TheSamba.com :: View topic - Rear brake spring rubbing on oil slinger on early 58'

Sat Nov 28, 2015 6:50 pm

I have a very early 58' ( built August 57' ). Rear brake has been making some noise so I pulled off the drum to take a look. It looks like one of springs is rubbing the oil slinger. First off, did the PO install all this correctly? It looks like the e-brake arm should be on the inside of the shoe.

thanks

Sat Nov 28, 2015 7:00 pm

58 brakes from gallery photos ;
I noticed on yours that the lowest horizontal spring doesn't run across the brake adjusters to hold them tight .

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Sat Nov 28, 2015 7:09 pm

the shoe adjuster has the place for the angled springs to hook to in my picture. The one you posted doesn't appear to have it. Maybe just run the one spring on the bottom?
Thanks

Sat Nov 28, 2015 7:14 pm

You are correct ; your adjuster " box" IS different . I thought going to the gallery photos would help you but maby the 58 photos ARN"T 58 .....sorry ....

Hang in there ; someone with a 57/58 can help you better

I'm not helpin anymore :cry:

Sat Nov 28, 2015 8:25 pm

According to progressive refinements, brakes did not switch to one spring on the bottom until Oct. `57 at chassis # 1 673 351. Are your brake shoes 30mm wide? The bottom springs look in the picture to be maybe a bit too long - not under pressure.

Sat Nov 28, 2015 8:46 pm

This is something I found that shows a 1954 backing plate.

And this says that 54-57 was like yours...kind of.

And this is what 58 Brakes should look like, except cleaner

Okay, not like that last one but similar :lol:

Sun Nov 29, 2015 6:07 am

The picture that grandpa Pete posted looks like it was installed correctly.
I'm not sure about the other two. The earlier one looks like it was installed upside down and
The dirty one looks like a front as it has no axle.

I just need to know how to set up the lower springs on my brakes. In my picture the lower right hand spring is rubbing the oil slinger.

Sun Nov 29, 2015 7:28 am

I can tell you from my working an garage doors with extension springs that the spring on the lower right, the one with the gap between the coils, has failed and no longer works properly. Quite possible the spring is no longer straight.

Sun Nov 29, 2015 7:53 am

cbeck wrote: I can tell you from my working an garage doors with extension springs that the spring on the lower right, the one with the gap between the coils, has failed and no longer works properly. Quite possible the spring is no longer straight.

yes, its been rubbing on the oil slinger. I need to know if the ebrake arm goes on the inside of the shoe or if the spring configuration is wrong.

Sun Nov 29, 2015 9:41 am

In August 1957 at chassis 1 604 758 (or 1 600 440, depending on the source), the brake back plates were turned 180 so that the cylinders are at the top and adjusters are at the bottom.

In October 1957 at chassis 1 673 351, brakes went with the one spring (two spring total) design.

I assume your chassis # is between 1 604 758 and 1 673 351.

From what I can tell, on brakes with the two spring design (three springs total), the emergency brake lever gets attached to the back of the shoe. In your picture, the lever does not look like it will fit behind the shoe. Maybe that lever needs to be switched with the lever on the other side - I'm just guessing.

The spring configuration looks correct but that one spring does not look like it can do its job.

From the 1958 (August 1957) Bug Owner's Manual:
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/archives/manuals/aug57bug/page60.jpg

Sun Nov 29, 2015 9:50 am

h~moto wrote: In August 1957 at chassis 1 604 758 (or 1 600 440, depending on the source), the brake back plates were turned 180 so that the cylinders are at the top and adjusters are at the bottom.

In October 1957 at chassis 1 673 351, brakes went with the one spring (two spring total) design.

I assume your chassis # is between 1 604 758 and 1 673 351.

From what I can tell, on brakes with the two spring design (three springs total), the emergency brake lever gets attached to the back of the shoe. In your picture, the lever does not look like it will fit behind the shoe. Maybe that lever needs to be switched with the lever on the other side - I'm just guessing.

thanks h~moto my chassis # is 1 607 xxx so yes . That explains why I get confused looking at oval window pics with the wheel cylinder at the bottom.

it does look like the lever needs to be switched to the other side and put inside the brake shoe. Time to take off the other drum and take a look.

Sun Nov 29, 2015 11:41 am

is it me or those are 65 and later angled-adjuster shoes??

Sun Nov 29, 2015 12:08 pm

Slow 1200 wrote: is it me or those are 65 and later angled-adjuster shoes??

in which picture?

Mon Nov 30, 2015 3:20 am

iamdonquixote wrote: Slow 1200 wrote: is it me or those are 65 and later angled-adjuster shoes??

in which picture?
sorry, that was not very clear, I meant your original picture!

Mon Nov 30, 2015 8:32 am

Slow 1200 wrote: iamdonquixote wrote: Slow 1200 wrote: is it me or those are 65 and later angled-adjuster shoes??

in which picture?
sorry, that was not very clear, I meant your original picture!

so you think maybe my bug has the wrong shoes as well?

Mon Nov 30, 2015 10:27 am

iamdonquixote wrote: Slow 1200 wrote: iamdonquixote wrote: Slow 1200 wrote: is it me or those are 65 and later angled-adjuster shoes??

in which picture?
sorry, that was not very clear, I meant your original picture!

so you think maybe my bug has the wrong shoes as well?

nevermind, looking at the pictures above it seems like you have 54-57 shoes??

Mon Dec 14, 2015 11:29 am

so it appears that very early 58' bugs did use 57 brake backing plates, brake shoes, and wheel cylinders. The rotated the backing plates 180 deg and put the wheel cylinder on the top.

However, should my car use oval window e-brake cables??? I was able to put the ebrake lever on the inside of the shoes ok howerver the ebrake cable seemed a bit large.

Mon Dec 14, 2015 1:02 pm

You won't use oval window ebrake cables because they had a very long sheath (and a longer cable.) The cable actually loops around and enters from the rear. I wonder if an oval window could use later ebrake cables by turning the brakes 180 degrees or swapping them side to side. A lot of old ovals where make into customs with late model running gear but I'm not exactly sure what is interchangeable.

Mon Aug 22, 2016 1:50 pm

I'm reviving this thread for help.

I have a very early 58', what rear brake parts does it use?

54-57 drums ?
54-57 shoes?

what else? I can't get the rear brakes to work nicely and want to take another shot at fixing them.

Mon Aug 22, 2016 2:20 pm

The very early 1958 Bugs use 1957 brakes complete. Drums, shoes, springs, adjusters, wheel cylinders. They look like 1957 brakes (and the 1954 brakes posted above by Flyboy) except every picture I've seen for early 1958 shows the rear brakes with the wheel cylinder on the top and the ebrake cable exiting on the bottom pointing forward (spin the rear backing plates 180 degrees compared to the picture by Flyboy.)