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Wed Jul 20, 2016 7:22 pm

Well, my friends, the time has come
To raise the roof and have some fun
Throw away the work to be done
Let the music play on
(play on, play on)

all the way from the great state of Texas, daveark has returned for more work. this time we will be installing A/C to his bus, making it the ultimate Subaru conversion....heat, A/C...what more could you ask for?

for those of you who disagree with Subaru conversions, A/C or any other mods, just fucking check out now. put me on ignore, hit back on your browser and just leave. it's not yours, you're not paying for it. you're not dealing with any issues and it isn't your "resale value" to worry about....just check out now please.....

so, daveark and I instantly hit it off, which makes doing this kind of work "easy" and fun when you have a guy like him in your corner. we have stayed in regular contact since the conversion, as one of my giant concerns was how was the swap going to handle the Texas heat.

well, it has with flying colors. never once has he broken 200*, and has actually worried about it running a bit too cool. yay for me :D

so, we decided on a kit from ICE A/C. it just made the most sense. http://iceautoair.com/index-1.html

Bob Poggi (the owner) has been great, and we are kind of working in conjunction to make the kit to work out of the box (so to speak) for converted buses.

I am going to be working a bit backasswards on the install, as it is suppose to be hotter than the devils armpit here this week/weekend so it's a perfect opportunity to log some miles in the heat (well, the heat of Connecticut, that is)

so, moving on. I know you guys want pictures, not a novel....

got the main condenser built

and mounted to the frame

ended up removing (surgically) the heater tree

which left me with 3 nice big holes

this should help aid in the airflow to both the condenser and radiator. the reality is all of the holes were there, I just removed the heater tree to clear the main condenser.

the sub condenser... well now that was interesting. the instructions say "if you mount it right, you will be able to remove the rock guard" I call b.s.....

as you can see, I have to clear the sway bar. putting it as far back as possible makes is dam near impossible to take the splash pan off.

here is what the bar looks like with weight on it

so, I have it set at the moment in the "least worse" position. still, it would be impossible to remove the splash pan. I am going to have to work on this some.

but, for the time being, it's ready to go for a few good hot laps and see what it does to my airflow. I am thinking that this is a good first step, and 98% sure it will be just fine....

Wed Jul 20, 2016 7:32 pm

No fan shrouds?
Those condensers look nice... Big.. Why not mount the sub cooler on an outboard side, tucked up and on the lean?

Northern "heat"

Wed Jul 20, 2016 7:45 pm

it's not the way the kit was designed.

page 19 if the link no worky

http://iceautoair.com/vwbus19.html

besides, working on cars for a living, you could drive trough a monsoon and the outer foot or so of the car is soaked, while the center is bone dry. I think this set up is a bit safer from cast off thrown up by the tires.

scrivyscriv wrote:

Northern "heat"

suppose to be into the 90's and humid as all get out up here. that's hot man...32* is t-shirt weather for me :lol:

Wed Jul 20, 2016 8:11 pm

Guy must be confident in his product to post install and specs for it online.. I appreciate the sharing but if I was selling a kit like that I dunno if I'd be so shareful!

Yeah if you can get frosty nipples in your heat and humidity, Texas heat will only make it colder since it's so dry over there..
I will say I don't care for the under dash units that much, But I'm curious how it all turns out. What kind of bus is it? The blue paint looks like that 70 deluxe

Wed Jul 20, 2016 8:53 pm

You are such a dickhead goose.

Wed Jul 20, 2016 9:32 pm

you might want to wait on installing that until after this weekend because the heat map of the USA predicts that most bus owners will pay triple or quadruple for that system after this weekend. We are supposed to have a record heat wave across most of the USA this weekend.

Wed Jul 20, 2016 9:55 pm

does this work with air cooled engines?

Thu Jul 21, 2016 5:12 am

sub'd.

Been thinking about this all summer in this damn humidity. Did some mountain exploring this past weekend in my Suburban because I wanted to get to the mountains at interstate speed AND not melt. The whole time I was wishing I was in my Bus.

Thu Jul 21, 2016 5:17 am

I'm in. I'm hoping to be able to really look at AC install this winter for next summer.

Thu Jul 21, 2016 5:22 am

scrivyscriv wrote: Guy must be confident in his product to post install and specs for it online.. I appreciate the sharing but if I was selling a kit like that I dunno if I'd be so shareful!

it's a copy of the DPD under dash unit that was a dealer installed option back in the 70's

I know the fellow from texas that rehabbed his overhead unit loves it, but that one just causes too much damage, and kiss your headliner goodbye.

it's this guy

http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=640011&highlight=putt-n

notchboy wrote: You are such a dickhead goose.

:lol:

SGKent wrote: you might want to wait on installing that until after this weekend because the heat map of the USA predicts that most bus owners will pay triple or quadruple for that system after this weekend. We are supposed to have a record heat wave across most of the USA this weekend.

that would be a great idea if I were of the price gouging variety. somewhere on the site, or install instructions they estimate a 15-20 hour install time. granted, I will have more into it than that seeing we have to modify some stuff.

the kit as a whole isn't bad...but some of the stamping are poor and so far, EVERY hole needs to be reamed just a hair to get stuff to line up, which is pretty annoying.

someone else (I wish I could find the thread) mentioned they used the Gilmore kit and this kit. they said the ICE kit was far superior in cooling vs the Gilmore.

I think the overhead unit would cool the bus FASTER, but I will let you guys know my thoughts for sure.

Brian wrote: does this work with air cooled engines?

yes, that was what the kit was designed for. I will end up getting hose ends custom made to work with the Subaru compressor, and that is due to my "form and function" rule and not having it look out of place.

Thu Jul 21, 2016 5:40 am

Quote: too much damage

What kind of damage are you talking about? I'm almost ready to hang my overhead unit myself

I'm actually completely surprised to see you not run a fan shroud on the condensers btw

Thu Jul 21, 2016 6:25 am

scrivyscriv wrote:
What kind of damage are you talking about? I'm almost ready to hang my overhead unit myself

I'm actually completely surprised to see you not run a fan shroud on the condensers btw

try to find photo's of one that was removed....it's ugly. holes into the headliner for mounting, and it "pulls" the headliner towards the roof.

I wish I had photos of the few I have seen removed. I am not saying it isn't a neat set up, and it was dealer installed, but it really makes a mess.

daveark had one in his bus before I got it for the conversion. I wish I snapped a photo of it. the headliner looked like a big diaper where it was once installed.

in terms of the shrouding on the condensers. it's a kit. not designed by me and knowing what I do about airflow, there will be plenty of air movement around the system.

Thu Jul 21, 2016 7:15 am

Quote: does this work with air cooled engines?
the under dash unit fits well and provides excellent cooling.

To my knowledge these are the only downsides with an air cooled motor:

1. The air cooled motor will be removed and worked on several times in its life. That is just how it was designed. The brackets, hoses, and compressor make for additional work and complexity. The VW air cooled engine is not like many cars where they will never experience an engine pull in their entire life.

2. An air cooled engine shroud has to be modified to make it fit. It was not part of the original design.

3. Air Cooled engines in buses are already at the limit of their power and cooling. If that were not the case we would not see so many burned pistons, cracked heads, dropped valve seats, etc. Adding additional strain to an air cooled engine just makes it that much worse.

The owner of a bus needs to decide whether the benefits outweigh the problems such an install will create. When the bus is running right the A/C is great. When the engine has to come out it is a PITA and that is why so many buses are missing the compressor. People got tired of paying all the extra money to remove and recharge them. Face it - these buses are 40 year old cars designed to roll the windows down to cool. We crossed the desert at night in those days or used evap coolers. That is why we take trips in our Acura or Sable, and use the bus for fun trips.

Thu Jul 21, 2016 7:56 am

SGKent wrote:

1. The air cooled motor will be removed and worked on several times in its life. That is just how it was designed. The brackets, hoses, and compressor make for additional work and complexity. The VW air cooled engine is not like many cars where they will never experience an engine pull in their entire life.

all true SG. this is where my "form and function" comes in....the compressor will be able to be removed, wrapped in a heavy blanket and pulled off to the side without opening the system should the engine need service. it will add about 5 minutes to the removal.

speaking if that, pulling the Subaru is EASIER than a T4. you can have one out in about 1/2 hour at a slow pace. the biggest thing is bleeding the coolant after the fact, but that isn't *too* hateful of a procedure either.

Thu Jul 21, 2016 8:00 am

skills@eurocarsplus wrote: SGKent wrote:

1. The air cooled motor will be removed and worked on several times in its life. That is just how it was designed. The brackets, hoses, and compressor make for additional work and complexity. The VW air cooled engine is not like many cars where they will never experience an engine pull in their entire life.

all true SG. this is where my "form and function" comes in....the compressor will be able to be removed, wrapped in a heavy blanket and pulled off to the side without opening the system should the engine need service. it will add about 5 minutes to the removal.

speaking if that, pulling the Subaru is EASIER than a T4. you can have one out in about 1/2 hour at a slow pace. the biggest thing is bleeding the coolant after the fact, but that isn't *too* hateful of a procedure either.

are you talking about removing one from a T4 or a Subaru in 5 minutes?

Thu Jul 21, 2016 8:23 am

Subaru. the T4 rig is the most convoluted set up I have seen :shock:

Thu Jul 21, 2016 10:33 am

So do both of the condensers sit under the bus on there own (not in front of the rad)? I'm guessing you need 2 because the condenser is so big and air flow is limited. Hope to do mine over the winter as well.
Thanks for sharing

Thu Jul 21, 2016 10:45 am

not sure I understand the question. this is the layout

so the condenser will be mounted as per the instructions. had some windshield time with the bus and the condensers mounted. so far, the cooling system doesn't care, but it was only about 80*. I will get more test time over the weekend when the weather turns hot

Thu Jul 21, 2016 10:51 am

skills@eurocarsplus wrote: Subaru. the T4 rig is the most convoluted set up I have seen :shock:

I was going to say that if you found a way to R&R a T4 AC compressor and lines in 5 minutes you'll sell lots of those units. The T4 ones are too messy, even the well designed ones. The engine really doesn't have the strong attachment points that are needed. I had friend once whose small compressor failed on a chevy and it tore the mounting ears off a steel block. Can't imagine what that would have done to a VW case.

Thu Jul 21, 2016 12:23 pm

I've never seen someone talk about how well the under dash AC provides cool air to the rear seat occupants, other than the one comment here.

I'm excited to see how well it'll do for the back seat occupants. I was wondering about a second evaporator in the back.