TheSamba.com :: View topic - It's not starting

Mon Dec 02, 2013 10:02 am

71 squareback trying to make a daily driver but it only starts 2 maby 3 times a day..
Changed generators and voltage regulator and grounds onboth of them and have a new battery
Can anybody help me with this problem?

Mon Dec 02, 2013 10:18 am

Maybe a failing starter or solenoid?

Mon Dec 02, 2013 11:40 am

As with all "won't start" questions, you have to be more specific about how far it gets in the process, or we can't help you.
- Do the dash lights come on when you turn the ignition key on?
- If it is FI, do you hear the fuel pump relays turn on and off? Does the fuel pump work for about one second?
- When you turn the key further to start, does it engage the starter? Does it spin the engine?
- Does it sputter or barely fail to catch? Or does it sound completely inert as it cranks?

Mon Dec 02, 2013 12:37 pm

Its the battery
Starts right up first time then after that I cant turn it off or it wont start again for a couple of hours

Mon Dec 02, 2013 2:06 pm

kaseycraft7227 wrote: Its the battery
Starts right up first time then after that I cant turn it off or it wont start again for a couple of hours

Since you didn't answer the "won't start 101" questions, I still don't know what this means. So we cannot comment on whether you are right or not about it being the battery. How old is the battery? When did the problem start?

Help yourself out here and answer the simple questions.

Mon Dec 02, 2013 2:46 pm

KTPhil wrote: kaseycraft7227 wrote: Its the battery
Starts right up first time then after that I cant turn it off or it wont start again for a couple of hours

Since you didn't answer the "won't start 101" questions, I still don't know what this means. So we cannot comment on whether you are right or not about it being the battery. How old is the battery? When did the problem start?

Help yourself out here and answer the simple questions.

Yup, we need more info. The questions in the first post by KTPhil, and those in the post above this one. Otherwise, you'll just be throwing money at the problem, until you finally fix it (without knowing what the real problem was). :roll:

Mon Dec 02, 2013 2:55 pm

kaseycraft7227 wrote: Its the battery
Starts right up first time then after that I cant turn it off or it wont start again for a couple of hours

ground strap to the trans is my guess. Starts and then wont for hours...sound like it to me

Mon Dec 02, 2013 3:06 pm

Erik G wrote: kaseycraft7227 wrote: Its the battery
Starts right up first time then after that I cant turn it off or it wont start again for a couple of hours

ground strap to the trans is my guess. Starts and then wont for hours...sound like it to me

But in his 1st post, he said he changed it.

Mon Dec 02, 2013 5:17 pm

First time starts right up once I turn the car off then its like the battery isnt charging (no matter how long the car is running) and it doesnt turn over but the lights work. Its a new battery a new generator and a new voltage meter under the seat.
Changed all of my grounds and wire brushed the ground on the frame under the seat

Mon Dec 02, 2013 6:47 pm

kaseycraft7227 wrote: First time starts right up once I turn the car off then its like the battery isnt charging (no matter how long the car is running) and it doesnt turn over but the lights work. Its a new battery a new generator and a new voltage meter under the seat.
Changed all of my grounds and wire brushed the ground on the frame under the seat

Put a volt meter on the battery terminals. Write down the voltage reading. Next, start the car, and write down that voltage reading. Now raise the engine speed, and write down that reading.
Then post up those numbers (and the stages of the voltage readings), and we'll go from there.
Also, tell us IF the car is still FI , as it does make a difference on the voltage readings you're getting.

Tue Dec 03, 2013 3:03 pm

Here's another check. When it is acting up (not starting), block the wheels, be sure it's out of gear. Turn the key to the run position. Then crawl under the car and using a large screwdriver, bridge the starter push-on terminal to the big nut. This should make the starter motor spin the engine and start up. You are bypassing all the ignition switch wiring.

If this works but the key doesn't, then I should suspect the ignition switch or wiring.

If it still doesn't start using the screwdriver, then you have a starter/solenoid problem.

Unfortunately, that '71 is a one-year only switch. It will be cheaper if it's the starter, cheaper still if it is the starter bushing.

Tue Dec 03, 2013 7:31 pm

KTPhil wrote: Here's another check. When it is acting up (not starting), block the wheels, be sure it's out of gear. Turn the key to the run position. Then crawl under the car and using a large screwdriver, bridge the starter push-on terminal to the big nut. This should make the starter motor spin the engine and start up. You are bypassing all the ignition switch wiring.

If this works but the key doesn't, then I should suspect the ignition switch or wiring.

If it still doesn't start using the screwdriver, then you have a starter/solenoid problem.

Unfortunately, that '71 is a one-year only switch. It will be cheaper if it's the starter, cheaper still if it is the starter bushing.

Fixed it for you. :wink:

Tue Dec 03, 2013 7:38 pm

[quote="Bobnotch"][quote="kaseycraft7227"]First time starts right up once I turn the car off then its like the battery isnt charging (no matter how long the car is running) and it doesnt turn over but the lights work. Its a new battery a new generator and a new voltage meter under the seat.
Changed all of my grounds and wire brushed the ground on the frame under the seat[/quote]

Put a volt meter on the battery terminals. Write down the voltage reading. Next, start the car, and write down that voltage reading. Now raise the engine speed, and write down that reading.
Then post up those numbers (and the stages of the voltage readings), and we'll go from there.
Also, [b] tell us IF the car is still FI [/b], as it does make a difference on the voltage readings you're getting.[/quote]
Battery 12
Battery car running 14
Battery car higher idle 15ish
Not fuel injected dool carb

Can not locate starter solenoid

Tue Dec 03, 2013 8:14 pm

kaseycraft7227 wrote: Bobnotch wrote:

Put a volt meter on the battery terminals. Write down the voltage reading. Next, start the car, and write down that voltage reading. Now raise the engine speed, and write down that reading.
Then post up those numbers (and the stages of the voltage readings), and we'll go from there.
Also, tell us IF the car is still FI , as it does make a difference on the voltage readings you're getting.
Battery 12
Battery car running 14
Battery car higher idle 15ish
Not fuel injected dool carb

Can not locate starter solenoid

It's on top of the starter itself, along the topside of the transaxle on the right side of the car.
At this point though, replace the entire starter (they sell just the solenoid for almost the same money :shock: ), as it sounds like that's the real problem. Make sure you change the starter bushing too. :!: Your voltages are good (for either FI or dual carbs), so it's not the battery, or the cables. By doing the voltage check like you did, you eliminated a few items real quick. Do you have a Bentley or Haynes manual? If not, you need to get 1, as it'll help with anything else you want to do with the car (repair wise).

You could do KTPhil's test too, but I'm betting the starter or the bushing took a dump, and you have to pull the starter to change the bushing.

I only say that, as the engine and trans get hot, that heat transfers into the starter. Once it gets hot, it won't turn the engine over. A bad bushing works kind of like that too, but it grabs the starter shaft, and keeps it from turning over, causing the starter to burn up.

Thu Dec 05, 2013 6:41 pm

https://www.thesamba.com/vw/gallery/pix/1144069.jpg
what do I do with this?

Thu Dec 05, 2013 6:58 pm

It is shaped like that, so it doesn't turn when you take the nut off the engine end. Copy/Paste the right hand (IMG) link to post the picture in the Forum.

Thu Dec 05, 2013 7:29 pm

mike fisher.. LIFE SAVER!!
thank you man

Fri Dec 06, 2013 7:28 am

Mike Fisher wrote: It is shaped like that, so it doesn't turn when you take the nut off the engine end. Copy/Paste the right hand (IMG) link to post the picture in the Forum.

I put a piece of duct tape across it, to hold it in place while I start the nut on the engine side. After that nut is tightened up, I'll remove the tape.