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  View original topic: Newbie looking for a type 3
spoonertattoos Fri Apr 25, 2014 12:15 pm

Hello everyone,
My name is James. Im a tattoo artist in Hollywood. A few months ago my Honda element got into an accident and Ive decided to make the switch to a classic VW.

I have a 4 year old daughter and an infant on the way so Im looking for a safe daily driver that most importantly runs well and I can fix up cosmetically on my off days ( which you can imagine with a family is rare)

Im looking at squarebacks but also like notchbacks.

I have to admit I have never been much of a gearhead, but I am ready to learn.

here are my questions.

1. Is it a bad idea having a stick in the city? I only drive a few miles a day but its mostly stop and go traffic.

2. what are some things to look out for on the pro and con side with these cars?

3. Any body in the LA area interesting in guiding me through a purchase?

4. Anyone know a mechanic I can develop a barter relationship with? I can offer some quality tattooing. you can check out my work at monocletattoo.com

I look forward to meeting you all.

eyetzr Fri Apr 25, 2014 12:30 pm

Welcome. Stick or auto tough question, I drive stick for my VW, but commuting in stop & go I drive an automatic. There are lots of posts on here for spotting pros & cons with these wonderful cars. I think a squareback would be great for your growing family. I do not think I can help with the mechanic from here. Best of luck & keep us posted. Cheers

Dlglobal1 Fri Apr 25, 2014 1:02 pm

Welcome James! I purchased my first Type 3 last year and have found this site invaluable. The collective knowledge of folks here will get you through just about anything these great cars can throw at you. My suggestion ( if you haven't seen it already) is to read through the buyers guide here: http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=78049

I used to live in LA and drove a 69 and a 72 bug everyday, everywhere for nearly 20 years, so a stick is fine in my opinion. :wink: I agree with eyetzr on a squareback for your growing family!

MonT3 Fri Apr 25, 2014 1:22 pm

Welcome to the community. There is a lot of good information here along members with a great deal of knowledge. Don’t pass up on Dlglobal1s recommendation to read up on the buyer’s guide as it’ll give you an insight into things to look for. I’m sure there are several members in the LA area with varying degrees of experience to lend a hand in seeking or helping with your car. I do have to agree a square would be my choice.

68vwfasty Fri Apr 25, 2014 1:43 pm

Welcome to the Samba. I am also a newbie. I bought a non running 68 Fastback at the beginning of the year that I am restoring. This site is awesome to get information and I agree on looking at the buyers guide.

I hope you can find a local person to help you find a good car. These cars are old and can have lots of hidden issues that can cost lots of money to get fixed if your not a do it yourself type. On the bright side they can be fixed by an owner who has some mechanical capabilites and some good manuals and some great advice from those on this site.

Good luck and keep us posted.

eyetzr Fri Apr 25, 2014 2:36 pm

Hey forgot to mention, get the service manual, invaluable information in there. In the meantime enjoy the site, grab a coffee and read some of the build sites

joey1320 Fri Apr 25, 2014 3:03 pm

Welcome to the site!!!

I'm of a different point of view and would like to recommend a more modern car for the everyday things and a classic vw for the weekend cruises.

These cars are old and the type 3's are not as supported by the auto parts community as much as the bugs. So for you to need a part and have to park the car due to unavailability, it doesn't really fly.

Another thing to consider is the safety factor. These cars don't have ABS brakes, evap system(although the type 3 kinda does), not as advanced crash testing and so on. I would drive my son iny square, but not daily. Really, people suck at driving.

What's your budget? Depending on what you can afford, I would look into a good running Toyota, Honda, Mitsu or such and use that as a daily. And then find a nice type 3 to play around with.

Have fun!

.65vw Fri Apr 25, 2014 3:19 pm

joey1320 wrote: Welcome to the site!!!

I'm of a different point of view and would like to recommend a more modern car for the everyday things and a classic vw for the weekend cruises.

These cars are old and the type 3's are not as supported by the auto parts community as much as the bugs. So for you to need a part and have to park the car due to unavailability, it doesn't really fly.

Another thing to consider is the safety factor. These cars don't have ABS brakes, evap system(although the type 3 kinda does), not as advanced crash testing and so on. I would drive my son iny square, but not daily. Really, people suck at driving.

What's your budget? Depending on what you can afford, I would look into a good running Toyota, Honda, Mitsu or such and use that as a daily. And then find a nice type 3 to play around with.

Have fun!

I will second you on this since it saved me time typing about the same thing.

There are very good deals on older 90s cars that have all the saftey features you should have for saftey reasons. Some have prices even better then a squareback in many cases, and they are good and can be fun cars.

Then get a VW for the weekends or occasional sunny day drives. This will also allow you to work on the VW and fix things without leaving you without wheels.

Personally I do think a square back or any old VW would really be safe enough to take your family around in as a daily driver if it were not for all the others crazy drivers on the road now.
There are just too many people driving on the roads anymore and many don't really even know how to drive.

If you take all secondary roads with light traffic and you are not a lead foot, a VW might be just about as safe as a more modern car.
But if you get a VW and your kids grow up riding in it, they might like it and want it from you for their car when they start to drive and then you are out a nice ride :wink:

68vwfasty Fri Apr 25, 2014 5:36 pm

I wrote the same thing and then deleted it since I did not want to tell him what to buy.

But I agree that these cars are not really practical every day drivers to take your kids in.

Get a modern safer vehicle for that. IMHO.

But if you can afford to have a car to play with I think a type 3 or any older VW is a great choice.

Mine will be driven a lot but mostly with just me in it. I am old and expendable, LOL!

ddare Fri Apr 25, 2014 5:48 pm

I bought a fairly good condition '69 automatic, fuel injected Squareback and have been able to successfully drive it 6 months out of the last 12. When I first bought it I rebuilt the front end, transmission (probably didn't need it, but a relative did it for free), and engine. Some of that was not necessary but gave me peace of mind. My little girls (8 and 3 1/2) ride on short trips around town and to the beach, etc. but I mainly drive it to & from work. The engine is pretty responsive, and it has OK stopping power if you really step on the brakes, but it just doesn't handle the same as a newer car. That and they're pretty good at distracting me and I don't want to wreck it (like I did about 10 years ago with a nice '69 El Camino..)

53 willys Fri Apr 25, 2014 6:45 pm

Im no expert but I say a notch would be too small for a daily with small kids.....squareback if your set on your plan...but I kinda have to agree with the others here and say get a newer car for daily and a notch for fun.

spoonertattoos Fri Apr 25, 2014 7:53 pm

Thanks for the warm welcome and advice.
I have to admit, Im bummed to think that Its not advisable to use this as my daily driver... on the other hand, my wife has a volvo that we can drive the kids around in and I can just use this to get to work in..

So for those of you who do use a type 3 as a daily driver, how much time is spent in the shop? I know this has to vary car to car but should I expect to have a car I spend, 5-7 grand on in the shop once a month or is it like 3 or 4 times a year?

Is a good rule of thumb, the more you spend, the less you have to worry about things breaking down?

As much as I like the idea of buying a 1500 dollar beater and making it show material, I would probably have to get a divorce to make that happen. Haha.

Im gonna go through the ads and post the ones that stand out for feed back if thats allowed, but if anyone has seen anything in the California area that looked like a gem feel free to point me in the right direction.

Clatter Fri Apr 25, 2014 9:19 pm

I was all ready to type a reply about how a "real car" is the first thing you will need,
But these guys beat me to it.

Not the fun answer you were looking for.

I'll add this:
Back in the 80s these cars were only 20 years old or so.
That was a long time ago.
Parts came from Germany then, and the first things were starting to fail on these cars like engines and brakes.

now,
the parts come from China, if you can even find them,
the cars have been hacked up now by several caveman POs,
and the things that only need replaceing every 50 years are coming due.

If you have some heavy skrilla to buy one that was restored right,
and want to destroy it slowly, hammering it in LA traffic, knock yourself out.

If you think you are going to get a cheap one and drive it while you barter to keep it running,
Good Luck..

eyetzr Sat Apr 26, 2014 5:56 am

I agree with Clatter on that a good car is going to be tough to get and then finding good parts (German) will be the issue. I do think if you get this going you will have a well inked mechanic or an amazing car or both. Do not give up. Cheers

.65vw Sat Apr 26, 2014 9:54 am

spoonertattoos wrote: Thanks for the warm welcome and advice.
I have to admit, Im bummed to think that Its not advisable to use this as my daily driver... on the other hand, my wife has a volvo that we can drive the kids around in and I can just use this to get to work in..

So for those of you who do use a type 3 as a daily driver, how much time is spent in the shop? I know this has to vary car to car but should I expect to have a car I spend, 5-7 grand on in the shop once a month or is it like 3 or 4 times a year?

Is a good rule of thumb, the more you spend, the less you have to worry about things breaking down?

As much as I like the idea of buying a 1500 dollar beater and making it show material, I would probably have to get a divorce to make that happen. Haha.

Im gonna go through the ads and post the ones that stand out for feed back if thats allowed, but if anyone has seen anything in the California area that looked like a gem feel free to point me in the right direction.


This is a very good solution that works well.

I use a 65 notchback or Bug as my main car, now a 62 Fairlane 500 too, and it works fine because if I had to go to my office it's a few miles away only, and using the old cars to go to the store or on other errands works great.

My wife uses our new car with airbags and all the safety stuff for her longer commute and I use it if I need to go to a customer site in downtown Seattle 15 miles away. Mostly due to the other drivers, not that it's a bad drive in an old car.

So if you do have another newer car to use for practical reasons, getting an old VW for your main car for shorter trips would be doable.

Buy as nice of one as you can, one that is already mechanically sound. Then you can work on the cosmetics and still drive it.

5-7k per year in maintenance?!?! Wow, a mechanic would sure like you.
You could put a new motor in each year, please give me your old one, haha.
On the VWs I drive, the main maintenance costs are oil, tune up parts like cap, rotor, points, distributors and carbs or carb work.
Of course it takes time to check and set timing, adjust valves, do the tune ups, but it's all things you can do at home.

Just be mindful of safety when you have the family in the VW.
I don't have kids, just a wife and two dogs, but the last time we were all riding in one of the 1200cc Bugs barreling down the highway at 60 surrounded by dozens of larger cars that were quickly zipping past us, it occurred to me that if someone bumps us or we blow a tire or have some other mechanical issues that in a few seconds we would all be squashed were the Bug to go out of control and roll or something.
Those aftermarket seatbelts sure don't make a stock VW look any nicer and they would not do much to keep you much safer in a bad crash.

Bobnotch Sat Apr 26, 2014 12:19 pm

spoonertattoos wrote: Thanks for the warm welcome and advice.
I have to admit, Im bummed to think that Its not advisable to use this as my daily driver... on the other hand, my wife has a volvo that we can drive the kids around in and I can just use this to get to work in..

So for those of you who do use a type 3 as a daily driver, how much time is spent in the shop? I know this has to vary car to car but should I expect to have a car I spend, 5-7 grand on in the shop once a month or is it like 3 or 4 times a year?

Is a good rule of thumb, the more you spend, the less you have to worry about things breaking down?

As much as I like the idea of buying a 1500 dollar beater and making it show material, I would probably have to get a divorce to make that happen. Haha.

Im gonna go through the ads and post the ones that stand out for feed back if thats allowed, but if anyone has seen anything in the California area that looked like a gem feel free to point me in the right direction.

Personally, I'd look for the most complete, unmolested car I could afford. I've bought 1500 dollar cars in the past, and most need another 1500+ put into them to make them a daily driver. A little more money can get you a little more car. If you're going to daily drive it, just have a spare car in case you need it (for parts shopping).

Most of the maintenance costs are oil changes, and tune ups. However plan on doing a complete brake system rebuild at least once, and possibly an engine rebuild/swap, as you never know what the PO did to the car before you got it.

I'll say this right now though, the most common PO hack IS the wiring. I say that, because it seems most PO's think the VW engineers did it wrong, and the PO thinks he can improve it. :roll: Just read thru some of the issues people here in the forum have run into, and about 95% of them are directly related to something the PO did. :shock: Like I said above, finding a complete unmolested car IS the key.

I use my type 3s as daily drivers in the spring, summer, and fall. Then park them for the winter due to salt (I live in the salt belt of the USA). So, yes they can be a daily driver. But, you need to get the maintenance up on 1 before you can do that, and most of these cars aren't up to that point, due to the PO not keeping it up. :shock:

Yes, a Square will make a great little family cruiser. And you'll have the rear of it to use as a hauler too. :D

W1K1 Sat Apr 26, 2014 3:15 pm



Mine is a 3 season daily driver,has been for 4 years. But, prior to that it was disassembled and all the mechanicals and electrical were redone. So it has had no major surprises other than regular tune ups and oil changes. I've had a couple 40 year old parts fail, but that is something that happens with old cars.

Far too many people buy an old car because it's cool, but don't spend the time to make sure it's safe and reliable before driving it. Then they bitch about it not being reliable because it keeps falling apart or breaking down. Then it ends up sitting in the driveway or in the classifieds.

Donnie strickland Sat Apr 26, 2014 3:43 pm

Bob's right on with his advice. Spend a little more up front and you'll be glad you did, as I was...

I bought my fuel injected automatic Square in November and I've driven it every day since then, excepting 3 or 4 due to snow. I've fixed a few little things, but nothing that would keep me from driving it.

I will say that the very first thing I did after buying it was to buy and install seat belts to replace the originals. I drive my 8 year old son in it every day, so that was important.

If you're not comfortable working on it, find a trustworthy local mechanic.

periscopebill Wed Apr 30, 2014 7:37 pm

spoonertattoos wrote: So for those of you who do use a type 3 as a daily driver, how much time is spent in the shop? I know this has to vary car to car but should I expect to have a car I spend, 5-7 grand on in the shop once a month or is it like 3 or 4 times a year?

Is a good rule of thumb, the more you spend, the less you have to worry about things breaking down?


I bought my '71 square last May, spent about $2000 on the car and then another initial $2500 with my mechanic getting it up to daily driving standards. Since then I have had some minor issues with brakes, but nothing to stop me from driving it. I'd say in the last 11 months it's gone into the shop maybe 2 times? both brake issues and maybe $300ish each time? I've also never been stranded or have it not start. I've been slowly working on cosmetic stuff, but it was a running driving car when I bought it.

I've daily driven it in NYC since I bought it back in May and have always been happy with it. Yes, there are a ton of crazy drivers and in NYC they happen to be squished into a very small area, but I've never been unhappy with my decision with it as my daily driver. This includes solid 12 hour road trips from OH to NY probably 4 times in the last year as well as weekend road trips.

Of course there's always quirks with older cars- my door latch failed driving through PA and I drove the rest of the way with the door bungee-d shut. But really, I've learned a ton in this past year between this amazing resource of a site, the Bentley manual, and a great group of local guys that I met through car shows. And speaking as someone who knew nothing about cars when I bought it I don't regret it for a second.

I don't have kids, but I say go for it. If you find a good running solid car (aka the holy grail) and take care of it you can't go wrong.

chaosisme Wed Apr 30, 2014 10:28 pm

spoonertattoos wrote: I have a 4 year old daughter and an infant on the way so Im looking for a safe daily driver...

I drive a '68 squareback every day, and its reliable. However, I'm only responsible for myself. I wouldnt say that old VW's are necessarily unsafe or unreliable (they are about as reliable as you make them), but with all the advances in safety equipment in vehicles today, you would be better off looking for something modern that is safer for your children.

Ive had a handful of issues with my car, and it has never left me stranded (although today one of my fuel lines was leaking because a hose clamp came loose), but it doesnt have the safety equipment that new cars do, airbags, retractable, locking seatbelts, antilock brakes, crumple zones, etc. Like I said, I'm only responsible for myself, and I like driving a Type 3 everyday even though it can be frustrating at times, but if I had children, I would definitely look for something modern with modern safety equipment.

However, to answer your questions.

1. Is it a bad idea having a stick in the city? I only drive a few miles a day but its mostly stop and go traffic.

I drive in the same type of traffic everyday, I dont really mind it, its not that bad. Traffic in general is frustrating though, and driving stick doesnt make it easier, but I'd rather drive stick than an automatic.

2. what are some things to look out for on the pro and con side with these cars?

Pros:

- They drive better than a bug.
- More roomy than a bug.
- They're unique (which means people wont know what they are, but tell you that you have a nice bug anyway)
- If you get a squareback, they hold a ton of stuff.
- Two trunks!
- They came stock with a clock! (Usually)
- They get pretty good gas mileage.
- They are just as easy to work on as the other models.
- More and more reproduction stuff is being made for Type 3's than ever, which is good.
- '66 and later Type 3's came stock with front disc brakes.
- If you are so inclined, they can be lowered for free (not including labor of course).
- They came with fuel injection starting in '68, which is a nice feature if you dont like goofing with carbs.

Cons:

- Sometimes finding specific Type 3 stuff can be a pain, like if you need something really quick and none of the shops local to you have what you need. However, Ive rarely run into that problem. Nice dashes are very rare though.
- They dont have as much appeal or value compared to Type 1's and 2's. So its easier to have more into your car than its worth. Not a big deal, but if you are hoping to make money with the hobby, Type 3's really arent the way to go.
- Really nice Type 3's are honestly pretty hard to find. Im talking about original, unhacked cars. Still, they are still out there.
- Like with all VW's, there is shitty repop stuff thats annoying and some parts lack quality.
- If you get an FI car, sometimes it can be the bane of your existence. They are more difficult to work on than carbureted cars. Finding FI parts can be hard sometimes. If you are not comfortable working on your car yourself, then do not buy an FI car because any mechanic you take it to will not know how to work on it and will try to get you to convert to carbs.

3. Any body in the LA area interesting in guiding me through a purchase?

I wouldnt mind giving you a hand, provided its not until after mid-June because Im graduating college and I will be insanely busy until then.

4. Anyone know a mechanic I can develop a barter relationship with? I can offer some quality tattooing. you can check out my work at monocletattoo.com

I have no idea if any mechanics offer barter work, that would probably be something you would have to develop after getting to know local mechanics. I've heard of a some though.

My best advice is to buy the nicest, most original and complete car you can. If you buy something that you know needs X amount of work, expect it to cost more than you originally planned for, that seems to just be the nature of the game. For example, I recently replaced my transmission mounts because I knew they were bad, and I ended up spending over twice as much as much replacing other stuff that I saw needed to be replaced once I tore into it.



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