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Wed Jun 27, 2012 6:23 pm

Hi, i just bought a 68 bug and Im having a problem with oil leaking from behind the pulley. I recentley replaced the crank and all the rods as part of a "make it work with what i have" rebuild, but it leaked prior to that aswell. The slinger is installed in the correct direction, and the breather is breeathing clearly. There is a noticeable amount of blow by, but i dont know what is to be expected. Im using the stock pulley with the screw grooves cut in it. I did notice that between the pulley and case around the shaft, there is a half pencil sized gap, like the pulley isnt in far enough? Once again, i dont know what is to be expected. Ive been reading that the pulley leak can be caused by blow by, so my orrigional plan was to let the old rings seat back into the hones cylnders. Yes, i know, shame on me for putting back in old rings, but they were in spec. However, that dosent seem to be working, so im in search of a different fix! The most common solution ive read about is empi's sand seal pulley. Should i go out and buy one or does anyone have some words of wisdom?

Thanks
Patrick

Wed Jun 27, 2012 7:54 pm

Make sure your valve cover seals did not droop open at the center top when you installed the valve covers.

Thu Jun 28, 2012 2:17 pm

I dont quite understand what you saying. D the cork gaskets plug up a ent in the rocker cover?

Thu Jun 28, 2012 5:06 pm

When you honed the cylinders you changed the relationship of the cylinders and the rings. Rings are cheap. Now you either have to deal with the blowby or pull the motor and re-ring it. A band-aide solution would be to pull the right side valve cover off and install a vent - rout it directly to the air cleaner if you don't have a breather box. A short term band-aide would be to pour a couple of tablespoons of BonAmi pots and pans cleaner down the carb and let the rings reseat. Thats an old used car lot solution for oil burning used cars. Lasts from several hundred to thousands of miles.

You might be able to slow the oil loss from the pulley by cleaning the grooves on the pulley. A sand seal needs to have a machined case in order to fit. There are pulleys with no-machine seals but from what I've read they aren't the best solution.

Thu Jun 28, 2012 5:35 pm

Pafrig wrote: Hi, i just bought a 68 bug and Im having a problem with oil leaking from behind the pulley. I recently replaced the crank and all the rods as part of a "make it work with what i have" rebuild, but it leaked prior to that as well. The slinger is installed in the correct direction, and the breather is breathing clearly.
There is a noticeable amount of blow by, but i dont know what is to be expected.
Im using the stock pulley with the screw grooves cut in it. I did notice that between the pulley and case around the shaft, there is a half pencil sized gap, like the pulley isnt in far enough?
what gap? shoot a photo or be more accurate.
the pulley boss just goes into the case.
the PCV sucks AIR here, that is how it works.
if running a POS China air cleaner with no PCV then yah , it wont work.
the rings will leak and blow by will be high.
but i am confident if you put the PCV back as wolfsburg made it ,
it will suck that blowby and eat it , real fast. (but if horrible.?)
Horrible has no limits, i am witness to that...
unless the rings failed to seat at all, as they will, if not replaced,.
the new rings have cuts in them for fast seating
putting in old rings that are not cut , will NEVER EVER SEAT.
buy some new rings and LOOK at the edges.. BINGO.

Once again, i dont know what is to be expected. Ive been reading that the pulley leak can be caused by blow by, so my original plan was to let the old rings seat back into the hones cylinders.
so you are the only man , honing old vw jugs, why?

Yes, i know, shame on me for putting back in old rings, but they were in spec.
No they are not. dont fool your self. (sorry. can lie to you.)

However, that dosent seem to be working, so im in search of a different fix! The most common solution ive read about is empi's sand seal pulley. Should i go out and buy one or does anyone have some words of wisdom?

Thanks
Patrick

your going to pull the crank and mill that sand seal port?
why is that cheaper than real rings.?

my new 68 block has almost no blow by.
did you kill you PCV system?, seems so....
show a photo of your engine and all the missing and wrong parts
this is easy peasy.

when you , idle the motor
and pull the PCV hose (hot motor)
does it look like a smoke screen , belching out a white long lasting cloud?
if yes, the carb may not handle all that.

Ask a drag racer how they handle blow by.
(they have lots)
in your case you sound have little but build a bad motor?
if it fails that cloud test.

Ok the PCV
the carb sucks at all times.
the carb suck at the PCV hose at all times, and more WOT. lots more
in fact varies from idle to WOT,
this would pull a vacuum on the crankcase, think about that fact .
ok the rear non seal, deal.
its not a seal just a slinger and a groove.
it sucks air from HERE.
preventing the VACUUM. (tiny as it would be)
the fresh air (and sand) flow in here and mixes with blowby
then the carb sucks in fresh air and blowby and yes,,sand :roll:

if blowby exceeds the carb sucking flow , then oil mist
WILL be forced out the rear, non seal.
due to small positive pressure in the crank case.
it would have to be horrible. see cloud test above.
the PCV on the VW is Fred flintstone simple.
And no input filter. nasty that is.
oh, and runs backwards from most other cars, cute, huh?

Thu Jun 28, 2012 5:43 pm

BonAmi

volcanic ash? ( LOOK IT UP) :twisted:

now that would be fun to watch, got a video of that.
no , i bet not. :shock:

but you could have scuffed up the rings. when they were out.
put on a rooling pin and chuck it down the drive way, repeat as needed. :roll:
and lift a beer to Earl Scheibe.

use the aptly named , product called crocus cloth. :wink: (like the frog)

Thu Jun 28, 2012 6:15 pm

Pafrig wrote: I dont quite understand what you saying. D the cork gaskets plug up a ent in the rocker cover?

No they become a one way valve if the gasket slips open a tad at the top allowing air in and not out, and blows out oil from around the pulley.

Which is at least partly the reason VW made the top dimple in 1970s valve covers to help keep the top of the gasket from drooping down there.

Sun Jul 01, 2012 12:26 am

Well, i Fixed it! Only after of course i got over how cute it was that the engine spun whichever way it was designed to spin. Thanks.

The real problem was that the air filter and the stamped lung thats held on to the alternator stand with the funky slot nut thwt came with the car were crappy aftermarket replacments. There was frothy oil/water mixture plugging everything up! Gah. I dug around in my parts car and found some orrigional vw parts. I replaced evrything and voila!

Thanks for the insightfull words of wisdom.

Sun Jul 01, 2012 12:27 am

Also, i checked the rocker cover gaskets, no sag! Thanks though.

Sun Jul 01, 2012 8:03 am

Good to hear you solved it!!

Do you have the thermostatic flaps system in place??

Without that that oil/water mix will keep coming back and cause the oil to turn acidic all too soon.

Plus engine oil that is not getting up to proper temp of at least 160 F and does not lubricate properly.

All of which affects engine longevity.....

Sun Jul 01, 2012 12:49 pm

The brass bellows between cylnder 1 and 2? Yes i have thwt in. However, theres that flap on the intake of the air filter that i couldnt figure out what to do with. It looks like its vaccum operated? Its a oil sump style filter.

Sun Jul 01, 2012 12:49 pm

The brass bellows between cylnder 1 and 2? Yes i have thwt in. However, theres that flap on the intake of the air filter that i couldnt figure out what to do with. It looks like its vaccum operated? Its a oil sump style filter.

Sun Jul 01, 2012 1:49 pm

Oil bath air cleaner. Oil sump is in bottom of engine case to keep bigger chunks from going through bearings.

OB air cleaner flap cable operated via the thermosatic flaps. See page 45 in your year "Owner's Manual" here:

http://www.thesamba.com/vw/archives/manuals/type1.php

READ that manual several times and make yourself at least two copies. One for glove compartment and one for home.

Failure to know the info in the manual will either kill/maim you or others around you or cause you all sorts of fun $$$$ repairs like ignoring the idiot lights and suddenly needing an engine rebuild.......

Sun Jul 01, 2012 5:06 pm

candymustang66 wrote: BonAmi

volcanic ash? ( LOOK IT UP) :twisted:

now that would be fun to watch, got a video of that.
no , i bet not. :shock:

but you could have scuffed up the rings. when they were out.
put on a rooling pin and chuck it down the drive way, repeat as needed. :roll:
and lift a beer to Earl Scheibe.

use the aptly named , product called crocus cloth. :wink: (like the frog)

Don't laugh Ive done this. When I was young I overhauled a 6 cyl Chevy stationary engine that ran on natural gas. I had to take it back apart and I didn't break the glaze on the cyl before reinstalling the nearly new rings. The engine used 2 quarts of oil every 24 hours. so I slowly sprinkled a couple of tablespoons of Bonami down the carb which actually lugged the engine down because it cleans all of the oil off of the cyl walls which leaves the rings rubbing metal on metal and scuffs them. It didn't stop the oil consumption but it went down to 1 quart n 48 hours.

Mon Jul 02, 2012 2:58 pm

Actually, bonami has its own part number in OLD caterpillar service manuals. They reccomended a teaspoon and a quarter per cylnder.
Then again, the fuel injection system is comparable to squirt guns.

I probolay wont be dumping any bonami down my vw anytime soon though!