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Thu Jun 21, 2012 2:42 pm

My 1.9 is idling hard and quitting when you come to a stop. The problem was intermittent at first, but is getting to be a constant headache. Here is the progression

-Starts and idled fine, drive through the gears, hit the first stop sign and she dies or came close to it. improved with extended driving.

- starts and idled fine, through the gears died for the first few, then got better

- all of the above, now it does it all the time. And would immediately stall out if hot after a stall. Acts like its missing at idle

What I have tried;

Green box- connected wires together, if anything it was worse
Tightened connectors between MAF and engine
TPS....never been hooked up, engine ran well befor this issue popped up. Hooked up spare TPS set to idle with no change to condition
1.9- No idle control valve
Grounds all clean and dielectriced.
Checked the connection on the blue connector.

Observations;
Engine sounds like its sucking.....but that could be the throttle body, not sure what the engine is supposed to sound like.

I have power steering, but do not notice an increase in rpm when I turn.

Runs fine at higher rpms...nice and peppy.

Thu Jun 21, 2012 10:45 pm

Have you checked for vacuum leaks? Checked the 02 sensor? I had a similar issue and upon removing the o2 sensor from the exhaust, there was no sensor! Sounds like it may be running rich and that the engine doesn't know it's warm.

On the TPS, does it click when closed and click when all the way open? should click twice, open and closed. Mine was bad (just had to bend the arm back a little) and was not clicking when closed.

Thu Jun 21, 2012 11:13 pm

Re-read his post.
The TPS has never been hooked up.

Fri Jun 22, 2012 1:38 am

New o2 200mi ago.

Fri Jun 22, 2012 6:42 am

I didn't think they would run properly without the TPS connected and working

your old TB could very likely be the problem, mine had symptoms similar to yours. Installed a new TB from Phil, installed new VMS from Chris, and it has never run better. also, you may have a short on your O2 sensor wire.

Fri Jun 22, 2012 2:13 pm

SL1 wrote: I didn't think they would run properly without the TPS connected and working

your old TB could very likely be the problem, mine had symptoms similar to yours. Installed a new TB from Phil, installed new VMS from Chris, and it has never run better. also, you may have a short on your O2 sensor wire.

What's a VMS? I may need to go with the new TB at some point as mine is wearing. It's all matter of how much wear is too much, it's a slow death for these things. It's Ok but who know how many of my little issues here and there relate to the worn TB.

Sat Jun 23, 2012 9:39 am

oops, i meant VSM :oops: .
Vacuum sensing module. replaces the old TPS set up - excellent upgrade - no adjustments required, its plug and play. contact tencentlife

Sat Jun 23, 2012 9:45 am

man, i am glad my van is running better than my brain today - senior moments.. :lol: :lol:

VSM is Vacuum Switching Module : http://www.vanistan.com/accessories.html

Sat Jun 23, 2012 10:19 am

Well, I'm in the process of trying to order one from him. I image if my TB was getting worn I would have a high idle condition no?

Could my timing have gone off, I don't have a gun so can't check...but would that cause it....I would imagine not as it runs fine off idle.

Could you give a link for the TB for the 1.9, how much was it?

Sat Jun 23, 2012 5:19 pm

you can have a variety of wonky idle issues; high idle, fluctuations, wanting to stall out after running at speed, surging, etc.

don't forget to check the O2 wire for a ground as well - cover all bases

you won't regret a new TB, its definitely worn out after 27 years of running and opening / closing millions of times.

get a timing light when you get a chance, not expensive and very handy. if you haven't messed with the dizzy, its probably ok as you said it runs fine at speed

I sent you a PM re TB :wink:

Sun Jun 24, 2012 6:22 am

Just as a limp by mode I decided to set the tb just a bit open to keep it from stalling and this is what I found after a drive this morning.

Starts and idles about 900-1000, after an extended drive she will run at 2800-3000 rpm and not drop. Upon restarting it wants to stall.

What does that big screw on the TB do?

Sun Jun 24, 2012 7:14 am

<<Just as a limp by mode I decided to set the tb just a bit open>>

How?
By adjusting what?

<<Starts and idles about 900-1000, after an extended drive she will run at 2800-3000 rpm and not drop. Upon restarting it wants to stall.>>

On your undisclosed year of a 1.9, how many switches do you have on the TB?
One or two?

Sun Jun 24, 2012 7:25 am

Title said 85 so that is the disclosed year. One switch, not hooked up and never has.

I just kept the throttle cable a bit tighter to increase the idle.

Sun Jun 24, 2012 7:40 am

Somebody has this TB all boogered up.

The TPS on the TB MUST be hooked up to the ECU to let it know what it's postion is in.
Is it closed, or open?

Without that, your flying with no pilot.

And if it's not hooked up it really doesn't matter what your doing to do at the TB--it'll never run right.

You can twist & shout every adjustment screw, all day long--your accomplishing absolutely nothing--Zip.

Get a new TPS from the Van Cafe-then start adusting.

It'll run & idle like crap till you get this done--it's called pissing in the wind.

Get the switch operating properly first, then ask how to get it running right.

Start at point A--then ask about B,C,& D.

There is NO limp mode on the thottle body.
Well, yea there is.

Wire the throttle arm wide open and point the Van in the direction you want to go.
Hope you don't have to stop.

Sun Jun 24, 2012 7:54 am

Raven,

These are phootos of my TB and TPS. Does your TB look worse than mine? Mine has some wear, but not nearly as bad as some I've seen.

Sun Jun 24, 2012 8:09 am

@ Terry.......um, if this was true....then why did it work all last season unhooked, and only slowly/progressively start becoming an issue this season after about 2000 miles? I did hook up a working switch off of a spare Bad TB with no change

@floggingmolly.....when I took it off last spring it was actually pretty tight.

Update since last update: on the way home I dropped the throttle cable back where it's supposed to be, and counter clockwise rotated the big idle screw. I could get the idle to do everything from idle at the perfect 900rpm, to lope and almost stall, to maintain a sustained rev at 2300rpm, then a sustained rev at 1800rpm and being able to change the performance just by loading the engine or giving it a rev.......... :?

Upon disconnecting the o2, no change, I put the oth TB switch on full time just to see what the idle would do without human input. Start it would stall, start with a press of the gas, it would settle at 900, then jump to 1500 in a few seconds almost stall after a few seconds, back up to 900, then after 3-5 sec 1500 then almost stall. I let it continue until it did stall after a couple minutes and came inside to type this......this was with the TB switch activated and the idle screw out 3.75 turns

Sun Jun 24, 2012 11:17 am

The switch is there for one reason.
To let the ECU know what position the throttle plate is at.
Without it hooked up, the engine is getting whatever fuel the ECU thinks it should--without any indication whatsoever where the thottle is at.
That's why it's called the throttle postioning switch.

Now---why your's is running is a mystery to me, why it's not running right isn't.

The ECU & fuel system needs to know where the throttle is for the engine to function properly.

Sun Jun 24, 2012 11:49 am

Terry,
That switch is on at idle or wide open, the rest of the time it is off. If I'm at 10% idle to 90% idle it has no clue as to the position.....

Sun Jun 24, 2012 12:11 pm

That's correct.
It's on or off.

And right now the ECU doesn't know where it's at---

On or off, at idle or wide open.

No wonder the idle is wandering.

Why are you overthinking this?
The Engine management system requires that switch to function properly.

For some crazy reason your trying to work around that requirement and it ain't gonna happen.

Sun Jun 24, 2012 12:47 pm

Quoute from the Last paragraph of the injection manual;

"Correct adjustment of the throttle switch is VERY IMPORTANT.
If the switch is misadjusted, engine may surge at idle or cut out during steady driving or light acceleration"

Now, I don't know how you plan on working around this fact of life, or in this case the engine managment system.

It's gotta be plugged in, set up right, and operating for you to get un-stumpped, and for the engine to hold a constant speed at idle-- an off idle throttle position--or WOT.

There isn't any other way to get this done.( excluding throwing the whole electronic fuel injection set up out ,and bolting up a carburator )