TheSamba.com :: View topic

Sat Jun 19, 2004 6:50 pm

I've got meself a little extra bread burnin' a hole in my pocket and have been looking around for a summertime project here on the Samba. Almost bought two of them, (from different sellers) cash in pocket, trailer or transport company at the ready, either at the sellers asking price or damn close to it, when I was informed of "just one minor problem"...
THE DAMN THINGS HAVE NO TITLES.
Of course, this was NEVER mentioned in the glowing ads. Both sellers tried to pass it off as "no biggie". I beg to differ. It's one thing if you're in a state where titles aren't required on older cars but you have all of the necessary paperwork.
Everyone says you can just go to this Alabama title company and get it with no problem. If that's true, my question is "WHY DOESN'T THE SELLER DO THIS "QUICK AND EASY" THING BEFORE LISTING THE CAR FOR SALE???
I really think that sellers should be REQUIRED to state in the ad if they have clear title (or necessary bill of sale in those states not requiring titles) or not. I also think that folks advertising vins and titles here (or soliciting them) need to be informed what a FELONY is.
Maybe I'm just an anal moron. Am I missing something here? How do I even know what I'm buying (hot or not) without paperwork? :evil:

Sun Jun 20, 2004 2:48 am

The sale of VINs is not allowed on TheSamba. Once informed, EB deletes them instantly.

Sun Jun 20, 2004 11:34 pm

I Think you are just an "Anal Moron"..Titles get lost after 40 or so years.I do however think that sellers sould be More specific with their ads,Not only with title status information but with more accurate and Honest assessments of Vehicle condition...

Mon Jun 21, 2004 1:28 am

i paid for a van quite a few weeks ago, now it seems, the van has no title which i have been waiting for of this guy who told me and kept telling me he will sort it, then the van had some rust in the floor now it needs a complete floor, i have morals , some dont !!!!! ;-( sad .....

Tue Jun 22, 2004 4:27 am

Autamataun420 wrote: I Think you are just an "Anal Moron"..Titles get lost after 40 or so years.I do however think that sellers sould be More specific with their ads,Not only with title status information but with more accurate and Honest assessments of Vehicle condition...

Well then captian since you used no smilies I take it you are serious with the "Anal Moron" you seem to be passing off on tram when it is actually you that is the moron. If the title is lost the registered owner can cart his happy ass on down to the DMV and get a replacement much easier and cheaper than someone they sell the vehicle to. Didn't you know this or does mommy and daddy have your ride titled in their name?

It's a legitimate gripe, get a clue. Oh and I guess you're the one moron that said no.

Tue Jun 22, 2004 5:40 pm

In some states titles are not required for vehicles after a certain age. I think I would ask someone who is advertising a car/van etc, if they have a title, BEFORE cash is exchanged.

Wed Jun 23, 2004 7:53 am

Simple. No pink - no money. Even if there is a pink and I have any doubts, we go to Auto Club (AAA) or the DMV (if you love long lines) TOGETHER, swap the title and then the seller gets his cash.

Once burned, never again.

Sat Jun 26, 2004 6:49 am

Autamataun420 wrote: I Think you are just an "Anal Moron"..Titles get lost after 40 or so years.I do however think that sellers sould be More specific with their ads,Not only with title status information but with more accurate and Honest assessments of Vehicle condition...

Shows what you know. If the seller is sooooooo serious about selling the vehicle, and that a "lost" title is "no biggie", then said seller can take his happy ass to the DMV and file for a lost title.

IMO - if the seller hems and haws around that, then I have to wonder what he's hiding :-k

Wed Jun 30, 2004 6:33 am

I do believe that title info should be cleared up in the beginning. I have had many chances to buy the "old bugs" that are sitting around. Without a title, its just a parts car and I have plenty of parts already. The buyer should ask up front. Sometimes tho, the seller needs the $$ to get the title. For that, I have gone to the DMV with the seller to handle it, then transfer to me right there. When they say it is no big deal, it can be. Try to register a Cal car in Oregon. It must be inspected at the DMV. If it came with no title, they will tell you that you the buyer must trace down the paper trail and have every person sign off on it. They are getting more and more sticky about it.

Sat Jul 03, 2004 1:56 pm

Great topic! I live in California, and along with a seller not having paperwork is the state itself not helping anything.
Some time ago, I tried to do the right thing and ask the CA DMV if there was a way to find out if a certain vehicle was stolen or had back registration, tickets or whatever due. I was told there was no way I was going to get that information, not just legal concern info, but not anything about the car's history unless I was title holder. Ever since that actress was hunted down and killed by a stalker, this state does not give out registration info to anyone except law enforcement, and "whomever has legitimate need" for that info - in other words, not a working stiff like me. Nice to know a cop can avoid buying a stolen car, good luck to the rest of us. Basically, buy the car, take your chances. I am aware there are ways to get a "clean title" on a less than legitimate car because the Cali DMV is not quite the smooth running machine they would have us believe. Another annoying thing is their way of dealing with a vehicle or drivers license issue is to flag it in their system and let law enforcement find you - suprize, that secret vehicle history/minor traffic violation may cost you big, and you didn't even know!

Sun Jul 04, 2004 11:02 pm

DeathBus wrote: In some states titles are not required for vehicles after a certain age. I think I would ask someone who is advertising a car/van etc, if they have a title, BEFORE cash is exchanged.

Exactly the way I feel on this matter.

Mon Jul 05, 2004 2:54 am

Class 11 wannabe wrote:
Some time ago, I tried to do the right thing and ask the CA DMV if there was a way to find out if a certain vehicle was stolen

People here look at me funny when I demand to see the seller's driver's licence when I am buying a car. Name and address on licence don't match = he don't own it.

Mon Jul 05, 2004 7:27 am

You call the PD asking the lic plate number address and the address of the ID? :shock: ...ok.

Mon Jul 05, 2004 1:19 pm

fisherman_121 wrote: You call the PD asking the lic plate number address and the address of the ID? :shock: ...ok.

No, I look at the pic on his driver's licence to see if he's the guy standing in front of me. Then I compare the name/address on the driver's licence to the name/address on the title. If they don't match, there better be a good story to justify it.

I bet you've never done such a simple step. I've never heard of anyone doing this.

You also need to check the VIN on the car matches the VIN on the title. When my sister worked in the 'puter dept at the local DMV head office she used to tell me all the scams thieves would dream up. Here's one: Guy steals a white RX-7. Then finds another white RX-7 parked on the street. Breaks into the one on the street in such a way as to not do any damage. Steals the registration, then carefully locks the car. Sells the stolen RX-7 using the "clean" registration. Repeat when broke. Very few people actually check the VIN. The new owner had an insurance claim. Insurance estimator checks the VINs, discovers the discrepancy. The guy was caught because he was selling the cars out of his house. This scam is a result of our stupid insurance company telling you you have to carry your proof of insurance and registration at all times. This is BS, you only have to have proof of insurance, and a photocopy is enough.

Fri Jul 09, 2004 9:22 am

Bruce wrote:
No, I look at the pic on his driver's licence to see if he's the guy standing in front of me. Then I compare the name/address on the driver's licence to the name/address on the title. If they don't match, there better be a good story to justify it.

good idea. i've never done it my self, but i usually buy buses that aren't actually up for sale anyway. not as likely to get a scammer when they aren't even looking to sell.

Bruce wrote: You also need to check the VIN on the car matches the VIN on the title.

definetly always check that, even honest sellers have titles with incorrect #'s. both my 57 buses were originally titled from the engine number. the first was easy to fix as i still had the engine. the second, not so easy as the engine was long gone. it required a state police inspection. i lucked out because the police inspector was a vw guy, and had even had a 57 dd panel(same model he was inspecting for me). he allowed me to use the og vin, no nasty state of oregon pop riveted plates.

also verify that all the vins on the car match. this requires a little research to find out where the vins are, but it's well worth it.

Fri Jul 09, 2004 5:30 pm

I'd never sell a car with no title, but I would show it if I knew it was coming in a week or 2. Is that unethical? I'm seriously curious because I don't want to piss people off.

Sat Jul 10, 2004 10:44 am

Rattled-
I don't think that's unethical at all. Sometimes titles DO get lost. At least you know you can get one and are working on it. The reason I started this thread was because the seller never stated anything about not having title in both cases- in one case even when previously ASKED the guy said "yes", then "couldn't find it" AFTER we made an agreement. His response was he would give me a bill of sale (how that's possible when he never had it in his name to begin with is beyond me) and I could just go to this Alabama title co. and get title. I just love sellers who say that "it's so easy" but won't do it themselves.
Thanks, everyone, for all the input. Looks like this is a more rampant problem than I thought.
:evil:

Mon Jul 12, 2004 12:14 pm

i'm not entirely sure exactly what this stateside "title" thing is really. here in cheese'n'chocolateland there's no problem with buying a vehicle without any documents, i simply go to the dept. of vehicle registration records(part of the military organisation here!) with the chassis number and i get a print out of last owner, first registraion etc. this is then legal ID enough to go to inspection with the car and then i get a new registration document in my name.

i'm quite sure several allegedly potential US buyers have been convinced i'm a scammer because i don't have a "clean title". simply doesn't exist here....... 8)

Mon Jul 12, 2004 7:16 pm

It really depends upon what state you live in.
Different states have COMPLETELY different DMV requirements.
In New Jersey, the Alabama re-title bill of sale thing works great.
In other states, Nope!

The biggest reason I have seen for the "lost title" thing is that the current owner never re-titled and registered the car. Why? Because that costs money. In my state, the seller with the "lost" title saves the registration and title fees, and more importantly, the sales tax.

If they bought a car for $1000, and the P.O. put that on the title, then they have to pay around $100 in title and registration fees, plus 6% sales tax on the $1000, or $60. So by "losing" the title, they save $160 plus the hassle of going down to the DMV and doing the paperwork. Not to mention, the car insurance, which can cost another couple of hundred bucks.

On a car which they may be reselling for, say $1200, that means they make $200 on the sale instead losing a bunch of money.

Thu Jul 15, 2004 10:15 am

j.pickens wrote: It really depends upon what state you live in.
Different states have COMPLETELY different DMV requirements.
In New Jersey, the Alabama re-title bill of sale thing works great.
In other states, Nope!

The biggest reason I have seen for the "lost title" thing is that the current owner never re-titled and registered the car. Why? Because that costs money. In my state, the seller with the "lost" title saves the registration and title fees, and more importantly, the sales tax.

If they bought a car for $1000, and the P.O. put that on the title, then they have to pay around $100 in title and registration fees, plus 6% sales tax on the $1000, or $60. So by "losing" the title, they save $160 plus the hassle of going down to the DMV and doing the paperwork. Not to mention, the car insurance, which can cost another couple of hundred bucks.

On a car which they may be reselling for, say $1200, that means they make $200 on the sale instead losing a bunch of money.

I grew up in california.. I have owned over 35 vws and probably only registered about half in my name. out of those 35 bugs/busses/ghias, I never had a problem buying or selling one of them with or without the title/ in theirs or my name or not. have been pulled over (harrassed) by california police and vins checked (even once at about 2am I was in a gas station parking lot trying to pushstart my p.o.s. 62 bug he checked all my pasperwork and vins made me rip out my backseat/sparetire etc. and then when he was finished and it all checked out I asked him nicely for help and he said no and drove off.....I was barely 17 at 2am in south sacramento.....I f I wouldve known better I wouldve got his badge #....
But the main point is I never had a prob. I registered my 60 23 window with no title only a minnesota plate and when I took the bus to dmv the "inspector" had me read the vin to her!!!!!! talk about security..

But now I am in the humble state of Oklahoma and I have just learned out here out of state car with no title gets no title. I had my 56 oval sent out here from cali a few months ago. I have the registration in my name and the plates/ #s match.. My dad could not find the title which was in my name when he sent the car i thopught no biggie being familiar with ca dmv's procedures I thought i would just file for lost title .. the ok dmv said no title from previous state no new title.......I stated that it is registered in my name they said it didnt matter I had to getr a new title from cali first..........IF YOU HAVE DEALT WITH THE CALIFORNIA DMV THEN YOU KNOW THIS IS A LONG DRAWN OUT PROCESS IF YOUR OUT OF STATE BECAUSE IT TAKES AT LEAST 6 WEEKS TO GET A DUPLICATE TITLE IF YOUR IN THE STATE....YOU CANT EVEN CALL THEM AND TALK TO A HUMAN...I WOULD BASICALLY HAVE TO SEND THEM SOME DOCUMENTS I CAN PRINT ON THE COMPUTER AND FILL OUT SEND THEM AND A MONEY ORDER AND CROSS MY FINGERS AND HOPE IT MAKES IT AND I FILLED EVERYTHING OUT RIGHT......SCREW UP ON THOSE AND THAT 6 WEEKS CAN TURN INTO A YEAR REAL FAST...............

SOOOOOOOO.... IN THE MEANTIME I HAVE A COOL PRIMERED OVAL THAT RUNS/ DRIVES GREAT AND ALL THE LIGHTS WORK, THAT I CANT SELL OR DRIVE ON PUBLIC ROADS.........THIS SUCKS......PLUS I ONLY HAVE AN ACRE AND AFTER A WHILE OF DRIVING BACK THERE I GET PRETTY DIZZY........GOTTA LOVE THE GOVERNMENTS MOTOR VEHICLE DIVISION :D :D :D :D :D
FRUSTRATED VW DRIVER NOT ABLE TO DRIVE HIS VW