TheSamba.com :: View topic

Thu Jan 07, 2010 1:52 pm

I have two adjusters on my front beam and It appears that the upper one has broken.

i believe the little square block that moves and adjusts the torsion splines is part of the center piece holding those splines but i'm not sure.
Any way this little block along with the Allan nut and bolt that are part of it are completely gone. and my front end is sagged big time Can i salvage or quick fix this. or do i have to take out and rebuild the front end.?

For example i may be able to get into that little spot and weld the torsion holder to the adjuster?

ball joint front end

Thu Jan 07, 2010 3:26 pm

Yes, that little block and the screw that go into that anchor can be replaced. Just get a new adjuster (they're like $12), and use the parts you need. I'd do that before I'd weld it. A spot weld probably wouldn't hold anyway.

Thu Jan 07, 2010 5:40 pm

neanders wrote: Yes, that little block and the screw that go into that anchor can be replaced. Just get a new adjuster (they're like $12), and use the parts you need. I'd do that before I'd weld it. A spot weld probably wouldn't hold anyway.

I was looking for an exploded picture of an adjuster. Does the allen bolt screw in to the innards of the adjuster?

cause the i'm thinking that the nut may be sheared off. i don't think it backed out cause its been Stuck for about 25 years. I have to get in there with a flashlight and mirror later take a look

Thu Jan 07, 2010 6:08 pm

If you can get access to the center piece, you may find one of two things, the Allen bolt is sheared off, or it just unscrewed and is MIA.... IF its MIA All you have to do is get a new block and thread in new Allen head bolt....

If its sheared off , you may be able to drill it and use easy-out to remove broken stub.... If you can, then its just like MIA fix...

"B" is for K&L "A" is for BJ... With bolt actually going into threaded hole at 9:00 position (under 'A') in picture...

IF you cant get stub out, you might have to do drastic things like replacing center section with new adjuster pieces IF you can get old parts to give up and come out...

Dale

Wed Jan 13, 2010 7:10 pm

neanders wrote: Yes, that little block and the screw that go into that anchor can be replaced. Just get a new adjuster (they're like $12), and use the parts you need. I'd do that before I'd weld it. A spot weld probably wouldn't hold anyway.

Well i havent been successfull getting the sheared nut out so I ask again if you all think i could just weld the beam to the adjuster. I'm an ok welder and have a decent mig welder

or if you dont think that will work can i pull the hole torsion springs out with this part on it, replace it with a new inner part and slide it back in?

oh and one other thing somebody said there was a Berg adjuster that bolted on the out side of the tubes and could be installed with the front end in the car...but i do not see this item on their web site..any body know about this?

Wed Jan 13, 2010 7:22 pm

dirtkeeper wrote:

or if you dont think that will work can i pull the hole torsion springs out with this part on it, replace it with a new inner part and slide it back in?

That is what I would try. As long as the adjuster piece will clear the bushings, you should be ok.

You are going to need quite a bit of weld to hold it together reliably. If you do try to weld it, i would weld some 3/8" holes through the outer part of the adjuster and weld there as well to get some more surface area.

Wed Jan 13, 2010 7:48 pm

Keep in mind this is a pointed grub screw. Tightened into the torsion bar stack.... IF you weld it in you will never be able to remove torsion bar stack in future..... Also you will have to pull bushing and bearings on whatever side you try to force center section out of....

There is consequences depending on whatever you decide to do....

Dale

Wed Jan 13, 2010 8:16 pm

How'd it break? Or did you just notice it while under the car?

Kyle

Wed Jan 13, 2010 11:20 pm

kyle_pc_75 wrote: How'd it break? Or did you just notice it while under the car?

Kyle

theres a story behind that

Ya know my boy was home from college for thanks giving week and he was driving the bug and the rear trailing arm busted on him down at the super market..fortunately it wasn't his fault .

http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=387711&highlight=arm

.so i finally get around to installing the trailing arm and drove it a couple times to the store and a week later he showed up on Christmas vacation and he's back driving it. He's driving down the road and it just snapped and the front end dropped. It was totally obvious that the front was now slammed and the ride was nasty. Basically working off just one torsion set . looked at little cool cause the back is jacked up and the car was raked now.

the set screw appears to have broke as opposed to sheared. what was left of the set screw was taller on the upper side and broke at an angle down exposing some threads. seems like an odd failure ..

as far as not removing the torsion set again i can live with that . seems like there is a lot of material to weld .. I'm afraid if i start to tear this thing down its gonna end up on jacks for months while i figure out all the upgrades i wanna make ...while i'm at it . but i wanna be driving it!

I'm gonna fight it a little more to see if i can get the screw out and then maybe try to pull out the torsions

How does the adjuster stay on the torsion set as you put the set in? or is it going to slide around and be pain in the butt?

I dont understand what that set screw in illustration 2 A is it seems to be in the same spot the main bolt goes in?

Thu Jan 14, 2010 8:14 am

Take heed to his words boys and girls.......... adjusters are bad. Just cut and turn!

Thu Jan 14, 2010 9:32 am

dirtkeeper wrote: kyle_pc_75 wrote: How'd it break? Or did you just notice it while under the car?

Kyle

I dont understand what that set screw in illustration 2 A is it seems to be in the same spot the main bolt goes in?

The set screw is 180* out from the adjustment screw. And I doubt you'll pull that anchor out. If your beam is like mine, there are little dimples on the tubes that will prevent that anchor from sliding out. And, do you still have the original bushings? If so, the anchor won't slide past those, either. I would suggest that your best bet is to either use an easyout on that broken screw, or try to weld the anchor in place.

Just my $.02, Neil

Thu Jan 14, 2010 9:54 am

dirtkeeper wrote:

I dont understand what that set screw in illustration 2 A is it seems to be in the same spot the main bolt goes in?.....

....How does the adjuster stay on the torsion set as you put the set in? or is it going to slide around and be pain in the butt?

The angle of the adjuster (or grub screw) in a K&L front end is approximately at the 11:00 position (pointing up) viewed from left side....

The grub screw in a BJ front end is at approximately at the 7:00 position (pointing down) viewed from left side......

There is a 90° difference (orientation) in how grubs screws are located in beams AND the main orientation of torsion leave stack is also 90° different from location in K&L and location of BJ..... Sway-A-Way ALWAYS locates adjuster in the K&L position..... To use a SAW adjusted in a BJ front end you put torsion leaves into center piece and lock them in with SHORT set screw (through slot) , then rotate the center section (90 degrees) so the main locking screw/center section is located in slot in beam.... Also note slot/orientation of "squares" for torsion leaves in center section...

To locate center section while installing torsion stack, you locate the proper hole in center section, loosely put in lock bolt a couple of threads so center section stays centered in beam and orientated (rotationally) while you slide in torsion leaves... If K&L you just tighten things up once everything is in place, if BJ once you have leaves in place you remove bolt, and put in short setscrew and lock leaves into center piece.... Then rotate center csection and torsion leaves (90 degrees) to proper location and install main lock bolt....

AGAIN keep in mind, the shape of torsion stack is NOT symmetrical. AND the orientation of the torsion stack is 90 degrees different for BJ than K&L... And SAW adjuster is ALWAYS installed in K&L, position (according to SAW instructions)

Guess I need to make a PDF file of SAW instructions and post it ... Of you can contact SAW for copy of instructions...

Dale

Thu Jan 14, 2010 9:55 am

neanders wrote:
The set screw is 180* out from the adjustment screw.

Just my $.02, Neil

90 degrees.........

Dale

Thu Jan 14, 2010 9:57 am

Dale M. wrote: neanders wrote:
The set screw is 180* out from the adjustment screw.

Just my $.02, Neil

90 degrees.........

Dale

Yeah, something like that.. ;-)

Thu Jan 14, 2010 11:58 am

neanders wrote: dirtkeeper wrote: kyle_pc_75 wrote: How'd it break? Or did you just notice it while under the car?

Kyle

I dont understand what that set screw in illustration 2 A is it seems to be in the same spot the main bolt goes in?

The set screw is 180* out from the adjustment screw. And I doubt you'll pull that anchor out. If your beam is like mine, there are little dimples on the tubes that will prevent that anchor from sliding out. And, do you still have the original bushings? If so, the anchor won't slide past those, either. I would suggest that your best bet is to either use an easyout on that broken screw, or try to weld the anchor in place.

Just my $.02, Neil

Thanks dale and neil i see how it works now. I put it together 25 years ago and discarded that memory cell long ago.

You've convinced me not to start trying to pull out the torsions and adjuster
I'm gonna give the easy out a little more energy and then will just weld the sucker. I'm assuming the center adjuster piece is steel and not aluminum. Then i think I'll start putting together a replacement front end, probably with some raised spindles and cut and turn instead of adjusters.