TheSamba.com :: View topic

Thu Apr 12, 2012 8:36 am

Ok, lets start one year ago. Rumaging through a barn i find a 1974 412 canary yellow, little rust. The old farm hand with rough hands, salty language and a voice to give Tom Waits a run for his money is asking 250, so i jump on it. I have had that car stored for the past year at a friends house.

I am now 20, miserable and have the feeling that my dreams have gone by the way side because i abandoned the person i used to be when i enrolled in college two years ago. I need to get that person back, the one that didn't give into societal roles, please help me. I can't bare to do this life anymore. I do not want to be 45 years old, look back and question what i did like my father has done, and my friends fathers. Please save me from this.

ok after that side note.

Two days ago i decided that the reason i am unhappy is because i have been giving into the expectations of society by going to a local university. I have been misserable for a long time now. So i am turning away from the manotany and i am quitting this college, enrolling in a tech school for automotive servicing, i am just sick of living a life where my former self is dead and feeling hopeless because i just don't know how to get out. So next semester at the tech school i am going to take my classes and work on the 412. Next summer i will have it finished and i plan on driving west to california, arizona, and the like to get inspiration for my poetry, then i will come home and purpose to my girlfriend, then marry her the following year. The engine doesn't run yet, it is FI, which was surprising to me in a 74. The trany has 12,000 miles on it. The passenger side window is gone, passenger side door is stuck.

I have thought about putting a new engine in it without FI because i can see that being a handful. I need four tires for it, they are all the original from purchase. I am going to start by freeing up the wheels. Then i will move to the fuel system, and other systems. The there comes the engine. Should i put a different engine in it? if so which one?

It sounds hoaky but that is what i want to do, and i intend on doing this. If i don't i will continue to walk around the empty shell that i am now, i need to find the person i used to be...please help me.

Thu Apr 12, 2012 10:48 am

Lets see you get a stock 74 VW running/driving First! :idea:

Thu Apr 12, 2012 1:00 pm

i need to get it rolling in order for it to be towed to my new place. What size tires will fit. I have the rims, just need the rubers (so to speak). any idea on size?

Thu Apr 12, 2012 1:10 pm

We can't save you from this. You have to save yourself. You may get a lot of feedback from people here, and I bet a lot of it is going to be harsh. Just take what you want from it and leave the rest. You have goals, keep your sights set on them, but be flexible and adjust the goals when things don't seem to be working out for you.

And if you don't have regrets when you become an old man, you just didn't try hard enough! Everybody who has lived a life worth living will have regrets.

I don't know anything about 412's other than they were not made in large numbers and it may become very expensive for you to get it running. Like Mike said, a Beetle might be much easier and cheaper to start.

Thu Apr 12, 2012 1:13 pm

165R15 was stock, but you can use up to 185's probably. I'd buy some cheap used 185's or similar for rollers as there are plenty of used ones.

Thu Apr 12, 2012 7:27 pm

I think VW used both 155R15's and 165R15's. Neither size is very easy to find in a quality tire these days, though both can be had in mid grade tires with a little looking. There are other tires that will fit the wheel well, but those are typically best on wider rims.

All stock 411/412 engines were FI in this country, except maybe some special orders. You can take a FI engine and easily retro fit it with carbs, but stay away from the center mounted progressive in all its various forms. There are no engines that can easily be retro fitted into one of these cars, the Type 4 engine and the Type 4 car were designed to go together. You can easily increase the displacement of the engines a bit to get more HP.

Assuming your car has an automatic transmission you can get better performance by using the "Z" torque converter out of a later air cooled Vanagon, I think the "H" torque converter out of a water cooled Vanagon will work as well, but haven't tried it. A 2000cc engine and "Z" torque converter gives a pretty spirited ride.

Fri Apr 13, 2012 4:18 pm

I think you are doing a good thing! College is fantastic and in many ways....that level of learning how to learn is primary to getting to certain levels in life....but not the only route.

Working at Tech school and learning a valuable trade does several things....makes you more intelligent, gives you self esteem and pride of purpose....and most importantly teaches a skill in trade that will allow you to make enough money to possibly finish the degree you need (and even more importantly...probably guide you into the correct degree in the first place).

Going back to college with salable mechanical skills, some working knowledge of a wide range of systems...the ability to work to stay in college puts you a leg up on most. Trust...I have been there.

Now...about the 412. On one hand....I see having a vehicle that needs to be rebuilt...any vehicle....upon entering an automotive tech school as a plus. Not only do you have a car that you can go home and practice what you learn on....but you can save loads getting it restored to running level.

That being said.....this car is NOT a car for beginners. i say that for these reasons.
(1) As you work through your classes and then practice on your car...you will find that many if not most...parts that you need...canot simply be gotten by going down to the local parts house. This will slow things down and may be a distraction.

(2) The parts you need...many of them will need to be fabricated...especially some suspension parts and some electrical parts.

(3) Be careful of the advice you get from your class and teacher. Some of the techniques you will need to get this car running and alternate parts fabricated...will be unorthodox. You will be hard pressed to find very many people in these courses that can offer useful advice about the decisions and techniques required for this particular vehicle and especially this particular air cooled engine.

Parts...and I mean good quality parts...do not grow on trees. Othere than sound mechanical measuring advice and habits you will learn in these classes.....knowledge gained primarily from modern watercooled engines will utterly fail you in certain key cases with these engines.

Not trying to discourage you at all! I encourage you to keep the car. They are easily the best of the air cooled VW's and a joy to drive.
I'm just saying that there will be times to keep the restoration of this vehicle separate from class. Its not particulary hard to work on....but there will be tedious issues. Ray

Fri Apr 13, 2012 5:25 pm

Whatever tech school you go to try to talk directly to real graduates (not "selected" ones) with some serious work time under their belts. Most people that I know (myself included) have had a difficult time putting the theory learned in these classes into practice in real life situations. I attended an A/C repair school in the early 80's run by a veteran refigeration mechanic. He had great skills in the field, and in the classroom, but he gave us vitrually no hands on training. Upon graduation my trusting 18 year old self had a rude awakening as to how much I "did not" know about the skills of trouble shooting, and diagnosing mechanical ailments. It took a patient mentor, and several years of frustration to become adept at the trade. The same thing happened to my cousin who attended a very heavily advertised "institute" for motorcycle repair. He had to fill in a lot of blanks to scrape out a living. Both of us are very mechanically adept, and have no troubles with most other mechanical repairs. I am not trying to discourage you. Just check out the "products" of your vocational choice. Good luck! (sorry, I was a bit wound up!) :roll:

Sat Apr 14, 2012 10:15 am

Wow thanks for the help. I have located a second 412 in my area. The only experience i have on restoring cars is on an 86 camaro that i helped my friend and is dad turn into the car he takes to the quarter mile track near our home town. But with this camaro we could fit parts from old camaros, trans ams, and the like to fit onto this car. Can i do the same thing with this car, and if i look at the other 412, would it be difficult to take parts from the two and combine the best into one car? or would i be better off scraping together internet purchases of "newer" less used parts?

Sat Apr 14, 2012 10:18 am

Sweet website of parts:

www.cip1.com

Sat Apr 14, 2012 10:22 am

squareback74 wrote: Sweet website of parts:

www.cip1.com

Well known for selling parts of less than stellar quality. Not that they don't have some good stuff as well, you just can't make the assumption that what they sell is worth buying.

Sat Apr 14, 2012 10:55 am

Good to know

Sat Apr 14, 2012 1:13 pm

squareback74 wrote: Wow thanks for the help. I have located a second 412 in my area. The only experience i have on restoring cars is on an 86 camaro that i helped my friend and is dad turn into the car he takes to the quarter mile track near our home town. But with this camaro we could fit parts from old camaros, trans ams, and the like to fit onto this car. Can i do the same thing with this car, and if i look at the other 412, would it be difficult to take parts from the two and combine the best into one car? or would i be better off scraping together internet purchases of "newer" less used parts?

the 74 was the last model year. It had larger safety bumpers and lost of small changes. The largest of which are that the tail lights and possibly the marker lights are different than the 1973 412's....so fenders from a pure 1974 will not fit a 1973 and vice versa(especially rear fenders). Doors have differences...like how the armrest and panels mount but in general ...doors of like modesl (2 doo, 4 door and wagons)...will fit.

The suspension parts will generally cross with all type 4's though there are some small differences. Ray

Wed Apr 25, 2012 10:59 am

I started a nother thread inquiring about efi to carb conversion. need opinions and advice.