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  View original topic: Syncro front inner CV joints: Spacers?? Longer bolts?? Page: 1, 2, 3  Next
rubbachicken Mon Apr 28, 2014 8:11 pm

so, inner cv joints on syncros, some have spacers, some don't, the bentley says yes use spacers.
why do they need spacers, and why are the bolts not longer.
i think standard length is 47mm, i found some 50mm bolts to use, but to me they do not look long enough, only 4 or 5 full threads into the cv cup

should i be looking for longer bolts ?? the syncro in question goes out on 5k mile + trips each time it goes out

lloydy Mon Apr 28, 2014 11:25 pm

As far as I am aware all syncros should have that spacer, I reckon some just get lost by mechanics over the years (just like all the tinware that encloses the engine on a diesel)
With the spacer the bolts should be 50mm.

morymob Tue Apr 29, 2014 5:27 am

At the time i never heard of spacers so i guess all mine were thrown away, over 10yrs now & no problems so i'm not to worry.

insyncro Tue Apr 29, 2014 5:38 am

Using the spacers and properly sized fasteners is recommended.

Syncrozilla Tue Apr 29, 2014 6:30 am

They came on every 14" syncro from the factory. Did they also come on 16"? I can't remember seeing them on the 16" syncros I've worked on. So the question is why? My theory is that vw had a problem with the axel popping out of the outer cv under extreme wheel drop with the wheel at full lock. Rather than make the axel a little longer they put the spacer in there. Or perhaps it's there to keep the axel from contacting the inside of the flange? Anybody know for sure why the spacer is there?

joseph928 Tue Apr 29, 2014 6:36 am

:bay_blue: No spacers, but use
Nord lock washers. They make up the space of the shim and never and can't come loose! Great little things and at only $12 for 25 sets what a deal. EBay! :D

Syncrozilla Tue Apr 29, 2014 6:41 am

joseph928 wrote: :bay_blue: No spacers, but use
Nord lock washers. They make up the space of the shim and never and can't come loose! Great little things and at only $12 for 25 sets what a deal. EBay! :D

We are not talking about the spacers that go outside the cv joint. We are talking about the round one that goes between the cv joint and the flange.

hans j Tue Apr 29, 2014 7:26 am

Yes the stock bolts for fronts are longer than the rears, especially with spacers. But if you are running aftermarket axles, the bolts need to be even longer since the EMPI CV joints are thicker than stock.

insyncro Tue Apr 29, 2014 8:31 am

Syncrozilla wrote: They came on every 14" syncro from the factory. Did they also come on 16"? I can't remember seeing them on the 16" syncros I've worked on. So the question is why? My theory is that vw had a problem with the axel popping out of the outer cv under extreme wheel drop with the wheel at full lock. Rather than make the axel a little longer they put the spacer in there. Or perhaps it's there to keep the axel from contacting the inside of the flange? Anybody know for sure why the spacer is there?

I agree about angle Seth and it helps as the track front to rear is different.
The rear is narrower than the front.

I remember talking to Derek about it and him saying that there isn't much info about it in any of the VW literature he has.

Since people have posted saying no issues...I have seen many Syncros missing the spacers AND have had extremely worn front CVs.
The front outers are expensive, using the spacers helps prolong their premature wearing, my opinion.

syncrodoka Tue Apr 29, 2014 9:34 am

50mm bolts in the front
48mm bolts in the rear.
Spacers are supposed to be there.

insyncro Tue Apr 29, 2014 9:42 am

For anyone missing the spacers...I sent a set to Ken at VanAgain to have copies made.
He has them if you need them.

Steve Arndt Tue Apr 29, 2014 1:16 pm

There is an aftermarket product called "grease and go cv spacer".

http://www.pacificcustoms.com/mm5/merchant.mvc?Scr...ve-flanges

It has zerk fittings for frequent grease top off in offroad cars. It could work for the missing spacers on a syncro front if not too thick.

insyncro Tue Apr 29, 2014 1:23 pm

Steve Arndt wrote: There is an aftermarket product called "grease and go cv spacer".

http://www.pacificcustoms.com/mm5/merchant.mvc?Scr...ve-flanges

It has zerk fittings for frequent grease top off in offroad cars. It could work for the missing spacers on a syncro front if not too thick.

Steve, I have them.
They are wider.
Never tried them with stock half shafts, mine are custom and I had the length adjusted for them.
It is a treat to add grease with them :wink:

Christopher Schimke Tue Apr 29, 2014 1:49 pm

insyncro wrote: Steve Arndt wrote: There is an aftermarket product called "grease and go cv spacer".

http://www.pacificcustoms.com/mm5/merchant.mvc?Scr...ve-flanges

It has zerk fittings for frequent grease top off in offroad cars. It could work for the missing spacers on a syncro front if not too thick.

Steve, I have them.
They are wider.
Never tried them with stock half shafts, mine are custom and I had the length adjusted for them.
It is a treat to add grease with them :wink:

Just for reference, the stock spacers are right at 3/16". I had to make one recently (yes, I know that they can be purchased, but...) and measured a stock one for reference. Those greasable ones are 7/16" thick, so 1/4" thicker than stock.

insyncro Tue Apr 29, 2014 4:15 pm

I think it is awesome that you made your own Christopher.

IIRC, the first set of the grease rings I purchased were universals and lacked the recess for the lip on the flange...they were cheap.
The type 2 rings had the recess, but I never installed them.
I did install the rings both front and rear, only inner though, at first and the 930 version.
I think they are a tiny bit thicker, I have to check for the brand, can't remember.
The rear outers were possible to fit, but very close to the top and bottom of the inner trailing arm and didn't allow for a standard grease end on the gun.
You will need an end that accepts the zerk at 90 degrees.

Also from memory, it is a good thing that shafts would need to be shortened to accept multiple spacers.
The work to the shafts can be done and while at it add the second c clip to keep the shaft from migrating into the flange caps.
This can happen at full compression of the suspension.

insyncro Tue Apr 29, 2014 4:16 pm

I think it is awesome that you made your own Christopher.

IIRC, the first set of the grease rings I purchased were universals and lacked the recess for the lip on the flange...they were cheap.
The type 2 rings had the recess, but I never installed them.
I did install the rings both front and rear, only inner though, at first and the 930 version.
I think they are a tiny bit thicker, I have to check for the brand, can't remember.
The rear outers were possible to fit, but very close to the top and bottom of the inner trailing arm and didn't allow for a standard grease end on the gun.
You will need an end that accepts the zerk at 90 degrees.

Also from memory, it is a good thing that shafts would need to be shortened to accept multiple spacers.
The work to the shafts can be done and while at it add the second c clip to keep the shaft from migrating into the flange caps.
This can happen at full compression of the suspension.

boof1306 Tue Apr 29, 2014 4:28 pm

Those thicker spacers could be a good idea for those with longer than standard travel suspension (and higher ride height). Maybe add something to the bump stop and you will have the same total travel as standard with less risk of the cv popping out.

insyncro Tue Apr 29, 2014 4:56 pm

Yes Sir.
This reminds me that I need to call Burley :wink:

rubbachicken Tue Apr 29, 2014 8:05 pm

i've been thinking more today about it, and i'm going to look for some 55mm bolts, i want more thread through the cv joint cups

the syncro in question is a long distance traveler, alaska and back, guatamala and back, i think it's next outing is going south again.
i'd feel happier i think.

furrylittleotter Tue Apr 29, 2014 8:24 pm

Have you seen these yet? Not sure if they come in the right type for you yet…



http://store.stage8.com/p/8323-cv-joint-3-8-24-x-2-1-2


They look great.

You can also buy bolts drilled for safety wire.

Those grease plates look cool as well, but they look like aluminum, unfortunately and it looks like the would be impossible to lube in the rear control arms, otherwise I'd like to have some!

Maybe I will drill and tap my axles and just put the zerks right on the axle ;)

Neil2



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