TheSamba.com :: View topic - Joshua Trees and Meth Labs: Bajaing So-Cal. Deserts

Sat Oct 09, 2004 9:39 pm

With my impending purchase of a Baja Bug, I have been weighing the pros and cons of each ride, and trying to determine what I actually want in the vehicle. I have made the mistake off buying what 'looks good' once before and was burned with a truck that performed like complete crap offroad. (6" suspension lift on 35's) My truck has approx 2" of suspension travel which is obviously not great for high speed offroading.

But back to the topic on hand, I like to drive fast on the dirt roads and trails in the High Deserts of California. Every once in awhile it may rain and there might even be mud for 24 hours. Using my unpleasent truck experience along with reading lots of Baja related material I have come to the following conclusions regarding the type of off-roading I desire. Please let me know if I am off-base on any facet.

-Suspension Travel is more important than tire size. A 31" tire is probably the max needed.

-A roll cage is required, but better yet get a cage which actually connects the front and rear bumpers.

-An 1835cc motor is probably worth aiming for.

-External Oil cooler probably an asset in the summer.

Obviously, there are countless other things to consider, but I'm just trying to get a good basic idea. Also, one other question for folks who may live in the High Desert area. Should I expect problems with the Police If I buy something with a stinger style exhaust? Well, thanks for any input you can provide. I appreciate it.

Guy

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Sat Oct 09, 2004 10:25 pm

Ive had bajas since '83, and I'll probably go belly up in one!! Your conclusions are pretty much on target, and I'll make a few comments- suspension travel is GOOD!! Mine has 16" (modest by todays standards) and with 31" tires, it gives a great comfortable ride, which I'm happy with. Go with as much as you can afford, but not too stiff, though..... Roll cages front to back!! Much more strength, and better protection than just a roll bar, or simple cage. ...Ive been running an 1835 engine for 20 years, yes the same engine for 20 years. 1835s are reliable, but some guys will post that they want bigger, and faster. I wanted reliability, and thats what I got with an 1835....I run an external cooler, always have. Cant say how my engine would have lasted without one....Exhausts...I like 'em somewhat quiet. I run a single muffler, ceramic coated. As far as the police go, my opinion is if you drive safe and sane, they'll leave you alone- but maybe a loud exhaust would catch their attention.....I would suggest buying a fairly simple baja, well built, and later do upgrades as you can afford them. That is, unless you can afford a tricked out one, then by all means.....

Sat Oct 09, 2004 11:21 pm

Thanks for the info. I went all out and bought what I thought was a tricked out 4x4.. Not so good, so I'm looking at baja's I can buy with cash and attempt meaningful upgrades myself. Right now I'm just trying to get an idea of what to look for in the $2000-$3000 range. Are you getting your 16" of travel with stock front end/shock mounts/ etc.? Or have you had to make radical changes to the mounting points and what not?

Sun Oct 10, 2004 6:44 am

greg has some good advice.

Forget stingers. they have little performance value, and after a day of boonie-bashing with the stereo turned up to drown out the unmuffled engine, you'll understand why real drivers don't run 'em.

in addition to tying in the cage front and rear, make sure you skid plate the front suspension and engine. it's cheap insurance.

Buy your baja with the emphasis on body/pan condition. there's no point in buying a collection of go-fast/look-good goodies held together by rust.
$2000 will get you a good solid base to start from, and build up as your experience grows. as you learned with your 4x4, what someone else built to fit their needs may not necessarily fit yours, so if you want the perfect beast, you're going to end up building it yourself.

Sun Oct 10, 2004 6:50 am

Thanks for the advice.. I had one question to add to this topic, seeing as suspension travel seems to be of upmost importance, should I be leaning towards purchasing a baja with 1 piece front end?

Thanks!

Sun Oct 10, 2004 8:20 am

As for the 1 piece front end, I like the look and i think it gives you more possibilities as far as front cage work and easy access to your front end. You didn't say how extensive your Vw experience is so let me throw this at you. If you want suspension travel out of a Vw you need 2 things. King pin front end and Irs rear end. Unfortunately Vw didn't put the combo on any year car. (that i'm aware of). Now the question is, is it easier to convert to link pin or to irs.In my (not always so humble)opinion, I would stick to a 1969 or later standard as a starting point. It has irs and if you really want suspension and a cage front to rear then you should cut the front bulkhead off and mount your new link pin beam to the cage. Also, stretching the wheelbase about 5 in. is a real plis in handling. There have been quite a few discussions on this if you go back a ways. Good luck and welcome. Oh ya, you going to the poker run in Barstow?

Sun Oct 10, 2004 9:27 am

Hey Guy, To get the 16" out of mine, it was radically changed, definitely not something an inexperienced person could do. You could get 15-16 out of the rear a lot easier than I did, with longer arms, shocks, and making room for more travel. Its something you could do in time, as you get the $$.....One piece front ends are nice, and Ive had both types, but I prefer the one piece. ...One thing I wanted to add, was go to an event like the Poker run, and check out the bajas. Ask lots of questions, even if you think the questions are dumb, ask anyway. Undoubtedly someone will talk your ears off about their baja, and you get LOTS of ideas of what you want in one. ....If you're in Northridge any time, stop by and see my baja $$pit. PS I posted a pic of mine in the "Gallery" section, "off road vw's". (Ive got nothing against monkeys!)

Sun Oct 10, 2004 9:42 am

My $0.02 on car shopping - I've no idea what your budget is & it doesn't really matter ~ Don't limit yourself to mearly looking at Baja's. Seems more often then not, the baja's you might think are a good starting point for a project have been owned by one or more "people" that thought since it had some figerglass fenders on it, it must be a Class 1 or Trophy truck racer. In other words, they've often had the sh*t beat outta them and been repaired at Disneyland by Mickey Mouse & his pals because the owners were too lazy (or poor) to do it right. (many times by more then just 1 previous owner too) To try & say that another way ~ look really carefully! You may find yourself spending alot of time (and $$$) repairing other people's mistakes, errors & damage rather then making your own.

So~ If you're really intent on building a car for your wants and desires - I'd suggest finding a nice, clean, straight & solid street car then building it as you see fit for off-roading. I think you're often money ahead at the end of the project rather then paying for do-dads that aren't really your choice but were on the car when you bought it, changing them later to what you really wanted in the 1st place on down the road. IMO added piece of mind of knowing that the foundation you started with had a relatively "easy" life as a street car before you got ahold of it, is worth any extra hassel & better then learning later on that it's already been beat to h*ll by some kid(s) that've left you with alot of costly repairs to do just to get back to square #1.

Not saying all baja's for sell are like that - but seems they've often had a hard life, and have reapirs that need to be done left by the former owners. If you're looking to end up with a nice solid car, it's often better to start from scratch, then take over some else's nightmare.

Sun Oct 10, 2004 2:34 pm

I am just finishing up my Baja project. From my experience I would say that VW air-cooled power is the way to go for the type of running you plan on doing. It should supply plenty of power. It is more the suspensions job in allowing you to go fast off road. Also, It’s cheaper, simpler and lighter than doing an engine swap. My personal outlook on a good motor is one that turns moderate RPM’s. Most VW guys build high RPM screamers to build power and that just wears them out that much faster and brings reliability down. Torque is what you want; gobs of it at low RPM would by my suggestion. My choice would be to build a 1915, or possibly a stroker motor if you want some big power. The 94mm cylinders cool even better than the ones used to build an 1835, and the cost is very comparable so why not go bigger. Keep the heads, cam and carburetion moderate. Gearing also plays an important role so factor that into your plans.

Tire size, if you’re talking basic Baja building I would say a 31-inch rear tire is all you need, but it might not be possible to mount a tire that big without longer rear trailing arms. The front should be as tall and narrow as possible. You don’t want a big fat front tire because it adds considerable unsprung weight and puts a lot of stress on suspension components. It also makes it considerably harder to steer.

A complete roll cage is a really good idea. Not only for safety, but it also adds a lot of strength and rigidity into the chassis. That will take some stress of the car itself and allow it to live longer with hard abuse. Also, if you plan on installing long travel rear suspension you will need some sort of cage for shock mounting. Tying the cage into the bumpers is a good idea too.

As far as the one-piece front end goes, I would say weigh your options. A one piece is lighter and allows easier access to the chassis components. However, you lose damn near all your storage space. And, you need to completely remove the entire front end if you want access to that area. I decide to keep mine simply because I wanted to have some easy entry storage. If I were building an afternoon off roader I would have gone one piece. You should also figure on running high mount rear fenders if you increase wheel travel.

SHMO

Sun Oct 10, 2004 5:35 pm

I missed alot and wish I could add.

things i can comment on:

baja5, you are correct, the IRS and LP suspensions never came together on the same car.

and SHMO, i run (for now) stock VW IRS and barely clear 31" tires. my dad's rail has been using them for many years. as far as clearances with the body of the car, cant help you there. ive yet to build a baja for myself...

Sun Oct 10, 2004 6:16 pm

Brad,

are yous sure your tires are a true 31 inches? I wasn't sure if they would clear, but thought it would be really really close.

SHMO

Sun Oct 10, 2004 7:37 pm

they dont measure 31 exactly, but they are 31" x 10.5" x 15" tires

Mon Oct 11, 2004 9:15 am

SHMO wrote: Brad,

are yous sure your tires are a true 31 inches? I wasn't sure if they would clear, but thought it would be really really close.

SHMO

Thats such a pain how tires really don't measure to what they are marked at. Mickey T's run small, swampers run big etc.. My 29" swampers measure more like 30" my 30" Firestones were more like -29".
I've seen a guy squeeze a wore down 32" mickey onto a stock late model setup before, full tread wouldn't have cut it though. Besides, its kind of a built in saftey. Becuase if your staying somewhat stock in the rear, chances are your going to keep the stock tranny for at least awhile, any tire thats going to be bigger than the torsion will allow will more than likely hinder performace anyway.

Mon Oct 18, 2004 11:55 am

come on out to the Barstow poker run Oct. 30th. I'll be there, many of the samba off roaders will probably be there. I'm sure there will be more than enough bajas there to make an informed choice.

Mon Oct 18, 2004 7:27 pm

where does everyone meet up for the poker run?

Tue Oct 19, 2004 9:56 am

The Slash x cafe. Check Barstowpokerrun.com for directions. I'll be there.

Sat Oct 23, 2004 8:55 am

My Baja isn't ready but I may come by and participate on either my Jeep or dirt bike. What day are you guys going to be out there?

Bob

Sat Oct 23, 2004 10:10 am

I should be there by 1 or 2 on Friday. Not sure where to camp yet but i'm sure i'll find a spot.

Sun Oct 24, 2004 12:08 am

We typically go up the 15 and exit at Bell Mtn Road/Stoddard Wells and follow the road until it turns into dirt. Go about 4-5 miles. When the road turns hard to the left we go about 2 miles and camp there. It is kinda 1/2 way between the Slash X and the 15 fwy. I don't like coming in off of the 247 - too much out of the way. If you go up the road and turn right at the big power towers you will get right to the back side of the Slash X. We take the kids on bikes and quads that way because it is easy for the little ones. They love the Slash X fries - Dads like the beer. We drive a motorhome and the road is easy and the camping areas are flat!

Hope to see you there.

Bob

Sun Oct 24, 2004 12:59 pm

Sounds good. Thanks for the tip.