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Thu Mar 04, 2010 3:53 pm

I hate to be the newbie beating the same old dead horse. I have searched old forums as best I could, and need your advice. Does this passenger door look like: 1. Stiker problem? 2. Hinge problem? (when I open the door and shake up and down there is very little movement). 3. Body problem (ie I should adjust point A and B and put wedges in and all that?) 4. As good as it gets? It closes fairly well, but that misalignment at the top bugs me.

The supervisor says it's a cool racey-car just like it is.

Fri Mar 05, 2010 12:11 am

Very hard to diagnose with out seeing in person.... I'm in Australia.
But, Most Karmann's I have seen have 'slightly' wonky gaps and lines. You can see the top front is good, and the crease near the door wedge is not bad but the top rear of the door is poor. Looking at the gaps I would pack out the bottom hinge a bit (2mm sheet ali) and the top rear will improve. At this stage I would be reluctant to try the wedges at the rear body mounts as I think it will close the gaps further.
So make some hinge shims and lift the whole door up a mm or so, and pack the bottom hinge out 2mm and aim for a compromise on gaps and body lines that you can live with.
Ian G

Fri Mar 05, 2010 6:12 am

Great. That's the advice I needed. I'll start there and see how it goes.

Fri Mar 05, 2010 6:35 am

I suspect a bad lower hinge. Inspect it VERY close. Open the door and gently lift up on the back edge. Does it rotate up even a fraction? It should immediately start lifting the body, not just the door. A 1/16" movement at the hinge translates to a lot more at the rear of the door.

Fri Mar 05, 2010 7:05 am

It felt really solid to me. The door is open, and I grab the back edge of the door. I lift straight up toward the ceiling, and feel essentially no movement. It actually moves the whole car. Should I also try and twist/ flex the door in clock-wise or counter-clockwise rotation?

Fri Mar 05, 2010 7:21 am

Is the door definitely low or could it be that the chrome/rubber window scraper isn't quite in place properly? It's just all of the other door gap lines look really good. :)

Fri Mar 05, 2010 7:26 am

hudsonce wrote: ... The door is open, and I grab the back edge of the door. I lift straight up toward the ceiling, ...

When you do this test, make sure it's done with the door in a few
partially open positions along with full open.
As said above, any slop or play in the hinges will be
magnified with poor door gaps. To me, your first picture clearly
shows a door too low in the rear.

BTW, I've seen a brutal "quick fix" done for this condition which
involved a hefty floor jack positioned under the rear of an open door.
Use your imagination for the rest, but it's not something
I would recommend. :shock:

Also, how fresh are your door strikers?
Any missing nylon material from inside? Worn striker horizontal pin?

Fri Mar 05, 2010 11:08 am

hudsonce wrote: I hate to be the newbie beating the same old dead horse. I have searched old forums as best I could, and need your advice. Does this passenger door look like: 1. Stiker problem? 2. Hinge problem? (when I open the door and shake up and down there is very little movement). 3. Body problem (ie I should adjust point A and B and put wedges in and all that?) 4. As good as it gets? It closes fairly well, but that misalignment at the top bugs me.

The supervisor says it's a cool racey-car just like it is.

Do not feel bad, I was in the same situation, I thing guias suffer this.

See my post

http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?p=3292608&highlight=#3292608

I did not found any solution and is more o less the same problem that you have.

Ivan.

Fri Mar 05, 2010 11:43 am

Your helper looks really enthusiastic about the project.

Fri Mar 05, 2010 4:16 pm

I'm not sure of your experience with these thing so You probably already know this ..... after shimming the door hinge you will have to reset the door wedge (back of door) and striker plate (on the jamb). You may also have to adjust the window inside the door to roll up into the right place again. (not hard)
On my car i really tried to get the pair of lower trim strips to line up with the front and rear fenders. this helped get the door in the right place. put a string line along the holes all the way down the side of the car.
Ian G

Fri Mar 05, 2010 4:18 pm

Definitely looks like your door is hanging low in the rear. Before you get too carried away though, make sure your opening is true prior to trying to fit the door to it. Previous bodywork may be distorting your margins. Good luck! Foss.

Fri Mar 05, 2010 9:00 pm

Thanks for all the great advice. I must admit I do not know what the door wedge at the back of the door is, or how to adust it. Can anyone show pics and explain how to adjust/ what adjustments will do to overall fit of door?

Fri Mar 05, 2010 10:44 pm

The 'wedge' is like a small wedge of cheese (black rubber) held in by 2 machine screws of the back of the door. When the door shuts it goes into the chrome holder on the jamb. It is there to help take the weight of the door and help with alignment. when I adjust a door I take off the striker and loosen the wedge so the door is free to swing in and out. 'cos sometimes the wedge or the striker is lifting the door up or holding it down. Then I raise or lower the door, add shims etc until I am happy with the door 'look' in the opening. Gaps, crease lines etc. Then put the striker on and adjust, then tighten the wedge to help hold it all steady when it is shut.
Good luck

Sat Mar 06, 2010 6:40 am

If all else fails you could do what I did, I added a shim plate on the bottom hinge between the body and the hinge.
It will increase the gap on the bottom front side of the door, but it looks like you can afford that as your gap gets smaller there anyways.

Sat Mar 06, 2010 8:01 pm

If there is no play in the hinges, I'd give the door a yank up or use a 2x4 to pry it upward, gently, not too much pressure, just enough to repair the damage from people hanging on it through the years.

Sat Mar 06, 2010 8:23 pm

One other thing that didn't cross my mind... You might try removing your striker and see if the door hangs correctly without latching... A poorly positioned striker can push the door out of position. Take off the wedge and striker and see what you get.

I have talked to a few professional german car restorers who use the jack under the door trick. It creeks and cracks like the car is coming apart, but it can fix the sag. Just open the door slightly and put jack under... TRY THIS AT YOUR OWN RISK!!!

Sat Mar 06, 2010 10:04 pm

Is the door original to the car? I am suspect with the respray, since KG's were coachbuilt every car had their little differences and when parts are interchanged they need to be fitted before paint.

Sun Mar 07, 2010 9:07 pm

OOOHHHHH. The wedge.

Ordered two of those.
As usual, I have learned a ton from this forum. Adjusting the striker plate makes a huge differnce, and may be enough to fix the alignment. I think the strikers are worn out, though.

Shouldn't there be a whole crescent shaped rubber bumper on the bottom half. In this picture, there is no rubber below the lower horizontal metal rod. I ordered 2 used strikers in good condition. Doesn't it look like they are just bad as mine?

The top of the striker is to the right. Isn't this one I bought completely missing the rubber bumper on the lower half? Doesn't this affect the way the door closes and fits?

I do think the doors are original. PO assured me the only repair work was a donor back end for part of the rear fenders. The original blue on the door sill and edge of door (not resprayed in sorry paint job) looks identical to original blue under dash, under seats, etc.

I hope that getting door wedge in place and possibly new strikers, I'll be able to adjust it good enough. If not, I'll move on to the hinges. The hinges seem a lot more expensive a solution. Even worse, the other posts sound like even turning the screws is phenomenally difficut.

Sun Mar 07, 2010 11:26 pm

Yes, the striker should have a nylon block all the way down. It is is 2 parts and the lower part is a different material to the top, on many strikers the lower material perishes first. If you hunt, reasonably good strikers can be found with upper and lower blocks in tack. I got some from HOG. A striker will work without the lower block but the action is clunky as all the work is done by the pin in the striker and it wears fast. Your old striker looks better than the 'replacements'
Now you've gone this far, take the old striker off and see how the door swings into the opening, better?
As to the hinges, shims are cheap to make (ali sheet). To get the screws out of the hinge I use the correct size phillips screwdriver and long lock pliers to get some leverage. spray liberally with liquid wrench the day before.

Thu Mar 18, 2010 12:05 am

does anyone know where to get the door hinge bushings, so I can rebuild my door hinges