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Kherome
Samba Member
Joined: June 05, 2005
Posts: 138
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 Posted: Sat Jul 14, 2007 4:06 pm Post subject: Got another THING woooo! |
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I got another Thing, in addition to my Acapulco I now have a pumpkin orange 74. You can still see it in the classifieds section, it's the one in Iowa that says "Pending Nichole" in the price section LOL
I just picked it up and I already have some questions! First I have the dreaded front end shimmy, so I will probably try a steering damper first. Other suggestions?
Also when I got home (30 minute-ish drive) there was some white smoke drifting out of the passenger side muff! Yikes! Does that mean I was overheating or could it be something else? The engine door was warm but not hot.
Also when I parked in the drive and got out 2 bats came rocketing out of somewhere, maybe the muff, but before anyone asks, no they didn't appear to be on fire LOL |
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wantvws
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Joined: November 03, 2006
Posts: 67
Location: Virginia
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| Posted: Sat Jul 14, 2007 5:11 pm Post subject: |
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Cool! Are you gonna fix this one before your Acapulco thing? I wish the bonehead that painted mine Ford blue had left it orange...
Mine also has a shimmy somewhere in the neighborhood of 55-60 mph. I jacked it up and pried on all of the ball joints and the upper passenger side one is fairly loose...I think that is the culprit on mine. Be sure to check those along with the steering dampener, and the tie rod ends.
As far as the bats, wait until sunset and try to whack 'em with a tennis racquet when they come out 
Robbie
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'63 Beetle ragtop, '71 Beetle sedan, '73 Thing, '78 Super convertible, '98 GTI |
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Ian Epperson
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Joined: January 12, 2005
Posts: 2262
Location: Alameda, CA
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| Posted: Sat Jul 14, 2007 9:01 pm Post subject: |
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You might want to check if those are the rare, factory bats. They'll have a small VW logo on their foreheads.
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Semper_Dad
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Joined: May 14, 2005
Posts: 3510
Location: Indiana
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| Posted: Sat Jul 14, 2007 10:52 pm Post subject: Re: Got another THING woooo! |
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| Kherome wrote: |
| Also when I got home (30 minute-ish drive) there was some white smoke drifting out of the passenger side muff! Yikes! Does that mean I was overheating or could it be something else? |
Did the smoke smell like BBQ bat? |
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Towel Rail
Horizontally Opposed
Joined: April 15, 2005
Posts: 4622
Location: SE CR IA US NA PE
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| Posted: Sat Jul 14, 2007 10:56 pm Post subject: |
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I bet those bats were nesting above the transmission.
_________________
1974 Thing -- under the knife
1967 Beetle -- spring/summer/fall driver
1996 Subaru OBW (EJ22, 5-speed, AWD) -- winter car, 3-seasons "don't feel like biking today" car
049 > 070 > 053 > 009 |
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Kherome
Samba Member
Joined: June 05, 2005
Posts: 138
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| Posted: Sun Jul 15, 2007 4:06 am Post subject: Hi |
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No they didn't appear to have any VW logos on them LOL Hopefully they are long gone now!
Anyway, about that smoke??? I'm afraid to drive it now I don't want to have it burn up   |
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bciesq
Samba Member
Joined: April 13, 2005
Posts: 495
Location: Orlando, FL
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| Posted: Sun Jul 15, 2007 5:08 am Post subject: |
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How long had the car been sitting before you purchased it?
Did you notice a particular smell associated with the smoke?
Also, you mention the smoke comes from the passenger side muffler, but it doesn't appear to have dual mufflers. If you are only seeing smoke from the passenger side tail pipe(s) of a single muffler on a car that sat a while, then my guess is that something fell/crawled/built a nest in there and it is burning off.
As for the shimmy, in looking at the photos in the ad, the front tires look to be smaller than stock. Are they in good shape? What's the air pressure? My Thing is sensitive to the proper air pressure -- anything over 25 lbs up front and it isn't happy between 50 and 55 mph. I run at the 20 lbs front and 30 lbs rear and it's rock stable at all speeds.
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'73 Thing -- making 45 mph exciting again. |
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Kherome
Samba Member
Joined: June 05, 2005
Posts: 138
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| Posted: Sun Jul 15, 2007 9:41 am Post subject: Hi |
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The tires you see on that photo are not on there now. The front tires are identical to the ones you see on the rear. The person I bought it from put the other ones on before bringing it to me yesterday. The shimmy isn't horrible, but there is distinct vibration which I am hoping is just the steering damper and nothing worse!
I'm not sure how long it was sitting, he sort of sounded like it was used for periodic forays into town, but I imagine it must have sat quite a bit to have bats get in there???
I didn't mean the muffler, I said "muff" meaning the air intake on the side of the 74s. The smoke, which didn't have an odor that I could really detect was white and thin and drifting out of the passenger side muff. The bats could have had something to do with the smoke I guess but I have no idea. As I said the engine compartment door was warm but not burning hot or anything. I'm not sure if that is normal or not.
I'm sure this has been asked before but would it help cool the engine at all if I had slots cut into the side of the muff in addition to the ones on the top of it? How about slots in the engine door? Thoughts? Thanks! |
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Shamu63
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Joined: August 04, 2006
Posts: 83
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| Posted: Sun Jul 15, 2007 10:39 am Post subject: |
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Bats, and a non smell white "smoke"? I'm willing to bet, if the bats were in the engine compartment they may have urinated before taking off. I seem to remember a show talking about how bats tend to lighten the load by urinating before heading out. I'd say get it warmed up for a bit and see if you get more white smoke... if none, I'd say it was Bat-related.
Shamu |
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Kherome
Samba Member
Joined: June 05, 2005
Posts: 138
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| Posted: Sun Jul 15, 2007 10:42 am Post subject: Hi |
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Eww, burning bat pee? 
I don't know what it was but I did not smell a "hot" car smell with it. It worried me though. |
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bciesq
Samba Member
Joined: April 13, 2005
Posts: 495
Location: Orlando, FL
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| Posted: Sun Jul 15, 2007 10:45 am Post subject: Re: Hi |
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| Kherome wrote: |
| The tires you see on that photo are not on there now. The front tires are identical to the ones you see on the rear. The person I bought it from put the other ones on before bringing it to me yesterday. The shimmy isn't horrible, but there is distinct vibration which I am hoping is just the steering damper and nothing worse! |
Do you know if he had the wheels balanced when the new tires were installed? Very few tire places can balance wide five wheels, so I would check with the seller and see if you need to have the wheels properly balanced.
| Kherome wrote: |
| I didn't mean the muffler, I said "muff" meaning the air intake on the side of the 74s. The smoke, which didn't have an odor that I could really detect was white and thin and drifting out of the passenger side muff. The bats could have had something to do with the smoke I guess but I have no idea. As I said the engine compartment door was warm but not burning hot or anything. I'm not sure if that is normal or not. |
Gotcha. The next time you drive it, look in the engine compartment afterwards and get a better idea of where the smoke is coming from. It could be coming from the air cleaner which is on the passenger side. Here is a picture of the engine from the ad:
If the engine hasn't been driven hard for a while, then moisture can accumulate in the crankcase. Since the crankcase breather is connected to the air cleaner, you could have seen crankcase vapor coming out of the air cleaner and through the passenger side snorkel (aka muff). Crankcase vapor is normal, but it can be heavier in a car that has not been driven very much.
Check the oil fill cap and see if there is a light colored sludge in there which can indicate moisture. If so, adjust the valves, change the oil (engine oil and air cleaner) and then take it for a hard drive to burn off any moisture.
HTH,
Ben
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'73 Thing -- making 45 mph exciting again. |
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Kherome
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Joined: June 05, 2005
Posts: 138
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| Posted: Sun Jul 15, 2007 10:58 am Post subject: Re: Hi |
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Do you know if he had the wheels balanced when the new tires were installed? Very few tire places can balance wide five wheels, so I would check with the seller and see if you need to have the wheels properly balanced.
Gotcha. The next time you drive it, look in the engine compartment afterwards and get a better idea of where the smoke is coming from. It could be coming from the air cleaner which is on the passenger side. Here is a picture of the engine from the ad:
If the engine hasn't been driven hard for a while, then moisture can accumulate in the crankcase. Since the crankcase breather is connected to the air cleaner, you could have seen crankcase vapor coming out of the air cleaner and through the passenger side snorkel (aka muff). Crankcase vapor is normal, but it can be heavier in a car that has not been driven very much.
Check the oil fill cap and see if there is a light colored sludge in there which can indicate moisture. If so, adjust the valves, change the oil (engine oil and air cleaner) and then take it for a hard drive to burn off any moisture.
HTH,
Ben[/quote]
Sorry Ben but I in no way shape or form have the ability to "adjust valves" anywhere in any car LOL I wouldn't know the first thing about it. I love to drive them, and know nothing about fixing them. I am trying to learn but I am too afraid to do much for fear of damaging something.
I don't think he balanced the tires, just put them on...
Also as far as a hard drive goes I can't drive her too hard because of the shimmy, anything over 45 and she shakes. Yesterday the drive was 30 minutes on a 55mph hwy doing about 40ish all the way...? |
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Ian Epperson
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Joined: January 12, 2005
Posts: 2262
Location: Alameda, CA
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| Posted: Sun Jul 15, 2007 11:41 am Post subject: |
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| Setting the valves, changing the oil and adjusting the timing are skills I recommend anyone with an old VW learn. It's not terribly difficult and should be done every few months. |
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Kherome
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Joined: June 05, 2005
Posts: 138
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| Posted: Sun Jul 15, 2007 1:03 pm Post subject: Hi |
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| I don't have anyone to ask |
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Ian Epperson
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Joined: January 12, 2005
Posts: 2262
Location: Alameda, CA
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| Posted: Sun Jul 15, 2007 2:41 pm Post subject: |
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The Muir manual "How to Keep Your Volkswagen Alive" has a good section describing not one, but two different methods to adjust valves.
I found this page online:
http://www.geocities.com/MotorCity/Downs/9413/howto.html
But the writing isn't clear and I disagree with the amount of work he recommends.
What you're setting is the clearance between the rocker and the back of the valve. In the center of the engine, there's a shaft with a series of lobes on it - the cam shaft. These lobes press against rods (push rods) that extend left and right to the heads. You can see the tubes these run in when you look under any VW engine (push rod tubes). Because the valves have to be pushed from the outside, inward, these rods push against a rocker. When you pop open the valve covers on the left and right side of the engine, these rockers are what you see. Those rockers press against the back of the valve. The valves are disks on the end of a shaft in a T shape. The disks cover holes in the engine and when they're pushed inward (via the shaft) they open the hole. Valve springs hold the valves closed until they're pressed. Each cylinder has an intake valve and an exhaust valve and it's critical that they open and close at the proper time.
When the spark fires, those valves must be closed so that the gasses will push the piston instead of just blowing out of the intake or exhaust. To close the valves, the engine just let's them go and the spring pulls them shut.
One end of the rocker has a threaded stud and a nut on it. The end of that threaded stud is what actually pushes on the valve. It's threaded so that it's adjustable. On a cold engine, there should be .006 of a inch clearance between the end of the stud and the end of the valve, when the valve is relaxed (closed). Nearly any auto parts store will sell you a cheap set of feeler gauges. These are strips of metal of different thickness - one will be .006 inches thick.
So, here's the procedure. With the engine cold, block the wheels and put it in neutral. Use a wrench to turn the engine until it's at TDC (Top Dead Center - there's a big mark on the lower pulley, when that points strait up and lines up with the seam of the engine, that's TDC). When you're at TDC, either #1 cylinder is ready to fire, or #3.
Here's how the cylinders are laid out:
| Code: |
(front of car)
_ == _
[3_| |_1]
[4_| |_2]
==
(back of car)
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See how #1 and #3 are opposite of each other, they're always in the exact opposite of their cycle. Same with #2 and #4 - but those two fire at BDC (Bottom Dead Center, 180 degrees opposite of TDC). Once you get used to it, you can look at the valve rockers and see if they're engaged, but for now an easy way to figure out what should be firing is to pop open the distributor. Figure out which wire goes to #1, then when the little rotor inside the distributor cap points to it AND the engine is at TDC, then #1 should be firing, and the valves should be relaxed.
So, with your trusty new feeler gauge, and a 13mm box wrench and a nice flat screwdriver, slide under your car and look at #1. You'll see two rockers that get pushed from the bottom and press against two springs at the top. You should be able to rock the rocker back and forth just a very little bit. Rock it downward, and try to slide the feeler gauge between it and the end of the spring. If it fits with the .006, try a .008 feeler, and if the .008 feeler fits, it's too wide. If it doesn't fit, try the .004 or even .002 feeler - if neither of those fit, either the valve is WAY too tight, or it's not in the firing position. If you've got to adjust the fit (here's the fun bit) you've got to loosen up the nut, then move the screw bit in or out as needed, then while holding the screw bit, tighten the nut. One way to do this is to tighten the screw until it holds onto the feeler gauge a bit, then tighten the nut (then curse when it's too tight and try again). Another way to do it is to run the screw in until it's just right, then remove the feeler gauge and carefully watch the screw and try to hold it with the screwdriver while you tighten the nut (then curse when it's too tight and try again). You'll need to check, and possibly set, both valves on the cylinder before moving on.
Now, crawl back out from under the car. Relax a bit, have something to drink - you've got three more to do. Rotate the engine COUNTER-clockwise (backwards from how it runs) 180 degrees to BDC. Now, #2 will be in firing position and can be checked. Once done with that, you're done with the side - check the valve cover gasket to ensure it's not leaking, then close up the valve cover and snap the retaining bail into position.
Half done. Now for the left side, rotate the engine counter-clockwise 180 again to get to TDC - now the #3 is ready to fire, and the valves are ready to check. Afterward, another 180 counterclockwise will set #4 ready to check.
There! Done!
After you do this a few times, you'll find that the same valves usually fall out of adjustment in the same way. When an engine overheats, the valve adjustment gets screwy. Often time, #3's exhaust valve needs to move (#3 exhaust is the hottest part of your engine). Older engines don't seem to move as much as newer engines - so if you've a fresh rebuild, you'll find that the valve adjustment may move quite a bit.
If the car is hard to start - cranks and cranks until it finally kicks over - it's usually a sign that it's time to set the valves. |
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Kherome
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Joined: June 05, 2005
Posts: 138
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| Posted: Wed Jul 18, 2007 6:51 am Post subject: Hi |
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| Well thanks for the help Ian but I'm not able to do that on my own. I'd have to see it several times before I'd try it alone. I'll print off your directions and see if my uncle (who owns a corvette repair shop) would be willing to do it and show me what's going on! Thanks |
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markie61
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Joined: April 11, 2005
Posts: 583
Location: Northern Virginia
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| Posted: Wed Jul 18, 2007 7:03 am Post subject: Re: Hi |
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| Kherome wrote: |
| I'd have to see it several times before I'd try it alone. |
You sound like me - a visually-oriented learner. I am much better at learning something if I see someone demonstrating the task than I am reading about it. That's why I purchased a bunch of DVD's from www.bugmevideo.com . Each of them costs about what you would pay for an oil change, so you can imagine the savings (and the pleasure and confidence-building) you can get doing maintenance yourself. At the very least, the videos can de-mystify what is essentially a mechanically simple car.
Combined with the Idiot book and the help/support from this website, you can confidently and successfully fix just about anything on your Thing!
Mark
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Whut is that-there Thang!?
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Chicks dig my Thing - so what if it's little and yellow...!? |
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Thingggg
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Joined: June 30, 2004
Posts: 353
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| Posted: Tue Jul 24, 2007 12:12 am Post subject: |
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"I'll print off your directions and see if my uncle (who owns a corvette repair shop) would be wiknow how to adling to do it and show me what's going on! Thanks"
He will know how to do a tuneup on a VW aircooled motor—if he is a nice uncle he will do it for you! I will take him about ˝ hour.
Take it to a frontend only shop and have them look @ it. Ask your uncle were a shop with some older mechanics are, (in their 50s) is located. They will have worked on VWs, they were popular once upon a time.
What we say means little if you can't do the work--don't feel bad most would rather have someone else do it.
What makes you think it's running hot? |
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