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crvc Samba Member
Joined: April 28, 2004 Posts: 1308
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Posted: Wed Mar 14, 2012 9:48 am Post subject: Overheating in 50 degree weather? |
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I have a '67 bug. All engine bay seals are in. There are no unneccesary holes in any of the engine tin. Necessary holes all have tight grommets. This bug could float, like the old VW ads showed.
The bug also has no vents in the engine lid. I posted a while ago about the bug dying on the first long drive of the year. You guys had suggestions but the consensus was vapor lock. Since then I've replaced the fuel pump, made sure the thermostat and flaps are all working, replaced the cloth and metal fuel line with German quality items.
Although it's a '67 bug the engine is a circa '73 DP 1640cc with a custom cam. So it produces a lot more heat than a standard bug but with no real venting to dissipate it. Am I doomed to use hinge standoffs? They look dorky as hell, like something a kid would do.
None of the other options seem any better. I don't want to cut up the lid. I don't want to remove the bay seals or tin. In Louisiana in August I never had my bug overheat and now I'm wondering if it was because I had left a lot of the seals and tinware off.
Any suggestions?
crvc |
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GB2S Samba Member
Joined: October 27, 2003 Posts: 1011 Location: Omaha
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Posted: Wed Mar 14, 2012 9:54 am Post subject: |
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Do a complete tuneup, timing, valve & point gap.
Geoff _________________ 1963 Ragtop |
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crvc Samba Member
Joined: April 28, 2004 Posts: 1308
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Posted: Wed Mar 14, 2012 10:06 am Post subject: |
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GB2S wrote: |
Do a complete tuneup, timing, valve & point gap.
Geoff |
Did all that the day before the long drive.
crvc |
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Max Welton Samba Member
Joined: May 19, 2003 Posts: 10697 Location: Black Forest, CO
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crvc Samba Member
Joined: April 28, 2004 Posts: 1308
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Posted: Wed Mar 14, 2012 11:12 am Post subject: |
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Max Welton wrote: |
I recommended a diagnostic step to show if you do or don't have a vapor lock problem.
Right after the engine stops, squirt some cold water on the pump and the fuel line. This will cause any vaporized fuel in the pump or line to cool and return to a liquid state that can be pumped.
If that helps, it was vapor lock.
Max |
I left the engine idling for an hour or so but it didn't get hot enough to induce vapor lock. I had planned, on my next long drive, to bring a couple gallon jugs of water but haven't had the guts to try any long drives yet.
My wife is making a three hour drive to civilization (Salt Lake City) this weekend and will pick up a pair of standoffs.
crvc |
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Max Welton Samba Member
Joined: May 19, 2003 Posts: 10697 Location: Black Forest, CO
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GB2S Samba Member
Joined: October 27, 2003 Posts: 1011 Location: Omaha
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Posted: Wed Mar 14, 2012 11:52 am Post subject: |
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Do you have a way to check Oil pressure, Oil temp. What is the status of the oil pressure relief valve. The thermostat might be working but are the fins operating properly. Have you drive with the heat on? (air flow)
Geoff _________________ 1963 Ragtop |
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AlteWagen Troll
Joined: February 23, 2007 Posts: 8503 Location: PNW
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Posted: Wed Mar 14, 2012 1:07 pm Post subject: |
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A 1641 should not generate any more heat than a 1500 unless tuned incorrectly or has super high compression.
The only problem I see is if you really are overheating the paper thin cylinder walls of the 87mm slip in p&c, they are probably toast and will need replacement. The only thinner cylinders that were made were the 88mm slip ins which warped so bad that they stopped production.
I would do a compression test to see how badly they are damaged |
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pantone149 Samba Member
Joined: August 19, 2004 Posts: 1018 Location: Mt. Shasta
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Posted: Wed Mar 14, 2012 1:17 pm Post subject: |
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Save your money. Don't buy stand-offs. Do a tennis ball stand-off and see if it matters. |
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Max Welton Samba Member
Joined: May 19, 2003 Posts: 10697 Location: Black Forest, CO
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Posted: Wed Mar 14, 2012 3:01 pm Post subject: |
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crvc wrote: |
I left the engine idling for an hour or so but it didn't get hot enough to induce vapor lock. I had planned, on my next long drive, to bring a couple gallon jugs of water |
One drinking water bottle is enough. Even a little squirt-bottle so you can just hit what you are aiming at.
I now have visions of you dumping a couple of gallons on your engine and drowning the ignition system.
Max _________________ 1967 Type-3 Fastback
Under the Knife https://shoptalkforums.com/viewtopic.php?f=24&t=151582
Home Stretch https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=767836 |
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vwsteve Samba Member
Joined: March 18, 2004 Posts: 1047 Location: Virginia
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Posted: Wed Mar 14, 2012 5:39 pm Post subject: |
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The dog house shroud needs more air. I have a 1200 converted to doghouse and it will run hot without stand offs or tennnis ball. With the tennis ball, it stays cool. |
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Eric&Barb Samba Member
Joined: September 19, 2004 Posts: 24764 Location: Olympia Wash Rinse & Repeat
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Posted: Wed Mar 14, 2012 6:27 pm Post subject: |
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Make sure the engine insulation on the front fire wall is not loose and getting sucked over the cooling fan opening.
Which fan shroud are you using?
What size cooling fan do you have?? Inside measurement between the discs that make up the fan body.
What cruising RPM are you running?
Do post images of the engine in question. _________________ In Stereo, Where Available! |
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VOLKSWAGNUT Fastest VW Belt Changer
Joined: October 14, 2007 Posts: 11056 Location: Flippin' a Belt........ .... Off-n-On ... NC USA
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Posted: Wed Mar 14, 2012 6:46 pm Post subject: |
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pantone149 wrote: |
Save your money. Don't buy stand-offs. Do a tennis ball stand-off and see if it matters. |
I'd use the tennis ball way before stand offs.
With a bumper on the car you hardly even notice the lid cracked open with it.
You say its running hot.
How do you know? What actual measurements have you made, and if so what temps is the engine oil, and heads.
Are you assuming vapor lock means its overheating? Thats assuming wrong.
How is the fuel line routed?
Are you using a metal tube on the engine?
Are you using the proper fuel pump insulator? _________________ aka Ken {o\!/o}
Its your vehicle- stop askin' for approval-do what YOU like for cryin' out loud
Better to roll em' how you want and wear em' out-than lettin' em' rot out
Its about the going not the showing
Rebuilt to drive not decorate
WANTED: Local Eatin' Joints, Triple D for TheSamba contributions here http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=570510
Search "VOLKSWAGNUT" on YouTube since you cant watch a "certain" BELT change video round here
Usually and often edited |
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Max Welton Samba Member
Joined: May 19, 2003 Posts: 10697 Location: Black Forest, CO
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usrname Samba Member
Joined: September 12, 2008 Posts: 165 Location: Arizona but not Phoenix
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Posted: Wed Mar 14, 2012 7:51 pm Post subject: |
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Did you time the engine to total advance? |
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Bugugly Samba Member
Joined: January 16, 2008 Posts: 321 Location: Carson City, Nevada
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Posted: Wed Mar 14, 2012 7:53 pm Post subject: |
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Have you tried a dipstick sensor? Maybe it's not really that hot. If you have a sensor the oil light comes on when it gets hot. I swear by one..
http://www.savemybug.com _________________ "When it rains...
It Pours" |
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Hammarlund Samba Member
Joined: June 15, 2009 Posts: 1539 Location: Central Texas
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Posted: Thu Mar 15, 2012 9:59 am Post subject: |
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Yow! The OP's last post on the thread referenced by Max:
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I noticed the oil level is going up on the dipstick... |
I hope the OP checked his oil to make sure it didn't smell like gasoline! |
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crvc Samba Member
Joined: April 28, 2004 Posts: 1308
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Posted: Thu Mar 15, 2012 11:28 am Post subject: |
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[quote="Hammarlund"]Yow! The OP's last post on the thread referenced by Max:
Quote: |
I noticed the oil level is going up on the dipstick... |
I hope the OP checked his oil to make sure it didn't smell like gasoline![/quote
Years ago I had a bug that kept filling the crankcase with gas. The root cause was not enough gaskets on the fuel pump. Ultimately I took the engine apart thinking the gas must have damaged the bearings. What I found was the cleanest innards I've ever seen on a motor. Plus the bearings looked fine. So for now I don't mind that this motor might be adding gas to the crankcase. I just don't drive it much while I wait for the new fuel pump vacuum guage to come in the mail.
crvc |
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Culito 11010101
Joined: December 07, 2006 Posts: 5866 Location: Columbia Missourah
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Posted: Thu Mar 15, 2012 4:46 pm Post subject: |
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crvc wrote: |
Hammarlund wrote: |
Yow! The OP's last post on the thread referenced by Max:
Quote: |
I noticed the oil level is going up on the dipstick... |
I hope the OP checked his oil to make sure it didn't smell like gasoline! |
Years ago I had a bug that kept filling the crankcase with gas. The root cause was not enough gaskets on the fuel pump. Ultimately I took the engine apart thinking the gas must have damaged the bearings. What I found was the cleanest innards I've ever seen on a motor. Plus the bearings looked fine. So for now I don't mind that this motor might be adding gas to the crankcase. I just don't drive it much while I wait for the new fuel pump vacuum guage to come in the mail.
crvc |
How's that happen? _________________ Copyright CJ Industries, Inc.
'64 standard w/2.0L type 4
'62 bug
johnnypan wrote: |
...dont pay no attention to Culito,he's a cornhole.. |
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Max Welton Samba Member
Joined: May 19, 2003 Posts: 10697 Location: Black Forest, CO
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