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Tue Jan 11, 2011 7:30 pm

Hello All,

I'm rebuilding an air-cooled 2.0 for my 81 Westy, and thought I'd throw the progress up on this thread.

I bought my Westy with 2 engines sitting inside the sliding door, and my original plan was to buy a gasket set and just throw the best of the two parts together an do a total low-buck build. However, the more I got into it, and the more I read, the more complete my rebuild became.

Both engines had trashed cams. One had a dropped valve seat. So, I ended up getting a new Scat C-25 grind cam & new lifters:

I used the cam gear from the dead cam that matched the case. It was a real pain to drill out the rivets that held the gear on. I then bolted the new cam to the old gear, and torqued them down with Locktight. Then I needed to grind off the bolt heads to clear the oil pump studs:

I had the better case jetwashed, and the tap-able front and rear oil galley plugs threaded:

I verified that the plugs didn't block any oil passages, and installed the threaded plugs with the threads coated in Toyota OEM FormInPlaceGasket (FIPG). This stuff is incredible, never leaks, and is SO tough that if you off pry an oil pan glued to a block with FIPG, the flange will bend before the FIPG lets go. Hopefully it will prevent the plugs from ever leaking.

The front passenger-side oil galley has a tube inside, so the machine shop couldn't fit a tap in there:

So, I installed a new press-in plug, coated in JB Weld and peened the heck out of it. Hopefully that one won't be coming out unexpectedly.

I also used a paint/rust stripping pad and a ton of lacquer thinner to clean off the filthy cooling tin and fan shroud, and repainted the tin with hammer finish Rustoleum:

Finally, I balanced the rods, pistons, and pins within 1 gram of each other:

I don't want to drop a valve...that would surely kill the fun of a road trip to Moab. So, I got new, deeper valve seats pressed in the heads with a super-tight .005" interference fit. The machine shop inspected the guides and said they were OK.

I'll be posting more pictures and updates as I finally assemble this sucker! Feel free to let me know if you see me making any blatant mistakes!

-Andy

Tue Jan 11, 2011 9:29 pm

Andy,
Great job, I look forward to your updates. I would be curious to know who your supplier for the T4 parts is? I'm not selling parts but will be in the market in the spring for all the build it parts my engine.

Tue Jan 11, 2011 11:26 pm

real nice job andy. the cam bolt heads look the same as mine

Wed Jan 12, 2011 9:19 am

Thanks Guys!

I got my parts from busdepot.com and gowestyautoparts.com.

I got the cam from evwparts.com, but I had to search for "Scat C-25" to find the cam...for some reason it didn't show up if I browsed parts->Type IV->Camshafts.

All three parts suppliers, especially busdepot, have been great. They really know their stuff and have almost everything available. All the threads on thesamba have been a HUGE help too.

My Mahle pistons/cylinders were a major ebay find. Someone used them for a fresh build that was run for about 50 miles and then scrapped after it didn't pass smog testing in CA. They look brand new and were only $150.

The one thing I wasn't able to find are .020 under crank/.020 over case main bearings. I've checked the clearances on mine and they're OK, so I'm reusing them...I kind of have a philosophical problem reusing them, but I guess I don't have much choice.

The machine shop that jet-washed the case and tapped the galleys supplied the threaded galley plugs and the valve seats. They had a really hard time finding new valve seats that were deeper than stock so they would never fall out...they eventually got them from somewhere in Texas, but I don't know where. When the shop was having a hard time finding seats, I called busdepot, gowesty, and airheadparts, and none stocked valve seats.

This is the tenth engine I've rebuilt and my first aircooled VW. It's very different from the Toyota, Nissan, and water-cooled VWs I've built. With those, you can get everything from FLAPS or complete rebuild kits on ebay, and you just throw the parts together and everything fits properly and works.

I've been surprised how difficult it has been to find parts. How everything needs to be assembled, measured, and shimmed to fit correctly. Also this is the first time I've experienced an angle grinder and dremel being essential engine building tools.

Later,
-Andy

Wed Jan 12, 2011 9:46 am

If bearings are within spec for new parts, then you are better off reusing them than replacing them.

It is possible to tap and install a threaded plug into that last galley plug hole. You just need to get a sacrificial tap and keep grinding it down as you go. I've done it a couple of times. That said, you plug should hold just fine.

Wed Jan 12, 2011 9:58 am

veloandy wrote:
They had a really hard time finding new valve seats that were deeper than stock so they would never fall out... -Andy
Never say Never- You are going about this rebuild correctly but I will warn you against installing deeper valve seats especially on the exhaust side. There is VERY little supporting the seat on the short side radius of the exhaust port and they are known for sinking due to high EGTs if they have not already.If the seats have already moved some welding may be required. More interference fit is what is needed, than the factory gave the original seats.
I would install 36mm exhaust seats and valves from a 2.0 914 Porsche along with port blending and a better flowing exhaust.
Make sure you ave no more tha 1mm deck height without using headgaskets, use cylinder shims instead.

Wed Jan 12, 2011 9:20 pm

Quote: Never say Never- You are going about this rebuild correctly but I will warn you against installing deeper valve seats especially on the exhaust side. There is VERY little supporting the seat on the short side radius of the exhaust port and they are known for sinking due to high EGTs if they have not already.

Thanks for the info & warning, Joe VW...I totally agree that "never" is too strong of a statement...BUT I wanted to do everything I could to prevent valve seats from dropping.

I got out my dial caliper and the new valve seats are only about .030" deeper than the old dropped seat:

I see what you mean about the lack of supporting material on the short side radius...I can still see a fair chunk of aluminum supporting the seat:

Luckily I had spare heads, so I didn't reuse any that had already had a seat drop, so hopefully the aluminum wasn't pounded/pushed around too much.

The work is done. I think I'll run it as-is. I hope it ends up being durable...Time will tell.

Quote: I would install 36mm exhaust seats and valves from a 2.0 914 Porsche along with port blending and a better flowing exhaust.

This sounds like a great idea...but those 36mm valves are expensive buggers! I've already gone with stock (32.9mm?) exhaust valves and seats, so we'll see how it goes. Hopefully the cam alone with the stock valves will make it a little less of a dog.

As far as exhaust goes, my plan is to first get it running and passing smog with the kludged, rusty, hillbilly, POS exhaust that came with it, then replace the rotted top canvas and seals, then clean out the interior...then then I'll re-evaluate my priorities, including a non-ghetto exhaust.

Wed Jan 12, 2011 9:27 pm

Quote: The front passenger-side oil galley has a tube inside, so the machine shop couldn't fit a tap in there

That tube looks odd and peaked my curiosity. I pulled that plug out of all three of my cases tonight and none of them had that tube or protrusion in them, just drilled right through. I have a 1980, a 1982 and a 1983 case so maybe your case just didn't have that excess material drilled out. It looks like this gallery is for the lifter bore pressure feed and it was drilled from the flywheel end so there shouldn't be that protrusion. Maybe there was more than on manufacturer and the oil galleries were drilled differently, who knows. Not that any of this matters as you have plugged it rather permanently.

I am also having trouble finding bearings as I will end up with an under size crank and an align bored case as well. That is the reason I bought two spare engines, I was trying to get a STD/STD combination because those bearings are still available around here.

Wed Jan 12, 2011 9:29 pm

So, I went to check the rod bearing clearance (and bolt on the rods and maybe put the case together) tonight, and it seems like I have the wrong bearings!!

My old bearings had .25 stamped on the back, so I ordered some .25mm/.010" over Brazilian rod bearings from busdepot.com. When I went to install them, they seem to be the wrong diameter! (new bearing on the top, old bearing on the bottom):

Son of a nutcracker!

But the box looks like it says they are .25mm over for 1.8 and 2.0 VW engines:

Maybe they're for some Watercooled VW inline 4 or something?? I've emailed busdepot to see if they know what the deal is and if I can return them since I've opened the shrink wrap. We'll see.

In the mean time, I'm considering Plasti-gauging the old bearings and reusing them...I'd really prefer to do new ones if possible, though!!

My advice for anyone rebuilding an air cooled 2.0 is to save/sort/tag EVERYTHING on tear down...You might end up re-using more than you expect.

Thu Jan 13, 2011 10:29 pm

Talked to Matt at BusDepot today. BusDepot is really great.

They thought the bearings I got may have been boxed incorrectly. I ordered and paid for some German bearings (at ~$40 instead of ~$12 for the Brazilian bearings). BusDepot paid for shipping.

When the bearings arrive, Matt at BusDepot requested I compare them to the other bearings as best I can BEFORE removing them from the shrink wrap and then give them a call. They will allow me to return any sets that don't work and will pay for return shipping.

Sounds like a good deal to me... Great guys and great customer service.

I just hope the German bearings arrive SOON! I'm sick of having my garage full of a bunch of disassembled VW parts and would much rather have a complete engine sitting in it instead!

Fri Jan 14, 2011 6:08 pm

I agree that Busdepot is a good company, they seem to not have an agenda in their buisness practice like a particular type 4 vendor. Did you get to the oil pump stage of the re-do-it? I'd like to find a supplier for one.

Sat Jan 15, 2011 2:15 pm

Mr Brown said: Quote: I pulled that plug out of all three of my cases tonight and none of them had that tube or protrusion in them, just drilled right through. I have a 1980, a 1982 and a 1983 case so maybe your case just didn't have that excess material drilled out. Sorry, Mr Brown! I missed your post. I agree that the tube looks kind of weird...but the actual location of all the oil passages in the case is enough of a mystery to me that I didn't quite have the guts to start drilling. On the other hand, my main goal was to not have the oil galley plugs pop out...hopefully my galley plug fix will prevent that!

Mr Brown also said: Quote: That is the reason I bought two spare engines, I was trying to get a STD/STD combination because those bearings are still available around here. One of my spare engines is std/std...the tragedy is that the P.O. drilled a hole through the case when he tried to fix a snapped off engine tin screw...non-std main bearings are rare enough that finding someone with the experience/equipment/cajones to weld up a hole in the magnesium case might be worth it if I ever have the opportunity to build a type IV engine again.

That said, type IV parts are so pricey & waiting for replacement parts is taking SO long that I'm not sure I'd build a type IV again...Subaru swaps are looking more and more attractive, despite the need to add a radiator and heater cores. I've seen a couple of complete 2.2L Subarus on local Craigslist for way less $$ than I have in the engine so far...and right now I'm feeling like I could work through the wiring harness and cooling system in the time I've spent waiting on type IV engine parts. Of course, the KEP adapter + motor mounts would exceed the cost of the type IV engine...and if I went for a Subaru swap, I'm sure I'd be kicking myself for not sticking with the stock engine. The grass is always greener.

VW George said: Quote: Did you get to the oil pump stage of the re-do-it? I'd like to find a supplier for one. I pulled the old oil pump apart, and it looks OK. The backing plate had a little wear but didn't seem too scored up. I just cleaned it out, put on a new O-ring, and plan on reusing it. The Bentley manual didn't have a really good section on how to check the type IV pump because it's hard to measure the clearance between the gears and the backing plate...We'll see how that turns out.

If you have any great quantitative methods for checking the oil pump condition before running it, I'm all ears!

Sat Jan 15, 2011 4:30 pm

That type IV case is aluminum not magnesium. Only the beetle (and early bus) got the magnesium case.

Sat Jan 15, 2011 9:13 pm

Where is the location of the hole? Could you just tap it and install a threaded plug like in the galley plug replacements?

Sat Jan 15, 2011 11:38 pm

1800 and 2000 cid Type 4 engines do not use the same connecting rod bearings. 1700 and 1800 bearings are the same, but 2000's use a different bearing.

Sun Jan 16, 2011 4:01 pm

Thanks for the input everyone!

xoo00oox wrote: Quote: That type IV case is aluminum not magnesium. Only the beetle (and early bus) got the magnesium case. Thanks! Good to know.
+ I guess it will be easier to find someone to weld on it if the need arises :-)
- I guess we can scratch type IV cases off our lists of raw materials for pyrotechnics :-(

Andrew A. Libby wrote: Quote: Where is the location of the hole? Could you just tap it and install a threaded plug like in the galley plug replacements? The hole is a 3/8" hole drilled through the original tapped hole for the cooling tin on the top of the case...it could maybe be JB-welded up (or tapped, plugged, and the plug tapped for the smaller engine tin screws). I just decided not to mess with it b/c the westy came with another engine.

Wildthings said: Quote: 1800 and 2000 cid Type 4 engines do not use the same connecting rod bearings. 1700 and 1800 bearings are the same, but 2000's use a different bearing. You're totally right. Thanks. They must have sent the wrong bearings. Hopefully the German bearings will be right.

I decided to stop whining and complaining about waiting on parts and get on to putting my heads back together. I got new valves. When I removed my old valves, my Craftsman C-clamp-style valve spring compressor marred up the carbon on the old valve faces:

So I slipped some vinyl tubing over the end of it to make sure I didn't mar up the new valves:

Getting the valve keepers on was a P.I.T.A. because the valve spring compressor didn't have quite enough swing...I'd have to 1) get it on as tight as I could uncompressed 2) compress the spring all the way 3) wiggle it around until I could get one keeper on 4) open the valve spring compressor 5) adjust it so it was tighter 6) re-compress the valve spring and put the 2nd keeper in there.

After 90 minutes and some blood, sweat, and tears, they're all in!

I still need to put plugs in and pull the Ratwell trick of checking if the valves are solvent-tight...but it's getting there.

Later,
-Andy

Mon Jan 24, 2011 7:52 pm

So, the build continues, slowly but surely...

The replacement German rod bearings from Bus Depot fit correctly. I used Plastigauge to check the bearing clearances. Plastigauge is basically a strand of plastic hair. You put it on a bearing, torque it down, and the width to which the plastic squishes indicates the clearance. The thing is, you can't spin the bearing with the Plastigauge inside because it will smear and ruin the reading.

This normally isn't a big deal with normal engines where you put the rods on *after* putting the crank in the block...it was kind of tricky to do on the VW with the crank outside of the case. It worked pretty well to just lean the rods up against the case while I torqued them down:

Note the new rod bushing...I hadn't planned on replacing these, so I had to re-order them when the old ones were slightly too big, which was another parts delay. I was able to push the new ones with a vice, but 30 minutes with a drill and master cylinder hone were insufficient to ream them to fit...I ended up having the machine shop ream them for $10 a piece.

All the rod bearings had just under .002" clearance. Perfect:

I then checked the distributor shaft clearance. The shim that I reused was in spec.

Finally, I coated the bearing surfaces in assembly lube, coated the cam lobes in the cam lube that came with my cam, and put Toyota FIPG around the perimeter of the case!

I'm glad the John Muir in How to Keep Your VW alive suggested checking that the crank turns freely as you SLOWLY crank down the case bolts...the front bearing was slightly off of its dowel, and the crank started getting hard to turn when I had the front case bolts just 1/4 turn past finger-tight. I was able to loosen the bolts, open the crack between the case halves just a tad, and rotate it into position without re-splitting it. After that was fixed, the crank spun easily, so I don't think I did any damage to the bearing.

Here is the beautiful case with all the case bolts torqued down!

Then I went to set the end play. It was hard to measure the end play with my dial caliper. I was getting variances in my readings of > .003, which made me less-than-confident in setting the end play to .004...so I resorted to setting it using the Muir washer & feeler gauge trick (note the bolt/washer in the upper left):

I torqued down the 3/4 cylinder head...I'm leaving the 1/2 head off until I get the oil seals/pulley on so I can verify the TDC mark.

I'm hoping I'm less than 3 beers away from the end of the engine build...just the lifters, push rods, valve rockers, distributor, other head, oil filter and engine tin left!

Mon Jan 24, 2011 9:20 pm

You might want to lap the oil pressure relief piston to the seat in the case before you get it all together so you can clean it. I have been doing some research in the performance forum and this seems to be something necessary on the cases to make sure you have decent oil pressure.

Mon Jan 24, 2011 10:10 pm

veloandy wrote: Then I went to set the end play. It was hard to measure the end play with my dial caliper. I was getting variances in my readings of > .003, which made me less-than-confident in setting the end play to .004...

How well did the thrust bearings fit to the case. It is not entirely uncommon for the case to be worn to the point that the bearing moves and so makes endplay impossible to set properly. It's very important that the case is not worn in that way. If it is, then either locate oversize thrust (last I checked they were made from rocking horse poo) or replace the case.

Tue Jan 25, 2011 12:46 am

reluctantartist wrote: You might want to lap the oil pressure relief piston to the seat in the case before you get it all together so you can clean it. I have been doing some research in the performance forum and this seems to be something necessary on the cases to make sure you have decent oil pressure.

There is a reason the piston and seat aren't all that clean where they contact to start with. The seal of the piston against the "seat" has almost nothing to do with the operating pressure. The valve begins to relieve pressure not when it leaves the seat, but after it is pressed down far enough to begin to open the port on the side of the bore.