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Wed Apr 18, 2012 7:01 am

Hi all -

I have a question about the compatibility and 'fitment' of a type 1 engine into a bus. I think I remember that the older bay window (and perhaps pre-bay?) buses used essentially a type 1 engine, but I am not sure.

Here is what I am contemplating: My 71 super need probably about $1000 in suspension work. Rather than put that into the super, I am thinking about selling it for what I can get and put the money instead into a bus. The super has a 1776 type 1 engine with dual carbs build on an AJ series case. It has a screw on type oil filter adapter.

Here is my question: Are there any bus model years where this would be an easy engine swap? A friend of mine who is a VW mechanic was worried about mounting 'ears' on the case and if it would bolt up in the bus. Also he felt the oil filter wouldn't clear.

Any input would be greatly appreciated!

Here's pictures of the engine and oil filter:

Wed Apr 18, 2012 7:08 am

That won't fit any year baywindow with that filter pump on there.

Wed Apr 18, 2012 7:24 am

Some one will surely shoot me for suggesting this, but if you stuff it into a '72 or later bus and not use the rear mounting bar it should work well enough.

Wed Apr 18, 2012 7:47 am

Both answers above are true but it would be best to get rid of that filter adapter all together. I see that the case isn't tapped for the rear mustache hanger so you could use the adapter onto the oil pump studs and make it work. Then you could mount this engine into anything up to a 1979 bus. You'd do best to stay in the range of 1968-1971 though.

Wed Apr 18, 2012 8:21 am

Wildthings wrote: Some one will surely shoot me for suggesting this, but if you stuff it into a '72 or later bus and not use the rear mounting bar it should work well enough.

:snipersmile:

Wed Apr 18, 2012 9:17 am

Don't forget to change the front engine tin to a bus tin if you use that engine in a 68 to 71.

With the oil pump change and adapter the engine will work in a 68 to 70 without any problems on a 71 you will need a way to hook up vacuum for the brake booster.

The heater boxes are different but you can make them work.

I put a 1776 bug engine in my old single cab and it worked great even with the oil pump adapter :D

Wed Apr 18, 2012 9:23 am

At least you aren't trying to put a type IV engine or a chevy engine in there.

Wed Apr 18, 2012 11:31 am

I don't mind getting rid of the oil filter adapter. I take it there is some sort of adapter for a rear engine support? Is that a common thing or something I'll have to fab up? Will the engine mate up to the transmission ok? I know about the cooling tin, did NOT know about the vacuum booster.

Thanks for the heads up!

Wed Apr 18, 2012 1:51 pm

This is what you need.
http://royrogersparts.com/mrb00-9148-0.html
I had to get longer studs to make mine work but not too long or you will have a clearance problem with the mustache bar.

Wed Apr 18, 2012 2:08 pm

In this pic behind the muffler you can see the rear engine support commonly called the "mustache bar"

In the center is 3 bolts that bolt to the adapter plate

also on the right side of the engine compartment you can see the air cleaner support if you use your dual carb setup you will probably need to remove it.

Wed Apr 18, 2012 3:17 pm

Every time I see photos of an early bay engine bay I'm reminded of how much I want one :(

OP You really should figure out some kind of moustache bar setup. While people have reported operating without one, VW didn't put them there for no reason. These vehicle were built with an emphasis on frugality and as a result they wouldn't put anything there that wasn't needed.

Wed Apr 18, 2012 3:39 pm

RatCamper wrote: Every time I see photos of an early bay engine bay I'm reminded of how much I want one :(

OP You really should figure out some kind of moustache bar setup. While people have reported operating without one, VW didn't put them there for no reason. These vehicle were built with an emphasis on frugality and as a result they wouldn't put anything there that wasn't needed.

The mustache bar was needed on the early rigs because they lacked transmission mounts. The late bays added the transmission mount copying the Type 4 mounting system, but the Type 4 lacked a load bearing front mount so it needed the mustache bar in combination with the transmission mount. Once VW got around to designing the Vanagon they again dropped the transmission mount which made the mustache bar again absolutely necessary again. Essentially the 72-79 Bays were the only ones of the series that had three load bearing mounts which would not be the best engineering as the load is going to be transfer back and forth between mounts potentially loading them very heavily as the body and frame flex going over bumps. So from an engineering perspective I think it is questionable if all three late bay mount were really needed.

Wed Apr 18, 2012 3:42 pm

tom62 wrote: In this pic behind the muffler you can see the rear engine support commonly called the "mustache bar"

In the center is 3 bolts that bolt to the adapter plate

also on the right side of the engine compartment you can see the air cleaner support if you use your dual carb setup you will probably need to remove it.

Thanks for the pictures it really helped me understand. It seems the adapter can be had for under $15 so I can't think of any reason not to go that route and cutting out the air cleaner support is a piece of cake.

Beautiful engine bay by the way!

Thanks to everyone for the great information. Gotta love TheSamba, best people out there.

So now I need to find a pre-71 bus with no engine...... hmmmmm wonder where to look.....

Wed Apr 18, 2012 8:37 pm

I put an engine from a 74 super in my 69 using the "oil pump" adapter. All the info is here if you search for it. I am not a super mechanic and did most of it myself and i'm 60 . All the info is here to change bus with generator to alternator too. pm me if you want to talk