TheSamba.com :: View topic - Englishtown - Spring Classic VW Show & Go

Mon Apr 16, 2012 4:51 am

Bucky wrote: offthewall wrote: Great show yesterday!

Had a lot of nice conversation with anonymous passers by. Jeff and the judges put the fear of god into me concerning my post fuel pump fuel filter so I bought some matching braided German fuel hose and did a little fuel mod on the show parking lot. Ha ha. I realized I probably didn't need the second filter since I put a new fuel pump on last year.

Screw the weatherman, he was completely off and the weather was near perfect.

The Yellow vert took first place in class and we drove the hour plus home with the top down.

Glad to hear you fixed that filter, didn't want to see pictures of such a nice ride ending up in one of the burning VW threads. Thanks for coming out.
I met a very nice guy that had a beautiful Beetle but had 2 glass filters, one on the inlet and outlet of the pump and a cheap regulator with a mechanical pump. I talked to him about the possible problems caused by using those filters and all the connections. I explained that a cheap metal filter by the tranny or under the tank is much safer. Also that he can eliminate the regulator by shimming the stock pump.

What shows do is allow people to get CONSTRUCTIVE criticism and ideas from more experienced people. You just have to be tactful about it and they need to be receptive.

Mon Apr 16, 2012 6:39 am

I had a great show sold lots of parts and bought lots of parts, great weather and good turn out cant wait till fall

Mon Apr 16, 2012 9:07 am

Hey volks, the weather held out and we had an awesome show, the swap seemed to drop a few years ago but the last couple years it seems to be getting bigger and bigger and yesterday was no different. A great turnout overall. Kudos to those who brought their cars to the show blowing off the potential for rain. We had a hard core group there and you guys are the best.

And not to beat a dead horse, but webwalker, you are sorely mistaken. I've had the pleasure of managing both the spring and fall shows for almost ten years. I can personally guarantee you that a modified car has never won in a stock class. I will also offer you a hundred bucks to prove me wrong.

Now you may have seen a modified car parked in a stock class. That was most likely because of space issues, but I guarantee you it was judged in it's proper class. Sometimes a car may initially be mis-classed when it first arrives, but usually when it comes time to judge, the error is discovered and judged in it's proper class. It sometimes becomes difficult when a car has significantly modified and used parts from a different year, like an oval on a late model pan, or a late model car with early fenders and deck lids. We then sometimes need to make a judgement call. Maybe leave the late model car with the early fenders and hoods in the late class, and move the oval with the late pan, into the early class.

As been noted, judging shows is a thankless job. We are a volunteer organization and we do our best to be fair and accurate. We have made it a point to always be above board at our shows. We do have many inexperienced judges but we always partner them with other, more experience judges. We have also trained out judges to focus on fit and finish and not on personal taste. You may not like the look of a modification, it's style, color, or anything else, but if it's done well, you must award it the points it deserves.

That being said VW shows in the northeast are hardly "Concourse de Elegance" shows. You don't need to get down on your knees and crawl under every car nor do you need to compare repro parts to originals. In most classes you can often walk the class and easily pick out the top three or four. We would then focus our energy at looking closely at the details and difference of those cars.

Another issue we faced is how to address club cars in the show. A few years back we had a stead fast rule that if you were a club member, you were required to put your car in the show, but it would not be judged. We wanted to have our cars in the show to not only share them, but to help fill out the field. We didn't want to create the potential of a conflict of interest with non-members. This started to become an issue with members who have invested a lot of time and money into their cars and and if they wanted a little recognition of all their hard work, they had to go out-of-state because at the time our club was managing the spring and fall e-town shows, PunchBuggy as well as our own shows like the All Air-Cooled Gathering. This was a bit unfair. So we came up with a new rule which allowed club cars to compete at e-town but not our own shows and we no-longer are involved in PunchBuggy. The basic idea is that if two cars were close in placing for an award, one being a club car, the other a non-club car, we would automatically award the trophy to the non-club car. We felt this was the best way to let our members compete and prevent any conflict of interest charges against us. So far it's worked pretty well.

As Bucky so diplomatically said, we do appreciate any and all comments, either good or bad. This show has been around for many years and we want to continue to make it happen. Judging by the turn-out yesterday, even under the threat of rain, the show will most likely be around for many years to come.

If anyone has anything they would like to discuss about the Central Jersey Volkswagen Society of the shows we are involved in, please feel free to PM, email or call Buck or myself, we are happy to discuss and will take all issues seriously.

-jeffrey

Mon Apr 16, 2012 9:40 am

One other thing about the pricing. It is the same as it has been for the last three shows. They raised the rate at the Spring 2011 show. It was a $5.00 raise across the board. The last time they raised their entrance fees was in the 90's. My apologies about the website that was posted with the old pricing on it. That wasn't an official site and I'll inform the web-master to the pricing change. There was no "last minute" change or bait and switch thing at the door. Like I said before, the pricing changed at the spring 2011 show.

One compromise they did make was the addition of the "Exhibition" class. It is a reduced fee to have your car in the show, but not to compete for a trophy.

The fee structure is something like this.

Spectator is $20 [used to be $15]
Exhibition is $25 [new category]
Show is $30 [used to be $25]

Vendor space is still what it has been for the last five years $35 for a 20x20 space. If you have a bus or pick-up, you may only need a single 20x20 spot. If you have a truck and small trailer you'll probably need two spaces. If you have a longer trailer and your rig is over 40ft, you'll need three spaces. CJVWS negotiated this flat fee from the prior fee structure that had significant differences between new and used parts vendors [both higher].

We've had numerous conversations with the track regarding the raise. Taxes are higher, insurance is higher, overall all operating costs are higher and they held out as long as they could. I did throw out an idea that might help a little. I suggested a $5.00 coupon that could be distributed to clubs and local shops to help stimulate attendance. I'll keep you all posted on what happens. It may be the best we can do.

FWIW, it still is much cheaper than some of the import and hot-rod shows they have and for a full day of entertainment [show, swap, races etc], it really isn't that expensive. Specially with $12+ two-hour movie tickets, or have you tried to go to a pro baseball/basketball/football game recently? $20 is a bargain.

-jeffrey

Mon Apr 16, 2012 9:40 am

Just passing along something I read on the water cooled forum.....

There was a bmw wagon parked BLASTING music parked in the show field that irritated a lot of people that should not have been there.

Also, the DJ is useless. I am not sure to many people actually enjoyed it and maybe he could be cut to save some money and headache for the fall and future shows.

Thank you guys for putting on the show and we will continue to come and support it year after year

Mon Apr 16, 2012 9:46 am

The DJ is another thing we are working on. Unfortunately many of the water cooled folk dig it and because they make up a significantly larger part of the event, we gotta live with it. However we are trying to negotiate the level and content.

And spotspeed, we appreciate your support.

-jeffrey

Mon Apr 16, 2012 10:53 am

We came yesterday with a racecar and 6 people and since this event is only 40 minutes from home we don't want to lose it. For us it is a low key day where we can bring out friends and family and not have a real high pressure event.

The car show did look big as we drove past and the swap had people that kept coming and coming so you must be doing something right!

Mon Apr 16, 2012 11:17 am

Jhicken:

I havent been to this show since 2010 because well, e-town is just not what it was and isnt a priority show for me anymore which is a damn shame because E-town for me was THE show to get to. So that being said when the link on 16vgti says. $15 and we get there and its $20 and your paying for several people its suddenly quite a few bucks more. When I questioned the kid at the gate he just said "sorry they raised the price" The swap wasnt that great this year, not that many aircooled vendors and not that much nice stuff or that much stuff in general it seemed real thin this year... what was there for the most part seemed to be just basically the same stuff vendor to vendor (and I guess that varies depending on what your looking for), the show cars were better than a few years ago but work has to be done to entice more people into showing. I personally dont watch the drags too often. Ive been to some shows where if you wanted to watch the drags it was a seperate fee from the show. That was nice. Why pay for something you have no interest in watching? Also I have to ask this of many shows, WHY does it cost so much for someone to put their car in the show? Lets be honest the people that put their cars in the show ARE the show and they are the ones that are bringing the spectators in to see the show. If your showing your car it should be either cheaper for all in the car or one fee for the car and its passengers regardless of how many (many car shows do that) how many car shows have you been to where the parking lot has more/nicer cars in it than the show !? As an organizer I would have to question why this is. And that bmw, wtf? Also that d.j. the music was horrible enough and thats fine but did you listen to the lyrics? Bitch this, fuck that, sexual references etc.......KIDS are at this show! Before you go and say " you think this is so easy you do it" I'm working on getting a show in my town at the fairgrounds here. Shows are being lost and I think it has to do with many issues brought up here by many.

I should say THANK YOU though to you and the other organizers, I realize that with some of this you may have your hands tied and have to just conform to the venue to make this happen.

Mon Apr 16, 2012 12:10 pm

I came, I swapped..I had a BLAST !!

It was great seeing everyone I haven't seen all winter, and even though I honestly tried to come home with less then I came with...I just couldn't help myself with a few buys just because the prices ( at least on the few things I bought ) were total scores.

Like I told you guys at the club tent, you folks do a great job with the Flanders show and you're doing a great job with what you have to work with at E town as well.
I understand what has to be tolerated in order to "pay the bills" as far as putting on a show and making it happen.

Didn't even get a chance to walk the show myself, I was too busy scoring deals and selling stuff !
I think you may have to allocate more space for swappers though.
Looked like vendors were getting jammed where-ever they could fit by late morning

BTW.. Manny and Stan, THANK YOU AGAIN for saving me a spot next to ya !

Mon Apr 16, 2012 12:31 pm

ovalteen wrote: Jhicken:

I havent been to this show since 2010 because well, e-town is just not what it was and isnt a priority show for me anymore which is a damn shame because E-town for me was THE show to get to. So that being said when the link on 16vgti says. $15 and we get there and its $20 and your paying for several people its suddenly quite a few bucks more. When I questioned the kid at the gate he just said "sorry they raised the price"
You do understand that the CJVWS has no control over the fees. That's all done by Raceway Park.

Mon Apr 16, 2012 2:23 pm

Enjoyed the show very much as always.

No matter how many cars were there or the show is growing or losing fans, I still try to attend and enjoy the show.

It is not an everyday or everyweek meeting, it is only once or twice a year thing that we all fan could get together and having a good time with their loving VWs. So 20 dollars did not bother me at all. (For me the tolls for NJTP, GWB, & Lincoln Tnnl are ridicurus!!)

As I work for some IT company I host a few IT shows and Expos every year. I know how hard it takes to be a host even a small shows. (Next month I will host a cloud computing expo in Tokyo that took me a half year to prepare)

Also, the samething happens to my local surfing community. Now people are buying cheap surfboards and wetsuits from internet or wherever sold cheaper. People stop supporting local shops & communities. Surfing was not like that before when i started to surf about 20 yrs ago. If surfers do not respect and support local clubs, we lose our surfshops and beaches. What happens after? We can not host surfng contests or even small beach BBQ gathering anymore. Noone cannot provide any wave report.
People seem to forget how important to support local communities, now people only judge if the contest was fun or BBQ was cheap.

"Participating has meaning"
I'm sure you still go to your best friends wedding even though there is no free parking, dancing, food, or open bars...

Anyways, thanks for all the work to make it happen every year.
(Sorry for my bad Japanish English...)

Mon Apr 16, 2012 2:30 pm

Glenn wrote: ovalteen wrote: Jhicken:

I havent been to this show since 2010 because well, e-town is just not what it was and isnt a priority show for me anymore which is a damn shame because E-town for me was THE show to get to. So that being said when the link on 16vgti says. $15 and we get there and its $20 and your paying for several people its suddenly quite a few bucks more. When I questioned the kid at the gate he just said "sorry they raised the price"
You do understand that the CJVWS has no control over the fees. That's all done by Raceway Park.

Yes I do, I never said cjvw's controlled that anywhere in my messages. Raceway park is going to screw themselves out of money eventually. If you read the last paragraph of my last post you will see that I commented on the fact that some of these things they have nothing to do with.

Mon Apr 16, 2012 2:38 pm

jhicken wrote: The DJ is another thing we are working on. Unfortunately many of the water cooled folk dig it and because they make up a significantly larger part of the event, we gotta live with it. However we are trying to negotiate the level and content.

And spotspeed, we appreciate your support.

-jeffrey

As I stated before, we had a great time. I had my '72 vert and my son was in the water-cooled area with his 2004 R32. We look forward to the Spring and Fall versions every year. It's one of the few shows we can both bring our cars to. Much appreciated to all for putting on a great show! It must be a monumental amount of work. Keep up the good work and know that we thank you for it.

BUT, now that's it's been brought up by others, that DJ was the worst. Even my son and his two friends (all 19), thought he was terrible and these are Skrillex, Deadmau5, Bassnectar, etc. concert goers . I'm in the music business and have eclectic tastes and can appreciate most any genre. Every year we jokingly refer to that particular genre as "two-morons-in-a-parking-lot". LOL. With the type of audience you have for the show, you'd be much better served by a wedding type DJ playing a variety of music instead of just "t-m-i-a-p-l" noise.

Mon Apr 16, 2012 6:46 pm

My wife and I made the long drive up yesterday and had a great time. Thanks to those who put on the show. I can only imagine how much work that is. We will be back next year. Thanks to all the swappers. Spent way too much money on parts.

Tue Apr 17, 2012 7:18 am

ovalteen wrote: I havent been to this show since 2010 because well, e-town is just not what it was and isnt a priority show for me anymore which is a damn shame because E-town for me was THE show to get to.

Other than the extra $5.00 and the music [which has always been challenging], you haven't said what was significantly different. The swap has been growing over the last few years. Maybe the reason you aren't finding much new is because you have found much of what you needed in the past. I walked the swap and saw a little of everything. Original body parts [even a few bulleted front fenders for the guy who asked about them earlier], engine parts, a few project cars and a whole lot more. Hell one of our members found a 40's ford headlight that he's gonna modify and mount on the top of his double cab. The same cat also picked up a set of widened 14" steel wheels with 12" slicks on them. I'm afraid to know what those might end up on. The swap had a lot, maybe not exactly what you were looking for, at the price you were willing to pay, but there was a lot.

ovalteen wrote: So that being said when the link on 16vgti says. $15 and we get there and its $20 and your paying for several people its suddenly quite a few bucks more.

Key issue here was a misprint on Charlie's site [www.gti16v.com], I'll send Charlie an updated price list so this doesn't happen again. But the actual price is the same as it was last year.

ovalteen wrote:
I personally dont watch the drags too often. Ive been to some shows where if you wanted to watch the drags it was a seperate fee from the show. That was nice. Why pay for something you have no interest in watching?

I guess that would depend on the venue. The drags are adjacent to the show so it would be hard to prevent "non-paying" folk from watching the drags. Of the local track/venues, E-town, Atco, Maplegrove would all suffer the same. Like cable TV, it's all bundled together to make it affordable to everyone. If they started to break it all up a la carte, then the you would be seeing really high prices for everything. Some folks come only for the races, some only fro the show, and some only for the swap. If we did that, folks would complain about having to walk past all the water cooled parts to get to the air cooled parts they are looking for, then others would wonder why they have to pay so much for the show when they only want to see the air cooled and not having to stomach the water cooled. then you would have to break it down even more for the air and water part of the event. So the best solution is to have a big event with everything so we can all get in at a reasonable price.

ovalteen wrote:
Also I have to ask this of many shows, WHY does it cost so much for someone to put their car in the show? Lets be honest the people that put their cars in the show ARE the show and they are the ones that are bringing the spectators in to see the show. If your showing your car it should be either cheaper for all in the car or one fee for the car and its passengers regardless of how many (many car shows do that) how many car shows have you been to where the parking lot has more/nicer cars in it than the show !? As an organizer I would have to question why this is.

Really? Again, like the topic above, it all comes down to affordability. Based on your plan, if every show car came in with three passengers [or spectators], that would revenue loss of $60 per car. If there were 500 cars in the show that would be a loss of $30k. Where would that come from? You think showing your car for $30 was bad, bump that up to $90 per car [but your three friends would get in free]. The track pays thousands of dollars a day for insurance so it needs to keep it's fees in line to cover that. It ain't cheap.

ovalteen wrote:
And that bmw, wtf? Also that d.j. the music was horrible enough and thats fine but did you listen to the lyrics? Bitch this, fuck that, sexual references etc.......KIDS are at this show!

Like I said before, this is being addressed.

ovalteen wrote:
Before you go and say " you think this is so easy you do it" I'm working on getting a show in my town at the fairgrounds here. Shows are being lost and I think it has to do with many issues brought up here by many.

I would never say that, you'll soon learn what it takes to put on a successful event. Even as good as our All Air-Cooled Gathering has become, it's not a money maker. After paying for all the expenses, all what is left goes to our charity. Even if we kept it, for the hundreds of hours of time and effort we all put into it, we would be making less than Chinese labor rates.

E-town is a business, they don't make much from our show [after expenses], but some of their other high-dollar events help support ours [familiar concept?]

ovalteen wrote: I should say THANK YOU though to you and the other organizers, I realize that with some of this you may have your hands tied and have to just conform to the venue to make this happen.

You're welcome, but overall I feel the pricing it fair, the venue is good, and the event is a decent one. We will always have small issues here that we will be dealing with on a show by show basis, but I really feel all in all it's a good one but I would be nice if we could get a little more support from the air-cooled community and have them bring their cars out more often.

As for the demise of a few local shows, I honestly feel that it is more due to the attitude, expectations and commitment of many of the participants. There are a lot of nice cars out there and if more folks supported our local events they all would be better.

I hope you don't feel I'm singling your post out, or I'm pissed about it. I'm going through all this because you raise a few good points, ones that I'm sure are on the minds of everyone and I hope you understand that we are doing our best to address the ones we can, and live with the ones we cant. As Bucky noted before, we want to hear about all the good and bad so hopefully we can continue to make it better.

-jeffrey

Tue Apr 17, 2012 7:57 am

How about we end all this back and forth about what amounts to be $5 with Jeff's post and we post some PICTURES, This was a huge show this past weekend, I don't remember the last time I saw so many cars in the show area at either the spring or fall show in a very long time.
Thanks for all your hard work Jeff and crew.

Tue Apr 17, 2012 8:07 am

Re: the swaps I spoke to a few people who were delighted with their finds, specifically original steering wheels in near perfect condition for around $20-$30 bucks. I also saw some OG bumpers and pop-outs in excellent condition. All of this is stuff I haven't usually seen, especially when I was looking for it!

Tue Apr 17, 2012 8:59 am

we came out and had a great time. we sold some tshirts and i am so glad everyone liked them...!
i had a few people come up to us a mention the samba....very cool.
thank you CJVWS for putting the show together....

in my opinion, we wouldnt have a show if you guys didnt put in all that hard work, so with that being said, i dont mind paying an extra 5 bucks or listening to some crappy music....you win some and you lose.
keep up the good work! thanks again 8)

Tue Apr 17, 2012 12:54 pm

is there a new matching color class at this event?

Tue Apr 17, 2012 1:10 pm

mannys66 wrote: is there a new matching color class at this event?

Looks like a reverse-rake competition. :D