TheSamba.com :: View topic

Thu Apr 01, 2004 6:32 pm

Folks:

At the risk of asking a newbie question, just having registered for the forum.

I am involved in the stage rally world here in the US. If you've seen WRC coverage on Speed, that is what I do (I am a navigator, and sit in the right seat, and tell the driver what to do). If you are not familiar, these are races over gravel roads that cover anywhere between 150 and 350 miles, of which about 1/3 is full out racing without speed limits.

I'm an H2O guy, starting with a Scirocco in 1982, and progressing from there. I've owned two non-vw's, an S-10 Blazer, and a Volvo 850 Turbo (current vehicle) since then. I owned the Blazer for less than a year. Other than that, it has been a succession of Dubs, including Golfs, Jettas, and a Corrado G-60. I currently own an 86 GTI for RallyCross (which has nice stuff like the Bilstein Group A rally suspension, SS lines, etc., and have a spare shell that I was planning to build to race trim, UNTIL

I considered an air-cooled vehicle.

Believe it or not, there is a class that the vintage dub has a great chance to dominate in. It is called "Group 2" in the SCCA, and "Modified 2" with NASA Rally Sport (who are the two rally sanctioning bodies in the US). If you look at my e-mail, obviously I am involved with one of them (and spent many many years volunteering for the other).

So, I have a number of questions, that maybe you all can address. Group 2/M2 allows displacement up to 2.4 liters, and just requires that you run a block made by the manufacturer. It allows you to strip your interior, replace body panels with composites (with the exeption of doors and the roof), and leaves you unrestricted on suspension. R&P and tranny are unrestricted. Body must resemble production vehicle, with allowance allowed to flare fenders to cover wider wheels.

Part of this inquiry is "keepin' it cheap" So (1) what is the most hp one can make with displacement up to 2.4 liters that does not require frequent rebuilds, and is reliable day to day, and in the above race conditions, and how?; (2) what are realistic tranny/R&P options, especialy in light of the ability to bolt in a Type II box? Are there dog boxes available?; and (3) what is a cost effective suspension that can take the bumps?

What can be done for $2K, $4K and $5K respectively?

Do any of you all have an interest in racing in the Eastern US? Western US?. If you were to create a class for air-cooled VW's to run in rally events, which was affordable to entry level folks, how would you structure it? (yeah, and I know about Class 11 and 5-1600). Would you be interested in running a Class 11 or 5-1600 street legal vehicle in rally events if you were allowed to if prepped to SCORE trim?

BTW, any car that is under 2000 lbs, and has 150 plus HP has the ability to win G2/M2 outright it any rally it enters. The national champions in 2001 and 2002 ran a 2800 lb, 120 hp Isuzu Impulse, and I know them personally (and he is a hell of driver). This was against a number of cars running somewhere around 2500 lbs, and 220 hp. He's placed as high as 4th or 5th running in a field of 40 cars, of which half were AWD monsters like EVOs and WRXs running 300+ hp.

So, any feedback regarding advice on building, desire to run, etc., would be greatly appreciated.

Very truly yours,

Wilson von Kessler

Thu Apr 01, 2004 9:26 pm

You may want to look into a type 4 engine swap (Type engines used in later Bus and Porsche 914). Hit up Jake Raby: http://www.massivetype4.com/index2.shtml He is the Type 4 guy to go to, he has prepped all kinds of raced type setup including the Baja 500.

Sat Apr 03, 2004 6:29 am

Thanks Nick.

I took a look at the site. Pretty impressive! And in my area code (706).

Regards,

Wilson

P.S. Looking at your info, I grew up in Baltimore County. In the old days we used to go four wheeling along the NCRR tracks running along the Gunpowder (which is now a rails/trails conversion :( ).

Thu Apr 15, 2004 12:51 pm

I am a newbee to the site and have the rally fever myself. I dont plan to race though, just for fun. (1) Horsepower out of a 2300 cc type 1 can exceed 350 HP. Reliably though probably in the low 200's. I have been researching engines for about 6 months and a type four sounds great but the price tag isn't pretty. Now i've heard and read that type four engines are superb to type one engines. This may or may not be true but I feel with all the companies that make quality products for the type one engine, is that they arent bad and can be made to last as long as any other engine. The idea I have for my bug is a 1915 turbocharged. I assume reliability will be good on a day to day basis because I plan to keep the boost to a bare minimum. Now when I hit the dirt It will be a 200HP screaming machine. Now with that much power cooling becomes an issue. To relieve this problem I plan to use a remote oil cooler and/or 911 fan shroud to keep the temp low.(2) Recently a vw magazine had a great article about trannys. Which magazine and month I dont know sorry. I've read that a stock tranny can hold up to 150 HP plus their cheap $400 rebuilt at the shop near me. Their are a ton of tranny options out there.

Now all I know is what I have read, I am a firm believer in the phrase "do it right the first time" and this is my first time. I have no experience in any of this besides driving my stock bug. I have read a ton of articles and a few books. So all I know is what I have read.(3) I dont know Jack about suspension. I hope this helped. :D READ READ READ :!:

Thu Apr 15, 2004 4:09 pm

:D Found the magazine w/ the transmissions: Dunebuggies and Hot VW March 2004 This is an issue that can be back ordered or found in a magazine shop possibly.

Thu Apr 15, 2004 4:09 pm

:D Found the magazine w/ the transmissions: Dunebuggies and Hot VW March 2004 This is an issue that can be back ordered or found in a magazine shop possibly.