then business exploded and I decided to reconstruct my entire facility here at Aircooled Heaven..

I drove it home last night and back in to the shop this morning... Its astonishing! 5 Speeds, cruising at 80MPH+, EFI and 215HP!

This thing is un-real.. so smooth, power on demand and it runs head temps less than 350 all the time.. Nickies, DTM, Setrab dual fan pack oil cooler and EFI seem to be making for a cool package..

Have a little more EFI tuning to do... From the Driver's seat!! This kind of power in a TII is something I have never experienced before.. It just doesn't feel right to blast to 80 MPH passing cars up hill running 90 and then hitting 5th gear!!! 3K RPM is 73MPH in 5th gear!

The build changed a bit from originally. I ended up using a 923 5 speed gearbox and a different engine. The 2.4 was a better for for my 356C Outlaw, so I decided to take a spare 2.7 EFI engine that I had lying around and throw it into the truck for a little more grunt.

With Nickies and 9.5:1 the 102mm bore runs so cool that I could lay my hand on the intake manifold after an hours drive in 88F temps, CHT never even hit 350 up a long, 3 mile 6% grade this morning.

Here is a video from my Chassis Dyno that was taken at our "Aircooled Assault" car show and dyno challenge a couple of weeks ago.. Its one pissed off Double Cab, but it still drive so smooth! Gotta love MassIVe Power!
http://youtu.be/UKhJyUOzbUg
Here is one of the tuning runs.. It has more in it, but I am pretty happy with this.
Remember, this is power at the rear wheels on my chassis dyno. At the flywheel the engine made 215HP, the Porsche trans and Type II axle bearings are sucking up lots of power.

Now all I need to do is add Air Conditioning like my Wife's Vert and an Espar heater..

The drivetrain is all complete, now for the 944 Turbo brake install and I'll have another MassIVe Daily Driver to reliably add to the fleet! :-)

Sun Jun 19, 2011 6:56 am

Awesome Jake! Would love to take a ride in that dc...

Sun Jun 19, 2011 2:50 pm

Awesome job Jake! How about some pictures of the finished project?

Sun Jun 19, 2011 3:47 pm

I want one :cry:

Sun Jun 19, 2011 3:51 pm

That's amazing!

How long do you expect the motor to last with that kind of output? That's a huge output for that kind of motor.

Sun Jun 19, 2011 4:44 pm

I've seen it, but have not had the pleasure of riding in it. It is a beautiful installation and looks like it would be a blast! Those dyno #'s are fantastic.

The ultimate sleeper street-rod!

Sun Jun 19, 2011 5:59 pm

RatCamper wrote: That's amazing!

How long do you expect the motor to last with that kind of output? That's a huge output for that kind of motor.

I'd expect it to last 80K with zero issues, maybe pop the heads off at that mileage for service. I have so many cars to drive that 80K will be a decade of use if not more with this vehicle.

The size doesn't decrease the lifespan with components and processes like I have employed. The engine runs so cool because its not even being stressed by the weight of the vehicle. The Porsche 5 Speed tranny really tops it off because it gives the extra benefit with keeping the engine in it's sweet spot RPM wise at pretty much any speed.
Here is a pic when the engine was close to being finished.. I didn't do my usual deed and document the process as well, because we did the install in only 3 days from start to finish.
Sorry for the crappy pic, its from my phone... I'll take a completed one tomorrow.

This is what the finished product is going to look like one day.. It really doesn't need full resto now, so I probably won't do anything more to it for a long time.. Maybe some interior enhancements and thats about it.

This conversion is really simple now that we have done it. Everything from the shift linkage to the clutch cable and exhaust are all straight forward. Our standard TIV conversion mount bar does the job with integration of the TIV into the 68-71 application easily.

This one impressed me.. Thanks goes to Damo from Australia, he did a tremendous amount of the install along with me..

Sun Jun 19, 2011 6:03 pm

Are you running SDS in this car?
I used to be a SDS dealer,and they have a awesome system that is uber-reliable. I have street tuned & dynoed tuned over 2 dozen cars using this system,and got my own 2.0l 16V VW to 445whp at 28 psi boost using SDS,and a 2.8l VR6 to 463 whp at 21 psi using SDS.
Was thinking about doing it to a aircooled car,but am sticking to carbs for now. What is your total timing you are running with that set up? I am guessing 28 deg.....

Sun Jun 19, 2011 6:28 pm

Yes, this is SDS.. We have used at least 50 of their systems since 2001 or so.. These days we use Electromotive as we deigned a system together, I run that one in my 912E.

The engine doesn't like more than about 25* total timing.. It screams efficiency.

Mon Jun 20, 2011 2:28 am

Well,you are doing a nice job of tuning,and my SDS dynos came out super smooth just like yours,compared to factory EFI cars with close loop KS & O2 which can be more jagged due to timing being pulled.
Are you using close loop 02 and knock sensing for this? If you are then you have it dialed in well,since it is so smooth.
Before SDS did not have these features.
Tec is a much more complex and more feature filled,and more of a high end system. SDS is great for hobbyist as well/more user friendly.
Keep doing what you are doing over there.Awesome work! 8)

Mon Jun 20, 2011 3:47 am

The Electromotive stem we are now using is not TEC, it's a motorcycle system of theirs with adaptive that we changed a bit just for a VW application.

The truck drives great.. Maybe it'll be completely tuned this week, I still need to get it back on my chassis dyno one day.

Mon Jun 20, 2011 6:31 am

Jake, I really like what you've done with this Type II-- I'm looking forward to reading your driving impressions as you get it further sorted and the a/c installed. I hope that you keep the current "workmanlike" paint scheme vs. something fancy and modern-- as it certainly suits the nature of the truck. If you ultimately decide to sell this vehicle to make room for a new RAT project, please keep me in mind.

Regards, Dave

Mon Jun 20, 2011 6:47 am

marekv8 wrote: Jake, I really like what you've done with this Type II-- I'm looking forward to reading your driving impressions as you get it further sorted and the a/c installed. I hope that you keep the current "workmanlike" paint scheme vs. something fancy and modern-- as it certainly suits the nature of the truck. If you ultimately decide to sell this vehicle to make room for a new RAT project, please keep me in mind.

Regards, Dave

Dave, glad you appreciate it... I already have one other customer expressing serious interest in the truck. In fact he is already calling it "his" in his posts over on my forums. He saw it here at the RAT Reunion a couple of weeks back when he traveled here from the British Virgin Islands for the weekend. I'll add your name to the list, just behind him :-)
Its kind of crazy to have people waiting in line to buy something that its taken a couple of years to complete. LOL

At this point its not for sale, Beth has told me that she won't allow me to sell it! I do have to say that with my 356C Outlaw project (with RAT 5 Speed and 2.4 liter, 220HP MassIVe engine!) back on the front burner that the right amount of money could buy the truck... The engine and tranny aren't a cheap package, the engine alone would cost 22K+ to produce in like form if I were willing to add a job like it to our task list today.

The truck it's self is in great shape, but has the general rusty areas that should be addressed one day. If I move forward with the scheme depicted above I'll probably not lower the truck at all in the front and just go one click lower in the rear. I use the truck for what its intended for and don't own a single "show car", nor do I want one.

The engine is boost compatible, so I had thought about adding a nicely sized turbo that I have to it... That would be absolutely disgusting, but would generate more power than I believe the stock 923 transaxle could hold!

Mon Jun 20, 2011 8:33 am

I know how it is—my wife and kids will never let me sell the Herbie Beetle, even though the project has finally run its course. My latest 22-month watercooled project was totally destroyed 4.25 hours into my maiden voyage by a gal on her cell phone, so I’m starting the process of shopping around for the next project.

Only someone who couldn’t give a crap about what other people think would have put this vehicle together— which is of course why I like it very much.

Regards, Dave

Mon Jun 20, 2011 9:20 am

Quote: Only someone who couldn’t give a crap about what other people think would have put this vehicle together— which is of course why I like it very much

Hell, the more people don't like something, the more I want to do it..

Remember, I am the guy that took the engine out of the last Beetle ever imported from Germany into the US and replaced it with a 2270 Type 4..

That car had twenty seven original miles, still had the original paper plates on it from 1980 and was virtually brand new inside and out.. Interior was replaced with leather sourced from Bugatti... Original engine was sold on Ebay..

It was a cool way to start of the 21st Century, by ripping the heart out of one of the last 3 beetles ever made with 27 miles on the speedometer.

Thats what the customer wanted and we delivered!