TheSamba.com :: View topic - Setting up a baja to haul a small travel trailor.

Tue Nov 10, 2009 10:06 pm

Howdy yall. i'm thinking about setting up my 69 baja for towing a small two person travel trailor i have. its 18 feet long. not sure how much it weighs. and was just wondering how possible/ hard this is to do. i'm not afraid to weld, or cut up the car in anyway to make it work :twisted: . just wondering what i would have to do to make this happen.

My thoughts were to build a full body cage, with the front beam bolted to it, along with the front beam. maybe go with a 6 inch wider, with stock gusseted arms. and for the rear, have the cage tied to the frame horns, and torsion bar. also to go with coil overs front and back to handle the extra weight. i would also go with boxed trailing arms. maybe 3x3's, but not sure about that. the only thing i'm unsure of, is will the suspension take it? from looking at an IRS suspension on my DD, it seems that a vast percentage of the weight of the car and its load, is dependant on the spring plate. and to me, it doesn't seem like those thin flimsy springplates could hold any extra weight. and the reason i think that, is because when you remove the springplate from the suspension, the trailing arm has a good bit of movement in all directions, which leads me to believe the spring plate holds a good bit of force. so if i were to tow something like a trailor with it, is there a possibility the springplate could bend? oculd this be solved with stock double spring plates, or is there another alternative to this? perhaps those springplate eliminators which use a hiem joint? are those much stronger? i was thinking having coil overs ALONG with torsion bars would be ideal, but thats just speculation. Any ideas, or suggestions, please feel free to chime in. :D

P.S. and before anyone says this, yes i do know this will take a lot of time, and effort. also, NO, i don't want a bus, so don't say "just get a westy". i'd love the idea, and would like to have something different. HATERZ, PLEASE STAY AWAY.

Thanks in advance

-Mike

Tue Nov 10, 2009 10:24 pm

Well first off it seems like you are planning to build one bad ass baja. You should check out the bumper i have. It has extra supports that run into the inside of the car and connect to the heater channels. though i havent towed a trailer, i have been pulled out of some sticky situations by that bumper and pulled a few cars and a few trees. So im sure my bumper could pull a trailer with out a full cage. I just wouldnt trust my breaks.
And the torsion bars and coil over springs is.....what suspension? unless your talking about the stock size shock with a small coil over on it. That might be help full.

Tue Nov 10, 2009 10:28 pm

Ohh wait, small travel trailer :roll: :oops: ok ignore what i just said

Tue Nov 10, 2009 11:26 pm

new brakes. in my experience stopping a trailer is just as important as being able to haul one.

Tue Nov 10, 2009 11:46 pm

I'll bite...

I would only consider using the early IRS double spring-plate setup...I'd probably look for some stock 23.5mm torsion bars from a squareback or 924/944 too...and yes, coilovers when towing would be a good idea.

This trailer has how many axles/brakes? It should have a sticker declaring the weight on the tongue no?

http://www.etrailer.com/faq-trailertowtips.aspx

Wed Nov 11, 2009 5:36 am

a 18 ft trailer is not small, where are you measuring from, if the living compartment is 18 feet then you have another 2 or so feet for the tounge, now were up to 20 feet, thats to much for a bug,you may pull it but your going to have a hard time stopping it, i ve been looking at little trailers to pull behind my baja, i have disc all the way around 3x3's, toyota motor, widened and turned front beam with lifted spindles, i wouldnt go past a 12 foot trailer for safety reasons, maybe you could trade your trailer for a smaller one

Wed Nov 11, 2009 6:32 am

A "small" travel trailer is somewhere between a "teardrop" trailer and a "Casitas" or a "Scamp" (13 ft) .... Anything 18 feet probably weights in at more weight than the BAJA.... Think you need to reconsider "small"... Also anything other than a teardrop or a "Casitas" style style trailer should probably have BRAKES if being towed behind a BAJA or similar small car....

Anything bigger than this is to big...

Dale

Wed Nov 11, 2009 11:36 am

thanks for the responses. yes the trailor does have its own brakes. its a single axle. i got the thing in exchange for some work, so i basically got it for free. its in excellent condition, and just thought i could prolly have my baja tow it. it measures 18 feet from end to end on the OUTSIDE, not counting the rear bumper, or front tounge. i measured it my self. it is pretty old, prolly around late 70's, early 80's. tho my friend brought it to my house (bout 5 mile drive), in his small 4 cylinder toyota truck, and seemed to drive pretty good. it does have a plate, but the only thing on it is a long number (either a serial, or VIN number). well i guess you could say its medium sized, but i used to 32+ foot motor homes, not 18 footers :wink: . but yeah, for the bug i guess it is pretty big. i really didn't want to sell it, since its what i already have and i do like having some space. not to mention how good of condition its in.

I considered disc brakes all around to be a givin, lol. my plan was to use willwood calipers, and drilled rotors all around, and smallish, wide tires (prolly around 28 inch).

Quote: And the torsion bars and coil over springs is.....what suspension? unless your talking about the stock size shock with a small coil over on it. That might be help full.

No not those damn empi coil overs, i mean REAL coil overs (fox, foa, etc.). i was just asking if using coil overs, ALONG with the stock (or maybe even bigger diameter bars) torsion bars would be ideal, or just to go with coil overs ONLY. again, the whole point is to get it to haul as much as possible. do you think i could just have two coil overs on each torsion arm (prolly 3X3's), so that i could have the capacity to lift, and just remove one set, if i wanted to go off-roading?

and yes the plan is to build a bad-ass baja :wink:

thanks
-mike

Wed Nov 11, 2009 11:38 am

Not only do you have to consider the weight of the trailer, you also have to consider the wind resistance and brakeing power. And if you know how to tow, that dosent mean that all the other stupid driver's dont know that you cant stop on a dime. I think that it would be awful nice to be able to pull a trailer with your bug for an extended vacation. but mabye you should look into a small popup that is towed behind a Motorcycle. I pull a 4 foot flatbed with a car top carrier behind my 1100 v-twin and i learned a few things.. speed sucks, wind sucks, hills suck and braking sucks. and that trailer fully loaded only weights 300 lbs. I mean do what you want but remeber it is not only your saftey whiler wuour doing it, but everyone else's on the road that day too.

Wed Nov 11, 2009 11:43 am

I do not like this idea

Wed Nov 11, 2009 11:46 am

tko wrote: Not only do you have to consider the weight of the trailer, you also have to consider the wind resistance and brakeing power. And if you know how to tow, that dosent mean that all the other stupid driver's dont know that you cant stop on a dime. I think that it would be awful nice to be able to pull a trailer with your bug for an extended vacation. but mabye you should look into a small popup that is towed behind a Motorcycle. I pull a 4 foot flatbed with a car top carrier behind my 1100 v-twin and i learned a few things.. speed sucks, wind sucks, hills suck and braking sucks. and that trailer fully loaded only weights 300 lbs. I mean do what you want but remeber it is not only your saftey whiler wuour doing it, but everyone else's on the road that day too.

yes i realize that, thats why i'm here, asking the correct way to do this. safety is on top of the list. and yes i have towed before. i have driving a 79' chevy c30 with a 454, and hauling a 28 foot 70's model gladding del ray 5th wheel camper. and that beast was HEAVY, all wood, no fiberglass anything on this guy. and even with a big block chevy, yes, speed sucked, wind sucked, and stopping sucked.

i was even thinking of perhaps making my own disc brake set-up. maybe using larger 4 piston calipers, with vented, slotted and drilled rotors. haven't done all my reasearch on that yet, so its still on the drawing board. :wink:

Wed Nov 11, 2009 11:46 am

if your worried about the trailer being heavier than the bug first build the bug strong and with low gears maybe even some air shocks in the rear that are easily removable and when its time to go camping just load the bug full of heavy crap :wink:

Wed Nov 11, 2009 11:58 am

I see that I'm not the only one to think about pulling a small camper with a bug. If the camper has electric brakes, you can install an electric brake control unit in the Baja. I plan to put one in mine at some point.

Wed Nov 11, 2009 12:00 pm

lol, yeah.

ok maybe i should have explained all of my plans in the first place. ok here is the plan so far:

-Motor: either a torquey turbo'd VW motor (2110, maybe) or a watercooled motor, if that doesn't pan out

-tranny: high performance bus box, maybe a pro sand, low gears, welded hubs, etc. (all the bells and wishtles).

-large fuel cell where the back seat would go (20+ gals)

-full custom body cage with front and rear suspension tied in.

-brakes: either, willwod calipers and drilled rotors all the way around, OR perhaps fabbing my own brake set-up using large chevy, or ford calipers, and vented/ drilled/ slotted rotors.

- suspension: four coil overs out back, and two up front. beam will be a custom 6 inch wider chromoly, rear will have chromoly 3X3 torsion arms.

again, let me just say, that this is just a project i'm thinking about doing. if it turns out, that this won't work, or it will be too dangerous, i will just forget about it. I got the whole idea from that video thats been floating around, about that company that made a 5th wheel/ goose neck style camper for the bug.

Wed Nov 11, 2009 12:04 pm

Check out "teardrop" trailers....

http://www.mikenchell.com/forums/

Dale

Wed Nov 11, 2009 12:08 pm

baja72 wrote: I see that I'm not the only one to think about pulling a small camper with a bug. If the camper has electric brakes, you can install an electric brake control unit in the Baja. I plan to put one in mine at some point.

i knew i wasn't the only one pondering this, lol. the camper in question does have electric brakes. but i was actually thinking about selling the one i was talking about and building one from the ground up. maybe even bigger and lighter. i have restored motor homes before, and pretty much rebuilt them. the 28 ft. 5th wheel i mentioned above, i had completely torn apart the front 12 feet of it due to bad water damage, and rebilt the whole front end. also, my parents have a 32 foot motor home, and we are in the process of rebuilding it as well. a majority of the drivers side wall has been torn down, and we are currently re-framing it, and runnig all the electrical, and plumbing.

anyhoo, i might just decide to sell the one i have ( tho i really don't want to, lol). and perhaps just build one from scratch, longer, and lighter. using mostly aluminum and fiberglass. and obviously electric brakes definately seems do-able.

Wed Nov 11, 2009 12:20 pm

Dale M. wrote: Check out "teardrop" trailers....

http://www.mikenchell.com/forums/

Dale

WOW. Awsome forum. i've already picked up some good ideas from it, lol. thanks for the link.

Wed Nov 11, 2009 12:32 pm

Wed Nov 11, 2009 4:36 pm

Check this out on youtube

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=56XL0TysIn0

I would love to build one of these

Earthquake

Wed Nov 11, 2009 4:54 pm

I use my 2-liter Type I powered Bay (~3100lbs) to flat-tow my 1620lb drag Beetle...It's all stock suspension/brakes and does the job better than you might expect. In addition to all that there's generally a few spare tires, loaded tool box and 400lbs of people. I can do 80+ on level ground if I want.

FWIW Beetle/Bus share the same wheelbase.