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ShaneBacon Fri Aug 26, 2016 8:15 pm

So I have 1969 fuel injected type 3 squareback which I suspect has a bad fuel pump. The line coming from the pump is bone dry so I'm guessing its shot. But I am going to test it to make sure that my assumption is true. I've heard about the soaking it diesel and then running it method but I have some questions.

The main thing I'm worried about is catching all of the diesel on fire. The positive and negative connectors on the pump are awfully close and I'm afriad of causing spark. Would that set the diesel on fire? Also, which connection is positive and which one is negative? or does it not really matter since I will be reversing the polarity it make it go backwards? Here is a picture of the pump I am talking about:


Also what are some pumps you would recommend that are fairly cheap? In case the fuel pump turns out to be bad.

Thanks!

Donnie strickland Fri Aug 26, 2016 8:25 pm

Don't bother. Just replace it with an Airtex E2000 from any auto parts store. That's what I did, along with many other members of this forum.

Even if you could get it to run it will leak, or will be leaking very shortly.

KTPhil Fri Aug 26, 2016 9:06 pm

You can try it, and polarity won't matter since you will be reversing it.
Make the final connection way form the fuel (longer cables). Be prepared for the pump to jump when started. It may not work but it's cheap to try.

Hip2besquare Sun Aug 28, 2016 7:38 am

just send the pump to jim adney and he will rebuild it for you I have had over a dozen pumps rebuilt by him and never had one leak. He does a fantastic job rebuilding them and this way you can keep the factory part intact.

Richie NY

raygreenwood Sun Aug 28, 2016 9:09 am

Here...in this thread I posted part numbers for several common....modern...pumps that will fit and function perfectly with very few mods. Most drop right in.

Also... a part # list with hundreds ir not thousands of fuel pump part #'s you can peruse.

http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=640244&highlight=

In my opinion...fuel pumps are like brake pads. Don't run around looking for 40 year old NOS when you can have modern pads with better capability for less...and they are easier to find in a pinch.

In my opinion and experience...unless you are doing a concors restoration...there is no good or useful reason to keep the original fuel pump.

It would really suck to be 500 miles from home on a trip or on the way to a show....and have a pump crap out...and all you can do is look for a used one in the middle of nowhere. Put something modern in. Its just a pump.

Ray

ShaneBacon Sun Aug 28, 2016 1:59 pm

Okay... I tried the test on the old fuel pump and it did nothing. So then I bought a MasterPro MPE16020 which is a fuel pump for an '85 Ford Ranger and I have a dumb question.

Which way does the pump pump the fuel?
I can't find anything about with the box it came with.


raygreenwood Sun Aug 28, 2016 7:24 pm

Look around. .....there is usually a flow arrow.

That said......on 99% of the in line pumps I have seen.....the outlet end is the one where the wires attache. Ray

KTPhil Sun Aug 28, 2016 9:26 pm

And if you don't get an answer and aren't sure, hook up hoses in a bucket of diesel fuel and try it. Being a DC motor, it will matter how the electrical is connected... any marks on those?

Bobnotch Mon Aug 29, 2016 8:56 am

The end where the wiires connect is the output, and the screw on end is input (and where you attach the fuel filter). I hope this helps.

ShaneBacon Mon Aug 29, 2016 5:04 pm

Thanks! I've decided to put it in the way you guys suggested and then turn the key and see if spits out fuel. But today while installing the pump, I ran into my next problem: The fuel pump doesn't fit on the original mount When I have the clamp that goes around the pump all the way to the end it barely touches this piece of metal and there'd be no way I could fit a hose in that space.

I'm planning on selling it after I get it up and running so I'd really prefer to not put holes in it for a new mount. Especially considering the amount of original parts in this car.

One possible solution I've though of is using an L piece on the input of the pump. That would make it fit perfectly. I check all my local auto part stores and none of them carry that said piece. I'm going to wait until tomorrow when the hardware store is open and see what they have.

Another possible solution: zip ties? :lol:

What did you guys who put in a ford ranger pump like this do to overcome this issue?


blues90 Mon Aug 29, 2016 5:29 pm

The ones who have done it here have the foam sleeve that goes around the pumps body so the original clamp fits or use something else to increase the pumps diameter and they move the bracket , the tin sections that the rubber mounts fit into from the far right opening in the axle to the right side of the center opening so the fuel hoses clear without kinking since the new pump is longer.

Here is a link with a few photo's.

http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=4...p;start=20

I am not really sure what you are asking here. It does not make sense.

ShaneBacon Mon Aug 29, 2016 7:54 pm

blues90 wrote: The ones who have done it here have the foam sleeve that goes around the pumps body so the original clamp fits or use something else to increase the pumps diameter and they move the bracket , the tin sections that the rubber mounts fit into from the far right opening in the axle to the right side of the center opening so the fuel hoses clear without kinking since the new pump is longer.

Here is a link with a few photo's.

http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=4...p;start=20

I am not really sure what you are asking here. It does not make sense.

I was asking what others did in order to make this pump fit. Thought that was a simple question but obviously not...

If you meant that my issue didn't make sense, I went out and crawled under the car to show you what I meant.



The inlet on the right side hits a metal wall and won't even fit on the mount and as you can see in the picture, I have the clamp all the way to the farthest end of the pump.

Honestly, your post didn't make much sense to me either but I clicked on the link and found out that the mount could be taken off. I was unaware of this. You could have just told me that the mount can be taken off and moved to the center hole. But thanks for the thought anyways!

Mike Fisher Mon Aug 29, 2016 8:43 pm

ShaneBacon wrote: blues90 wrote: The ones who have done it here have the foam sleeve that goes around the pumps body so the original clamp fits or use something else to increase the pumps diameter and they move the bracket , the tin sections that the rubber mounts fit into from the far right opening in the axle to the right side of the center opening so the fuel hoses clear without kinking since the new pump is longer.

Here is a link with a few photo's.

http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=4...p;start=20

I am not really sure what you are asking here. It does not make sense.

I was asking what others did in order to make this pump fit. Thought that was a simple question but obviously not...

If you meant that my issue didn't make sense, I went out and crawled under the car to show you what I meant.



The inlet on the right side hits a metal wall and won't even fit on the mount and as you can see in the picture, I have the clamp all the way to the farthest end of the pump.

Honestly, your post didn't make much sense to me either but I clicked on the link and found out that the mount could be taken off. I was unaware of this. You could have just told me that the mount can be taken off and moved to the center hole. But thanks for the thought anyways!

blues90 told you where some pictures are & gave you the link, but you didn't even bother to look at the thread he found for you? If you don't like this method feel free to do whatever you want! Here's one of the pictures from that thread:


ShaneBacon Tue Aug 30, 2016 7:28 am

Mike Fisher wrote: ShaneBacon wrote: blues90 wrote: The ones who have done it here have the foam sleeve that goes around the pumps body so the original clamp fits or use something else to increase the pumps diameter and they move the bracket , the tin sections that the rubber mounts fit into from the far right opening in the axle to the right side of the center opening so the fuel hoses clear without kinking since the new pump is longer.

Here is a link with a few photo's.

http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=4...p;start=20

I am not really sure what you are asking here. It does not make sense.

I was asking what others did in order to make this pump fit. Thought that was a simple question but obviously not...

If you meant that my issue didn't make sense, I went out and crawled under the car to show you what I meant.



The inlet on the right side hits a metal wall and won't even fit on the mount and as you can see in the picture, I have the clamp all the way to the farthest end of the pump.

Honestly, your post didn't make much sense to me either but I clicked on the link and found out that the mount could be taken off. I was unaware of this. You could have just told me that the mount can be taken off and moved to the center hole. But thanks for the thought anyways!

blues90 told you where some pictures are & gave you the link, but you didn't even bother to look at the thread he found for you? If you don't like this method feel free to do whatever you want! Here's one of the pictures from that thread:



Well obviously no one knows how to fully read my posts here.

ShaneBacon wrote: but I clicked on the link and found out that the mount could be taken off

I said in that post the only reason I found out the mount could be used was by reading the things in that post. It really grinds my gears when people say "I am not really sure what you are asking here. It does not make sense." when I try my best to be clear. I even put at the end of my post my question put simply: what did others with a fuel pump like this to make it fit.

raygreenwood Tue Aug 30, 2016 7:55 am

Mike Fisher wrote: ShaneBacon wrote: blues90 wrote: The ones who have done it here have the foam sleeve that goes around the pumps body so the original clamp fits or use something else to increase the pumps diameter and they move the bracket , the tin sections that the rubber mounts fit into from the far right opening in the axle to the right side of the center opening so the fuel hoses clear without kinking since the new pump is longer.

Here is a link with a few photo's.

http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=4...p;start=20

I am not really sure what you are asking here. It does not make sense.

I was asking what others did in order to make this pump fit. Thought that was a simple question but obviously not...

If you meant that my issue didn't make sense, I went out and crawled under the car to show you what I meant.



The inlet on the right side hits a metal wall and won't even fit on the mount and as you can see in the picture, I have the clamp all the way to the farthest end of the pump.

Honestly, your post didn't make much sense to me either but I clicked on the link and found out that the mount could be taken off. I was unaware of this. You could have just told me that the mount can be taken off and moved to the center hole. But thanks for the thought anyways!

blues90 told you where some pictures are & gave you the link, but you didn't even bother to look at the thread he found for you? If you don't like this method feel free to do whatever you want! Here's one of the pictures from that thread:



Let me say right now.....what you were asking was not clear at all. It was not clear because of your lack of experience with these cars. Thats not a bad thing.....but most peoples problem in these instances comes from jot knowing how many possible permutations there are or what questions even COULD be asked.

Why do I say this?......because you asked......more than one question at one time (both pump to bracket spacing and outlet fitting obstruction)......and tthere is more than one or two fitment issues when going to virtually any aftermarket pump.

1. On some cars and pumps there is reach issue to the electrical pigtail

2. There is usually a pump body length versus inlet fitting issue as you found out

3. There can be on some versions of this pump from some parts houses that have a totally different inlet/outlet hose diameter.

4. There are some versions of this pump that come with no inlet/outlet fittings at all.

5 In most cases there is a diameter difference to the original clamp bracket.

Perhaps others found less clarity with your question.....because OF the link provided....because in it.....in more than one way .....it addressed virtually every one of the choke points I listed above.....if you just slow down to read. The lack of clarity comes from the fact that you were provided everything you needed....in that link and still had an issue.

Also you kind of answered ....partly....you own questions. Yes....you can buy an L-fitting. Simply go on line and Google electric fuel pump fittings or similar. Summit, Jegs, Russel....and hundreds of other companies sell these for every thread system and pump on the market.

My advice.....is to lighten up a bit. Ray

Erik G Tue Aug 30, 2016 8:15 am

Plus, using imgur... cant see any of your pics. There is a reason there is a gallery here for use in the forum

ShaneBacon Tue Aug 30, 2016 7:24 pm

There are a lot of things that I'd like to say but I'm going to keep it simple:
1. People need to stop unessacarily jumping in on this.
2. In most other forums I've been on you have to use another site to upload pictures. Plus, I'm new and I don't know this stuff so instead of using the way I uploaded my pictures as a method to beat me down, say: "Hey, could you use the gallery this site has instead of using Imgur? People won't be able to see your pictures otherwise."
3. From the perspective of a new member the experience has not been good. I'm not going to tell you my exact age but I'm still in highschool, I've worked with cars some in a shop but not much. I'm very inexperienced with these types of things so thats the reason I come to a forum like this. I don't know as much as you guys do about these cars and cars in gerneral so it'd be helpful if people asked me to clarify something instead of saying "You don't make sense."
4. Yes I over reacted. But I've solved my problem so there isn't any need to fuss anymore.
Thanks.

sjbartnik Tue Aug 30, 2016 8:15 pm

Suck it up kid. You admit your inexperience and that's a good thing. That's step 1 of learning. We've all been there. There is a lot of knowledge on these forums - a lot of people who REALLY know their shit. Get over your ego and listen to what they're telling you. They're not here to hold your hand and make you feel better, they're here to help you get your car working.

Stick around, you and your car will be better for it.

blues90 Tue Aug 30, 2016 8:27 pm

ShaneBacon wrote: There are a lot of things that I'd like to say but I'm going to keep it simple:
1. People need to stop unessacarily jumping in on this.
2. In most other forums I've been on you have to use another site to upload pictures. Plus, I'm new and I don't know this stuff so instead of using the way I uploaded my pictures as a method to beat me down, say: "Hey, could you use the gallery this site has instead of using Imgur? People won't be able to see your pictures otherwise."
3. From the perspective of a new member the experience has not been good. I'm not going to tell you my exact age but I'm still in highschool, I've worked with cars some in a shop but not much. I'm very inexperienced with these types of things so thats the reason I come to a forum like this. I don't know as much as you guys do about these cars and cars in gerneral so it'd be helpful if people asked me to clarify something instead of saying "You don't make sense."
4. Yes I over reacted. But I've solved my problem so there isn't any need to fuss anymore.
Thanks.

I did all I could do to help. All I said is the way you described how the pump wouldn't fit and the photo's you posted even though I could see them fine didn't show much which left me and others very little to work with . So I fond a link so you could see it since trying to describe how others did it a photo works much better.

You complain about the members replies and all tried to help.

I'm sure most here realized you didn't know a lot . You use a forum and complain and in your own words say this.

"I'm planning on selling it after I get it up and running so I'd really prefer to not put holes in it for a new mount. Especially considering the amount of original parts in this car."

raygreenwood Tue Aug 30, 2016 9:40 pm

ShaneBacon wrote: There are a lot of things that I'd like to say but I'm going to keep it simple:
1. People need to stop unessacarily jumping in on this.
2. In most other forums I've been on you have to use another site to upload pictures. Plus, I'm new and I don't know this stuff so instead of using the way I uploaded my pictures as a method to beat me down, say: "Hey, could you use the gallery this site has instead of using Imgur? People won't be able to see your pictures otherwise."
3. From the perspective of a new member the experience has not been good. I'm not going to tell you my exact age but I'm still in highschool, I've worked with cars some in a shop but not much. I'm very inexperienced with these types of things so thats the reason I come to a forum like this. I don't know as much as you guys do about these cars and cars in gerneral so it'd be helpful if people asked me to clarify something instead of saying "You don't make sense."
4. Yes I over reacted. But I've solved my problem so there isn't any need to fuss anymore.
Thanks.

Let me compliment you....a little.... :wink: ...if you are still in high school. ....you are doing well. Bear in mind I was driving my first D-jet injected car from my soph year on.

I love that you have the interest and drive. But ask that you bear in mind.....we ....the people you are conversing with here....have been virtually everywhere you are ......or are likely ever going to be with these cars.. .... many times.

So based on that.....please don't assume that if you ask a question.....that its a simple, short or direct answer.....and your question may require several questiojs back to you to get the correct answer to you.
Also.....this is not just a free (ok...technically its free), instantaneous Google database where you just look up what you need......its all there....your are questions answered and you are on your way.
In some respects with the volume of posts and data here....with some questions. ...it can be that simple. But in reality you are asking real people questions. We then look at our experiences and take the time to give an answer. Respect that.
Ray



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