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Wed Apr 11, 2012 6:21 pm

I maybe should have researched a little bit more before deciding to re-use the stock switches, but I've built my switch panel out of steel for the stock switched (mounting them) and I bought fancy billet pull knobs that I'd like to use.

So...

I began to look at wiring and blending the stock wiring diagram with the blanket one that came with the "it's a snap" harness I bought, after my headache cleared. I came to the conclusion that I want to seperate the turn signal and hazard circuits and use seperate flashers.

I started playing with the hazard switch and the only terminal that is live when the switch is pulled is the white wire marked "+". Can I simply use this lead for my hazards and run everything back from there? I'll be using LEDS for all turn signals. I'm using an EL12 flasher and I understand some have had luck running LEDS off this flasher. I tested this setup with an offroad light that was within grabbing range and it "seemed" to work.

Am I going to lose other functions that I'm not thinking of? Will the stock turnsignal switch still work with a seperate flasher?

Jason

Wed Apr 11, 2012 6:51 pm

Wed Apr 11, 2012 7:02 pm

I have that image saved.

Forgive my ignorance but I can't find the answer to my question by looking at the diagram. I understand (mostly) the layout of the hazard switch.

Can I use the "+" terminal and forget the rest, without effecting the stock turnsignal?

Wed Apr 11, 2012 8:45 pm

There may be one terminal that goes live, but there are probably several terminal that go to left and right side lamps that are tied "together" ( L & R Terminals) when switch is pulled so all four corners and flashing at same time....

This document will tell you what the numbers mean and may be some clues on how switch functions...

http://www.e38.org/understanding%20euro%20wiring%20diagrams.pdf

If you go to this wiring diagram it pretty well lays out how hazard switch wires....

http://www.thesamba.com/vw/archives/info/wiring/bug_7071.jpg

Dale

Wed Apr 11, 2012 9:05 pm

Dale, thanks for the link, I'll read it now.

That's the diagram I've been using. I find it by far the easiest to read.

Wed Apr 11, 2012 9:17 pm

The problem is that the hazard lights have to interact with the turn signals. It shorts the left and right side together and connects that to the flasher.

Its a VW so 31 is frame ground (brown wire color)
30 is constant +12 volts (not switched)
15 is ignition switched +12 volts

I'm going to take a quick guess, that should be checked with a ohm meter or continuity meter while playing with the switch.

With the switch OFF 15 is connected to 49A and R and L are not connected to any other contact (turn signals only work with the ignition switch on.) With the switch ON the L and R will be connected to each other and 30 will be connected to 49a (hazard lights work with the ignition switch off.) 31 is most likely only needed for the internal lamp to flash when the hazard lights are on. I have no good idea what the other terminals do, they may not be needed for a simple buggy wiring harness. Warning: this is just a guess.

Wed Apr 11, 2012 9:32 pm

Thanks EV your comments help. I think I might run into issues making the turn signals work, my stubbornness will triumph over my lack of knowledge.

Thu Apr 12, 2012 3:36 am

I had this "universal" kit in a 67 that I just did - here's a link.
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=486909&highlight=flasher

Thu Apr 12, 2012 9:04 am

The only actual function of hazard switch is to connect L & R terminals together ( from "common" left and right lamp circuits) so both sides flash and to activate flasher.... And to blink bulb in switch This is a complete separate "FUNCTION" of hazard switch and not connected with actual turn signal switch functions... Trace the black/white and black/green wire from L&R terminal of hazard switch to see where they go.... See the wires off flasher relay going to turn signal switch, see how they sort of "duplicate" for hazard switch....

You can do same thing by a simple toggle switch (SPST) connecting left side "bulb" wiring to right side "bulb" wiring together and moving turn-signal switch off "normal" (to turn position) .... All Hazard switch does is makes it all happen in one "pull" (or push) of switch... And gives red blinking light on dash...

Dale

Thu Apr 12, 2012 11:04 am

Dale - that is waaaaaay too simple. I LIKE IT. Gonna have to remember that one

Thu Sep 27, 2012 7:54 pm

sorry to bring up an old topic but i need a little help. trying to wire up a hazard switch using an on off toggle switch. ive got the basic idea how it would work if i wired it dales simple way. but when i go out to the shop and look at my stock harard switch wiring, i cant figure out how to get it to work with a simple toggle switch.

im currently working on my dash panel and ive wired my hazard switch as it should be as if it was wired in a 74 superbeetle. i dont want to use the 74 superbeetle switch because im missing some sort of switch cover. its an ugly square switch that i can see the inside of.

i just need a simple wiring diagram to make a toggle switch work ad a hazard switch.

also. completley off topic, but i neef some help on getting a 74 super steering column to wire up to a 59 wiper motor. already figured out ignition and turn signals.

thanks

Fri Sep 28, 2012 5:00 am

Ideally you should use a seperate flasher for the hazards, powered by a seperate fuse (always hot). The turn signals are only functional when the accessory circuit is enabled (ignition on). A toggle switch and 1 flasher is not the way to go. If your signals quit then you would have no flashers either. If you needed flashers then your ignition would have to be on, activating the rest of the electrical system and killing the battery that much faster.

Fri Sep 28, 2012 6:23 am

You need a relay like this:

http://www.delcity.net/store/Normally-Open-Relay-w:-Dual-87-Contacts/p_791795

This is how I would wire it:
1. ground to 85 tab
2. Battery power to toggle switch
3. Toggle switch to 86 tab
4. Battery power to two prong flasher
5. Other prong of flasher to 30 tab
6. 87 tab to left side blinkers
7. 87a tab to right side blinkers

Fri Sep 28, 2012 8:20 am

Deleted because of erroneous information...

Dale

Fri Sep 28, 2012 8:53 am

Quote: Line #7 is wrong and .... And actually the relay recommended will not work because if you tie one terminal 87 to left side lamps and "other" terminal 87 to right side lamps you have actually permanently tied both lamp circuits together permanently through internal relay wiring (begin terminal 87's are common to each other internally)

You actual need a DPST (Double Pole Single Throw ) relay and make relay concept work... Or 2 SPST (Single Pole Single Throw) relays under control of one switch...

Line 7 is correct. See the diagram for the relay suggested:
http://www.delcity.net/images/linedrawings/73996.pdf

I do not see anywhere that suggests 87a & 87 are connected at rest. They appear to be isolated from eachother. So when the relay is not activated the left & right side remain isolated from eachother. When activated then both sides are joined...but thats what we are looking for. All 4 lights to flash.

It works...I know it does. I have done it.

Fri Sep 28, 2012 9:03 am

You are probably correct.... The ONE relay I had apart had a SINGLE contact set and two pin 87 terminals ...

Look up BOSCH 0 332 019 150

http://www.texasindustrialelectric.com/relays_0332019150.asp

MY BAD, we are talking two different relay configurations......

Dale