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Sun Nov 01, 2009 4:46 pm

Hi, I am not sure what is misssing or if the tin on the motor is wrong. It was an fuel injected motor from the looks of the temp sensors but doesn't seem to fit the body. I haven't done much with buses to know and my nephew wants to get this on the road. Can anyone tell me what is missing or needs to be changed. Thanks Rob[imghttp://images.thesamba.com/vw/gallery/pix/614520.jpg[/img]][/img]

Sun Nov 01, 2009 4:49 pm

Hellacious fail on the pic posting there Rob, and the picture itself isn't all that great either. At first glance, I don't see any tin at all going around the rear of the fan housing or the sides of the engine. Take your pics from the rear of the Bus through the engine compartment, not from above through the engine hatch. Try again, better pics and we can tell you what is and isn't there.

BTW--that's quite clearly a Weber Progressive carb on that motor, not fuel injection.

That engine didn't come out of a Bus, so what did you replace of the tin before the engine was installed? Need some history here.....

Sun Nov 01, 2009 5:30 pm

VDUB
Quote: BTW--that's quite clearly a Weber Progressive carb on that motor, not fuel injection.

Rob
Quote: It was an fuel injected motor

Sun Nov 01, 2009 5:49 pm

VDubTech wrote: Hellacious fail on the pic posting there Rob
If you're gonna fix one post'em all!

you could use some better shots, you are missing a lot of tin/stuff/firewall.

Was there a fire in there?

Sun Nov 01, 2009 6:09 pm

babysnakes wrote: VDUB
Quote: BTW--that's quite clearly a Weber Progressive carb on that motor, not fuel injection.

Rob
Quote: It was an fuel injected motor

What's your point? It's clearly a carbureted engine. Doesn't matter what it started out as.

The tin on your engine looks to be from a 914. You can't take an engine from another vehicle and expect it to fit into the Bus without modification. You need to strip all of the tin from that engine and replace it with the proper Bus tin.

Sun Nov 01, 2009 6:21 pm

VDubTech wrote:

The tin on your engine looks to be from a 914. You can't take an engine from another vehicle and expect it to fit into the Bus without modification. You need to strip all of the tin from that engine and replace it with the proper Bus tin.

x2

I don't know if this installation is the handiwork of our original poster, but there is no way it is going to work without a donor motor with the proper tin.

I don't have any faith that the fan shroud and exhaust system will work, either.

And then there's still the problem that it's a 914 motor which will probably overheat and fail quickly in a bus application. With a progressive carb which is likely not properly tuned.

If you want to get this bus on the road relatively quickly, find a working motor from another bus.

Sun Nov 01, 2009 6:39 pm

This is how he bought it. I'm working on getting a kit for the carb and get it running better. The tin from a bus motor wont work on this set up? I pointed out the fuel injection because I thought it was odd that it wasn't the right tin, but yet fuel injection. What do you think about the auto tranny that is in it? Vw or has that been swapped too?

I have to read the picture posting again but my wife was in need of help with dinner and I took a shot at it. Thanks for posting them for me.

Sun Nov 01, 2009 6:51 pm

Just wanted to give the photo thing a try.

Sun Nov 01, 2009 7:43 pm

FWIW i put a type4 bus engine into my 412ls and most of the tin was a straight swap except for the piece in front of the gearbox which is taller in a bus than in the car.

Sun Nov 01, 2009 7:44 pm

1) The year is important because they used different engines in different years. You do not tell us the year but if it has a hatch it must be 73 or newer.

2) The type of engine is important but you do not tell that either. From the picture, it is a Type 4 which is the correct type for a 73 bus.

3) The lack of tin suggests the engine came from a Porsche 914. The Porsche 914 used the same engine as a bus, with certain modifications.

4) DO NOT run the engine until you get the correct tin and seal off the motor. It will overheat and burn out. You can run it for testing and to move it around but do not drive it anyplace.

5) Check the engine serial number, it will tell what model of engine you have.

6) You need the correct tin for a bus. See if the seller has the old engine. If it was put in by a garage check if they have the old engine. Get everything you can.

Don't know what else to say at this point. That will do for a start. Please see if you can find the engine number.

Sun Nov 01, 2009 7:53 pm

If it is a 914 engine it is basically the same as a bus engine. Except higher compression and different cam which gives more horsepower but may cause it to overheat in a bus. You can use it but it should have a head temp gauge and back off if it gets too hot.

Also the tin shrouding is different but you know that already. The oil dipstick is different too. So are the heater boxes but they must have been changed to get it to fit.

Someone did a real hack job putting the engine in. If it was mine I would get it running and check for knocks, bangs etc. Then do a compression test. If it checked out OK I would take it out and install the proper shrouding etc. and drive it around.

Sun Nov 01, 2009 7:54 pm

Thanks,
I have done some checking and found a 914 motor in the clasifieds and it also has a EC engine numberso I'm guessing that it. The bus is a ' 74 with adventure wagen conversion. The engine number is EC039408 and the PO had bought it for a resale so no help there. I'm sure I can find a doner engine for the tin and if I have to do some work on the front height that won't be too bad as long as I don't have to do a total refab on it. Do you think I can change the tin in the bus or will I have to pull it? I'll get pictures of the exhaust to see if that is going to be a problem. Thanks for the info. Rob

Sun Nov 01, 2009 8:04 pm

One more thing, what year bus tin will work for it? Will early vangon work too, I think I still have an '84 motor. I'm sure that is different. We are in northern NY and it's all ready 33degrees out right now so he will be safe for the winter with short drives with the over heating.
I have got it running, after removing the water and cleaning the carb. It has a slight tick but nothing too bad. It has been sitting for about ten years but the tranny is moving it the driveway. I have to go through the brakes for him and get the engine set for now. Thanks for the info. I don't spend a lot of time in this forum, I'm usualy in the super and ghia forums trying to help but buses are not first nature to me.

Sun Nov 01, 2009 8:27 pm

It may or may not overheat over the winter without proper tin and seals, but he's gonna choke from exhaust fumes with that setup!

Sun Nov 01, 2009 8:48 pm

looks like an auto stick too. Eeeww..

Sun Nov 01, 2009 8:54 pm

Daverham wrote: It may or may not overheat over the winter without proper tin and seals, but he's gonna choke from exhaust fumes with that setup!

I doubt it has working heat.

I wouldn't run the engine any significant distance without tin, even in the winter.

Vanagon tin is different. You want tin from a bus about '72 through '79 to seal the engine compartment. However the tin under the engine (air deflectors) is different from 72-74 and '75-78. We need to see pictures from underneath...

Sun Nov 01, 2009 11:54 pm

If the number was EC0039408 it would be a 1975 Porsche 914, 1800 cc, 73HP engine.

Without the cooling tin, the same air will go around and around getting hotter and hotter until the engine overheats. Driving fast in freezing weather may delay the inevitable but who knows how long.

Maybe someone can supply the tin etc if you run an ad in the classifieds.

Mon Nov 02, 2009 4:26 am

I wont let him drive it without the tin, but there is still concern that it may over heat with the tin. I'll have to check with a friend and see what he might have for a bus motor. Thanks for the replies.

Mon Nov 02, 2009 4:52 am

USMCbug wrote: looks like an auto stick too. Eeeww..

No Bus ever produced came with an auto stick transmission. The Bus was fully automatic, and nothing at all wrong with them.

Mon Nov 02, 2009 5:59 am

At typical winter temperatures in NY I doubt seriously that you are going to overheat your engine with the existing tin, but you will want to have the correct tin before the temperatures get above 50° or so in the spring. Drive it above 60-70° with the engine compartment open like that and you will fry your engine is short order.

The tin your buy needs to match your exhaust system, and since you have a progressive carb you should be looking for the pieces of tin for the right front of the engine that form the air preheat. If you get the preheat tube, it can be fitted to other year tin with minor fabrication and is pretty easy to do while the engine is out.

411/412 tin will mostly work as well, but some of the underneath tin is different and the left rear piece is different as well.