TheSamba.com :: View topic

Thu Sep 09, 2010 10:25 pm

Hello,

After reading this thread, I'm hoping I can get confirmation that my ignition switch is faulty.

Durring my recent trip to Nevada (Burning Man) from Vancouver BC my 88 automatic Carrat with a 2.1 WBX which I've owned for 5 years now started making a whining/vibration sound immediately after the engine starts that lasts 1-2 seconds. This always occurs from a cold start and is intermittent when warm. It sounds like the soleniod is not disengaging quickly.

Another issue I noticed, that may or may not be related, is that the ignition switch (key) can be turned to the start position once the engine has been started which causes that distinctive grinding noise of the starter pinion gear contacting the moving flywheel followed by the same whining/vibration sound I hear after the engine starts.

The Bosch rebuilt starter is about 1 year old. I've checked the electrical contacts to the starter and they are in good shape. It works perfectly.

Every 80's VW I've owned will not allow the ignition switch to be turned to the "start" position once the starter has already been activated. This WAS the case with my van until this whining began.

Is this an ignition switch, starter or slolenoid problem? Or is there another componet that could be the culprit?

Any guidance would be very much appreciated,

Mike

Fri Sep 10, 2010 6:29 pm

Ok, another decision, no vasilating. My ignition switch needs changing. others say it is too complicated, too expensive so I am going to do it!

I've seen the steering wheel and some components taken off several times, I am studying Ben's pictures and several other information that falls into his procedure. I don't know when I will but as soon as I get the van home after the diagnoses.

I'm really really good taking things apart I will have to organize it in such a manner that everything goes back in in reverse order. I petrified but excited about making the decision. I know it needs to be done and it very well may settle some electrical issues.

When that is successful, I'm going in behind the dash and taking out non necessary wiring, replacing broken speaker wires. These I can do, have donein other vehicles and boat. I won't take on the dash cluster, relays, etc... just the very simple (old stereo, map lite that I don't even have,) try to find out what that converter up in behind the glove compartment is attached to.

My first baby steps are going to be under Ben's online tootalige. I'll tell you when to pray for me. :roll:

Fri Sep 10, 2010 8:40 pm

You can do it!

I had never removed a steering wheel before, and as Ben pointed out - no puller needed.

The most challenging part was, in my case, the white ignition switch had melted around and toward the center from the terminal at the 4:00 o'clock position. This required prying it apart from the black female connector on the wiring harness. I also had to trim with a knife some of the melted white plastic from the black connector prior to installation of the new switch. I took the old ignition switch apart, and there had been a lot of arcing on the rotating central contact.

Buy two ignition switches inexpensively online, and keep the spare in the van where you can find it.

You will get a chance to examine and clean contacts and switches while the horn and stalks are off. Get a spray can of electrical contact cleaner at a discount store.

If you are going to start tooling up, buy an inexpensive digital multimeter so you can start seeing what can't be seen. You don't need it for this job, but you will use it in the vehicle and your home.

Sat Sep 11, 2010 6:20 am

thanks, yes I already have one. I also have the inline testing lite . All the contacts in the steering column have been repeatedly gone over with varied results. Never the same twice. If I can't make the horn work (it was tried and tried and its circuit is good right up to but not including the steering wheel centre, then I will try to figure out a way to have a horn externally. A new horn was installed and as I said circuit is good right up to the horn press on the steering wheel.

I'm sure hoping that the ignition switch is as easy as all you people have found it to be.

Sat Sep 11, 2010 1:37 pm

Just changed mine, super easy job but I'll admit it was nice to see Ben's DIY first. Thanks & kudos to the man

The main bolt attaching the steering wheel does require a 24mm box (I had to go purchase one at Crappy Tire).
Also, the spline does not have a 12 o'clock notch so at first when I bolted my steering on it was slightly off.. noticed it on the test run. :doh:
I'd suggest tracing a line with a Sharpie just before removing the steering to ensure proper alignment.

Sat Sep 11, 2010 2:19 pm

yeppers, I know that one. Thanks.

Sat Sep 18, 2010 9:58 am

So My head lites quit after getting to work tuesday, read this topic (THANKS BEN !!) I found if I wedged a screw driver between the column & the Ig. switch plug, the lights & wipers would work, so I bought a new switch, put it in, everything works fine, there was a bit of white plastic melted on the plug, but that was the only issue. I did not take the bolts off that hold the column to the dash as it was not neccessary.
The job took less than a half hour.

Sat Oct 02, 2010 6:24 pm

I installed my GW light kit backwards. Yep I didn't catch the the fuse box diagram included with the kit was backwards to mine. I am pretty sure that is what melted my ignition switch. So I changed my ignition switch. Bit of a pain because the switch melted down into the wiring harnes so had to take the steering wheel off etc. Ben thank you so much for the pictures saved my behind. Drove into the garage last Friday night and turned off (tried to anyway) the ignition and the key wouldn't come out.

Still having problems with the horn honking when I turn on the highbeams. That was going on before the other mess. Any ideas?

Thanks
Jackie

Sun Jan 02, 2011 8:14 pm

It's been several years since I've had to replace the Ign. switch, but today I needed to.
Pulled out the new one from my box of extras, and started in.

Stymied! What?

This little bastard doesn't want to slide off, and after messing with it for awhile I decided that in the dark and cold wind was not the time to finish it.

Pic taken from Ben's site.

Yes, the allen bolt on the left that anchors it is out, and I splayed it out a little, but it hangs on something.

Sun Jan 02, 2011 8:46 pm

Could it be hung up on the ign. lock?

Sun Jan 02, 2011 9:03 pm

FNGRUVN wrote: Could it be hung up on the ign. lock?

Could be, felt like metal on metal, sure don't remember having any trouble with it before.
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Sun Jan 02, 2011 9:48 pm

When I did mine a short time back, I had trouble until I realized that my key was not in the "on" position. It came out ok after that.

Ed

Sun Jan 02, 2011 9:58 pm

Quote: I had trouble until I realized that my key was not in the "on" position.
That's the ignition lock

Mon Jan 03, 2011 12:02 am

Oh yeah, hehe.... I guess that would help a little bit.

Wed Apr 27, 2011 12:21 pm

First let me day, I'm amazed at all the knowledge you folks have and readily share!
I "Do" have the Bently Vanagon bible.... I do know VW's(30+yrs. worth) BUT, When it comes to the later VW wiring schematics...I'm lost!

Here's where one of you fellas can help....I'm working on my friends VW-not a vanagon! A 73 K-ghia....some previous yokel yanked the wire loom and lost a good chunk. I managed to come up with some of it thru a fellow VW guy. Now here's the vanagon part of the puzzle. WE needed the plug and wires for the back of the ignition switch....the only thing we could get was from a Vanagon....unknown year!!! Just wires in a box marked 'vanagon' on the local 'retired' vw guru's shelf. So of course the colors don't match up to K-ghia AND my eyes start going crossed trying to figure out the Bently Vanagon schematic.

Can one of you fellas tell me what the wires coming 'from' the Vanagon ignition plug...go to. My version has a long & short medium thick black/yellow, a thick white/red, a thick red, small blue/red...and so on. And no, I'm not in front of the car....it's in my friends garage...

Sorry, I know how exasperating and ridiculous this post sounds to some of you guys....been there done that....now I'm on a tiny island in the middle of the Pacific...and the shoes is on the other foot...I bow down and humbly ask for your understanding and assistance.
Aloha

Thu Apr 28, 2011 3:01 pm

Andy, thanks for the pm re: the wire layout from you 80 Vanagon. That shed 'some' light on my quandry... So I'm assuming(yeah I know where that'll get me!!LOL) that the bit of harness I have must be late model Vanagon. Big red wire, big white wire w/small red stripe, double medium black wire w/yellow stripes(one long & one short) plus the others....this ring anyone's bell???
Aloha!

Thu Jul 28, 2011 10:28 am

Hey all, and Ben too,
I also have the intermittent starter problem. It seems that if I twist the key just so after it gets to the start position, I can get the starter going. Yes, I have changed the silly little plastic switch, and have another on order. Also have bought a new used ignition/lock housing (not installed yet).

However, when I went to Bus Depot to buy another ignition switch, I saw a starter relay kit. Has anyone found that this solves the intermittent starter problem?

The intermittent problem usually shows up after being run--sitting for 6 months, it usually starts right up. Yes, replaced the starter last year.
...Tom

Thu Jul 28, 2011 11:22 am

that sounds like a winner tom
bus depot is sort of my go-to, which funny enough, is wher i am going now. My key-in tone doesnt shut off when I take out the key now, just in the last week. I have a subaru in it, 90 gl. the remote relay sounds like it would make the sw last longer-- along with a relay for the headlights. I will address these things when I resto her later. My #2 van has a tilt column w/o the oopswagen sw. thats my solution for both vans.

Sun Mar 18, 2012 11:52 am

When I replaced my ignition switch following Ben's instructions a couple of years ago (thank you, Ben. your website pictures were incredible), I later discovered that my high-beams would not click on. I haven't had time to investigate/fix it yet, but I am wondering what might have caused this?

I do recall being quite concerned about making sure the steering wheel was nice and tightly bolted after the replacement. So, I wonder if I over-tightened the bolt, and if this might be the reason for my high-beams lever not functioning.

I appreciate anyone's help! Thank you.

Sun Mar 18, 2012 1:23 pm

Belladonna30c wrote: When I replaced my ignition switch following Ben's instructions a couple of years ago (thank you, Ben. your website pictures were incredible), I later discovered that my high-beams would not click on. I haven't had time to investigate/fix it yet, but I am wondering what might have caused this?

I do recall being quite concerned about making sure the steering wheel was nice and tightly bolted after the replacement. So, I wonder if I over-tightened the bolt, and if this might be the reason for my high-beams lever not functioning.

I appreciate anyone's help! Thank you.

My first guess is that the relay or high/low switch is shot. The headlight current also goes through the little plastic ignition switch. I'd change that or get a backup if it's working because it will die soon, change the high/low relay, and definitely install a headlight relay so you don't get that problem again. The guy who sells the starter relay also sells the headlight relay, so I ordered both and installed them at the same time. It's a no-brainer that sending the full headlight current through that little switch (that the ignition key activates) will burn it out at some point, usually not at a convenient time! Bad on VW for not engineering that better at the outset.
FYI, I also updated to the more powerful headlights that BusDepot is selling. Much improved!
...Tom