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Jedi Samba Member
Joined: October 23, 2007 Posts: 734 Location: Cool California
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Posted: Sat Apr 23, 2011 8:28 pm Post subject: Westfalia sink water pumps: The pros & cons of both types |
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Well after installing my Westfalia kit in my syncro I have come to the point of installing the kitchen sink stuff. I just got my new Delta six faucet and now it is time for the Water pump. I see that 2 types are out there.
http://www.gowesty.com/ec_view_details.php?id=2428&category_id=128&category_parent_id=
and this type
http://www.van-cafe.com/home/van/page_92_1283/westfalia_h20_sink_pump_early__under_sink.html
I would like to get some info on the pro's and cons of each unit before I order one. Kind of like a vote witch one is the better unit. My H2o tank is the type with the level indicators on the side. Thanks folks _________________ 1961 Westfalia SO23 Mango Green/Seagull grey
1961 Westfalia SO34 T/BW
1961 Westfalia SO34 SWR
1964 Westfalia SO33 pearl white
1965 Westfalia SO42 Velvet green
1986 Syncro Wolfram grey with black int GL
1986 Syncro Doka
1987 Syncro Sevana beige Adventurewagen
1987 syncro Sevana beige GL
1973 Pumpkin orange Thing
2 1963 Rag top bug's
1965 Manx
1970 Single cab
1971 combi
1990 Vanagon GL
2007 Audi A4 3.2L quattro |
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msinabottle Samba Member
Joined: September 20, 2005 Posts: 3492 Location: Denver Area, Colorado
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Posted: Sat Apr 23, 2011 8:31 pm Post subject: Basically... |
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I'd suggest just replacing the pump with the type yours originally had--or the donor van originally had. Winston's original was a submersible, that's what he got as a replacement. I did find it necessary to use Seal-All to keep the connections tight, but that worked quite well.
I'd worry about there being subtle differences in the hoses and configuration of the faucet that might be a problem if you switched types--but the advice is worth what you paid for it.
Best! _________________ 'Winston,' '84 1.9 WBX Westy
Vanagon Poet Laureate: "I have suffered in
many ways, but never, never, never in silence." |
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gbrandt Samba Member
Joined: April 04, 2006 Posts: 578 Location: Calgary
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Posted: Sat Apr 23, 2011 8:51 pm Post subject: |
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I ordered the van-cafe external pump and it does not have enough power. Water output was enemic...1 litre took 2 minutes.
I then bought a third party generic pump and it does the same in 30 seconds. Still not great but better.
Gregor _________________ 'Lucky' our 1987 Red Westy, ASV 1.9 TDI ~130HP, Peloquin differential (had a GW 2.3 that we loved, but it died, we drove it hard!)
We've driven in 49 countries and 5 continents to date
Canada to Argentina and back, 2015 to 2017.
Canada to Europe and back (including Turkey, Morocco and Iceland), 2017 to 2019
Mexico 2022-2023
https://www.instagram.com/live.travel.play/
http://livetravelplay.ca |
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Jedi Samba Member
Joined: October 23, 2007 Posts: 734 Location: Cool California
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Posted: Sun Apr 24, 2011 7:02 am Post subject: |
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Hello thanks for the info guys. gbrandt did you mount your pump to high in the cabinet? I did this before on another camper and it had a hard time keeping itself primed so it worked extra hard to pump the water. I mounted it lower and it ran fine. I hope this helps. _________________ 1961 Westfalia SO23 Mango Green/Seagull grey
1961 Westfalia SO34 T/BW
1961 Westfalia SO34 SWR
1964 Westfalia SO33 pearl white
1965 Westfalia SO42 Velvet green
1986 Syncro Wolfram grey with black int GL
1986 Syncro Doka
1987 Syncro Sevana beige Adventurewagen
1987 syncro Sevana beige GL
1973 Pumpkin orange Thing
2 1963 Rag top bug's
1965 Manx
1970 Single cab
1971 combi
1990 Vanagon GL
2007 Audi A4 3.2L quattro |
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gbrandt Samba Member
Joined: April 04, 2006 Posts: 578 Location: Calgary
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Posted: Sun Apr 24, 2011 7:21 am Post subject: |
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No, I mount the pump right on the floor, under the L shaped wood in the cabinet. The pump was simply no flowing fast enough. .2 GPM I would guess.
Gregor _________________ 'Lucky' our 1987 Red Westy, ASV 1.9 TDI ~130HP, Peloquin differential (had a GW 2.3 that we loved, but it died, we drove it hard!)
We've driven in 49 countries and 5 continents to date
Canada to Argentina and back, 2015 to 2017.
Canada to Europe and back (including Turkey, Morocco and Iceland), 2017 to 2019
Mexico 2022-2023
https://www.instagram.com/live.travel.play/
http://livetravelplay.ca |
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86syncrowesty Samba Member
Joined: September 23, 2010 Posts: 115 Location: Colorado Front Range
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Posted: Sun Apr 24, 2011 7:32 am Post subject: |
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Just replaced my - 1986 Westy - in-tank pump, OEM style from Go Westy, works pretty good if you ask me, it pushes a lot of water to me and I am not sure I would want more. In my research an aftermarket alternative would be a nice replacement but I wanted to stick with stock after reviewing all my options. _________________ 1986 Vanagon -- Syncro, Westy
2.5L Subaru |
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Jedi Samba Member
Joined: October 23, 2007 Posts: 734 Location: Cool California
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Posted: Sun Apr 24, 2011 8:13 am Post subject: |
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I was wondering how dose the in tank style pump mount up? It is a bit cheaper pump price wise and I bet they last a little longer too? _________________ 1961 Westfalia SO23 Mango Green/Seagull grey
1961 Westfalia SO34 T/BW
1961 Westfalia SO34 SWR
1964 Westfalia SO33 pearl white
1965 Westfalia SO42 Velvet green
1986 Syncro Wolfram grey with black int GL
1986 Syncro Doka
1987 Syncro Sevana beige Adventurewagen
1987 syncro Sevana beige GL
1973 Pumpkin orange Thing
2 1963 Rag top bug's
1965 Manx
1970 Single cab
1971 combi
1990 Vanagon GL
2007 Audi A4 3.2L quattro |
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chimivee Samba Member
Joined: September 23, 2009 Posts: 741 Location: Orange, CA
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Posted: Sun Apr 24, 2011 9:30 am Post subject: |
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Jedi wrote: |
I was wondering how dose the in tank style pump mount up? It is a bit cheaper pump price wise and I bet they last a little longer too? |
It doesn't really mount. It just "hangs" submersed in the tank. _________________ -James
86 Syncro Westy, etc |
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Ahwahnee Samba Member
Joined: June 05, 2010 Posts: 9800 Location: Mt Lemmon, AZ
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Posted: Sun Apr 24, 2011 4:37 pm Post subject: |
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Yep -- just dangles in there. I thihk my first pump lasted about 20 years, replaced with the same blue submersible unit.
Mine is pretty much always submerged... i.e. the tank does not sit dry. That may contirbute to longer pump life... dunno. |
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spitsnrovers Samba Member
Joined: December 17, 2005 Posts: 924 Location: Calgary, Canada
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Posted: Sun Apr 24, 2011 5:55 pm Post subject: |
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Being as my '88 had the undersink mounted pump, not the submersible, I replaced with a like type fitting.
Replaced the puny VW original with a Proven Pump (bought at Princess Auto in Canada), but I imagine they are available at US suppliers of farm equip, tools, etc.
This pump has a plastic body, 3/8" in and out fittings, and works like a charm. Throws water through our shower hose about 6 feet long. _________________ '88 VW Westfalia
'75 Triumph Spitfire 1500 |
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gbrandt Samba Member
Joined: April 04, 2006 Posts: 578 Location: Calgary
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Posted: Mon Apr 25, 2011 8:08 am Post subject: |
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I think Canadian vans had external pumps and US vans had internal pumps.
Just replace with what you already have. _________________ 'Lucky' our 1987 Red Westy, ASV 1.9 TDI ~130HP, Peloquin differential (had a GW 2.3 that we loved, but it died, we drove it hard!)
We've driven in 49 countries and 5 continents to date
Canada to Argentina and back, 2015 to 2017.
Canada to Europe and back (including Turkey, Morocco and Iceland), 2017 to 2019
Mexico 2022-2023
https://www.instagram.com/live.travel.play/
http://livetravelplay.ca |
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Homercules Samba Member
Joined: June 04, 2010 Posts: 141 Location: Calgary
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Posted: Mon Apr 25, 2011 8:26 am Post subject: |
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gbrandt wrote: |
I think Canadian vans had external pumps and US vans had internal pumps. |
I thought so too but my cdn Syncro has a submersible. I replaced it when I bought the van with a Gowesty version and it works great. _________________ 89 Syncro |
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Busdepot Samba Member
Joined: March 24, 2004 Posts: 1312
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shepherdsond Samba Member
Joined: April 25, 2005 Posts: 439 Location: Bellingham, WA
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Posted: Thu May 12, 2011 7:23 pm Post subject: |
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I got my Westfalia interior from Canada so it had the external pump system. The pump was not working so I replaced it with a more powerfull Flojet model like this http://www.campingworld.com/shopping/item/flojet-quiet-quad-ii-water-pump/9372
I installed it in the secret space between the water tank and the cabinate to the left of the fridge. The pump has a good flow rate but it is noisy and sometimes has a problem priming when the tank is empty.
I am thinking of going to the submersible pump partly because it would be quieter but mainly because in winter it is desirable to have a system that drains back to the tank when not in use and therefore does not freeze up. You can only do this with the submersible pump. |
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Chocolatewagon Samba Member
Joined: June 10, 2008 Posts: 37 Location: La Conner, WA
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Posted: Thu May 26, 2011 6:36 pm Post subject: |
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spitsnrovers wrote: |
Being as my '88 had the undersink mounted pump, not the submersible, I replaced with a like type fitting.
Replaced the puny VW original with a Proven Pump (bought at Princess Auto in Canada), but I imagine they are available at US suppliers of farm equip, tools, etc.
This pump has a plastic body, 3/8" in and out fittings, and works like a charm. Throws water through our shower hose about 6 feet long. |
Hi, Since my sink pump was not working, I bought a Jabsco replacement ("single sink pump") at the marine store that looks just like the old except is dismatleable rather than glued together. Put that in, but without water it would not run either. Turning the knob makes a klunk sound as though a relay is being activated. Is there a relay in this system that keeps the pump from running dry? Any other ideas about what to check? Mine is also an external pump.
Thanks,
...Tom |
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Chocolatewagon Samba Member
Joined: June 10, 2008 Posts: 37 Location: La Conner, WA
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Posted: Fri Jun 03, 2011 9:57 am Post subject: |
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OK, it turned out that the pump worked when the engine is on, so I disconnected the white wire under the driver seat from ground (I had assumed it was ground because it was bundled with the red wire, which I re-routed to the new second battery so the LED panel wouldn't draw down the primary battery). The sink pump now works, but can anyone tell me what the white wire goes to (don't have a Bentley)?
TIA _________________ '54 Bug-first car I owned (sold)
'69 Squareback-first new car and prob last (sold)
'80 Westy-"Chocolatewagon" my mountain jeep and land yacht(sold)
'78 Rawson 30PH-wind powered water yacht
'02 Eurovan Weekender-now we have power and a quiet ride! (sold)
'01 Eurovan Camper-had to have the amenities that Chocolatewagon had plus the power of the 24V AXK |
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hiwaycallin Samba Member
Joined: May 07, 2008 Posts: 356 Location: Salmon Arm, BC
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Posted: Fri Jun 10, 2011 1:46 pm Post subject: |
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Does anyone know if it is simply a direct swap to replace the external pump with the submersible one (i.e. are the electrical connections compatible between the two)?
I ask because I would like to replace my tank with a non-standard tank (that would not fit the external in-line pump config) and thought it would be easier to just go with the drop-in-the-tank submersible model. Thanks in advance. |
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Jedi Samba Member
Joined: October 23, 2007 Posts: 734 Location: Cool California
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Posted: Fri Jun 10, 2011 5:52 pm Post subject: |
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Oh yah baby I replaced mine from the under the sink type to an in tank one. WOW it works great. Simple to instal. Half the price of some under the sink brands
. You cant go wrong with the German made in tank one. Both Gowesty and Vancafe sell them at a good price _________________ 1961 Westfalia SO23 Mango Green/Seagull grey
1961 Westfalia SO34 T/BW
1961 Westfalia SO34 SWR
1964 Westfalia SO33 pearl white
1965 Westfalia SO42 Velvet green
1986 Syncro Wolfram grey with black int GL
1986 Syncro Doka
1987 Syncro Sevana beige Adventurewagen
1987 syncro Sevana beige GL
1973 Pumpkin orange Thing
2 1963 Rag top bug's
1965 Manx
1970 Single cab
1971 combi
1990 Vanagon GL
2007 Audi A4 3.2L quattro |
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hiwaycallin Samba Member
Joined: May 07, 2008 Posts: 356 Location: Salmon Arm, BC
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Posted: Sat Jun 11, 2011 11:18 pm Post subject: |
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Thanks Jedi. |
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jmranger Samba Member
Joined: January 14, 2010 Posts: 701 Location: Quebec
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Posted: Mon Apr 16, 2012 7:42 pm Post subject: |
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Reviving this thread, as I'm thinking about switching from an inline to an in-tank pump.
Two questions...
- Noise - I'm hoping that the submersible pump would be significantly quieter than the one under the sink. Is it the case?
- waterproofness... I haven't used the water system in my van yet, and so I'm unsure how the filling work - in particular how "it's full" works. I know it overflows from the outside, but the question is - will it overflow inside first if the cap isn't in place and tight. Measuring the height of both, it seems really close. Switching pump type would mean maing holes in the cap or the tank itself, and I want to know how good the seals need to be.
Jedi, if you happen to read this, do you have pictures of your conversion you can share?
Thanks,
JMR
(No pic of my setup, only found this one for the in-tank kind)
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