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Omi-Wan
Samba Member
Joined: October 20, 2003
Posts: 119
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 Posted: Sun Jun 12, 2005 11:12 am Post subject: 1961 356 engine to 67 ghia |
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| Anyone done it? Does any metal need cutting? Is it straight forward? |
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Gary
Person of Interest
Joined: November 01, 2002
Posts: 17069
Location: 127.0.0.1
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| Posted: Sun Jun 12, 2005 12:49 pm Post subject: |
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It would be better and cheaper to build yourself a 1600 SP or DP.
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West Virginia State Board of Education v. Barnette, 319 U.S. 624 (1943) |
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Rescue912
Ferdinand Sanford
Joined: March 25, 2004
Posts: 484
Location: Indiana
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| Posted: Sun Jun 12, 2005 7:04 pm Post subject: |
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No metal cutting but some fussing with the clutch, pp, starter and sealing tin to get it to go.
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Beauty is in the eye of the key holder ... |
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Omi-Wan
Samba Member
Joined: October 20, 2003
Posts: 119
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| Posted: Mon Jun 13, 2005 10:37 am Post subject: |
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| Thanks..but pp? |
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Glenn 
Mr. 010
Joined: December 25, 2001
Posts: 76949
Location: Sneaking up behind you
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retrowagen
Samba Member
Joined: October 11, 2004
Posts: 1856
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| Posted: Mon Jun 13, 2005 3:16 pm Post subject: |
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No, actually, you probably would have to make some special modifications to the engine sheet metal and the exhaust to get it to work decently in a Ghia.
Look here for a comprehensive write-up by one local guy who adapted a Porsche 356/912 engine to his Type 14:
http://www.bayarea.net/~diddler/black-sheep/engine-text.htm
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David Ruby
President, Karmann-Ghia World Club |
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myb356
Samba Member
Joined: October 14, 2004
Posts: 408
Location: bay area california
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| Posted: Tue Jun 14, 2005 10:53 pm Post subject: |
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| You will need to cut a few inches off of the sheet metal on the sides of the engine and rear breast plate. You will also need a 6 volt starter and an adapter sleeve to run the late model throwout bearing on the early trans. The throttle cable will need to be fabricated and a guide tube installed to move the cable around 4 inches to the left. Add a header and you should be good to go. Not sure how the author on that link managed to make it sound so confusing. Also you will need a $300 generator to convert it to 12v. Add $150 for the header and add a starter and adapter sleeve and the bug motor is sounding like a better way to go. |
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Rescue912
Ferdinand Sanford
Joined: March 25, 2004
Posts: 484
Location: Indiana
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| Posted: Wed Jun 15, 2005 6:48 am Post subject: |
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| Quote: |
| the bug motor is sounding like a better way to go |
Amen. I have at least 3 912 engines just sitting in the barn for this very reason. Good point about trimming hte engine tin - I was thinking about the engine compartment. You will have to cut some on the cooling tin to get it to fit.
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Beauty is in the eye of the key holder ... |
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vwclap
Samba Member
Joined: April 21, 2004
Posts: 519
Location: Qc, Canada
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| Posted: Mon Sep 03, 2012 2:22 am Post subject: |
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So I understand that the 356 engine fit without cutting the ghia...only the engine tin.
The link http://corp.bayarea.net/~diddler/black-sheep/engine-text.htm mentionned earklier in this tread is not working...any other link for that conversion...
I know it will cost less putting a type 1 engine into the ghia, a modified T1 will give more hp etc... but if it can be done without cutting the ghia we will give a try. 
Claude
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Claude
cox 1956, 1962 et 1975
Split panel 1963
Samba 21 fenetres 1966
Ghia 1968
Sport Ghia 73
West 1970
Jetta 1992
Jetta TDI 2015
West Multivan 2002 |
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John Moxon
Samba Moderator
Joined: March 07, 2004
Posts: 13958
Location: Southampton U.K.
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tri356
Samba Member
Joined: December 28, 2005
Posts: 319
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| Posted: Mon Sep 03, 2012 7:39 am Post subject: |
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Hi Claude,
Depending on what you are willing to accept, your biggest source of frustration could be fitting a muffler to that engine. If you are ok with an extractor type of exhaust, 4 pipes merging into 1, with a muffler hanging off to the side, then this is not such a big problem. If you want more of a stock look, then some of your choices are:
a) taking 356 exhaust flanges and welding them to a VW muffler
b) cutting 356 mufflers to make them fit within the space you have. The current reproduction of the 356A muffler is just about the correct width to fit within the ghia's body. There is just a slight cut that needs to be done to the right-side ghia body support bracket - the one that goes from the ghia apron to the underside of the engine surround metal.
Even with that, the muffler pipes attaching to the #2 and #4 exhaust ports still need to be cut, to bring the muffler 'in' towards the engine.
An original 356A muffler will not work - it's way too wide by several inches.
Mike |
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John Moxon
Samba Moderator
Joined: March 07, 2004
Posts: 13958
Location: Southampton U.K.
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tri356
Samba Member
Joined: December 28, 2005
Posts: 319
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| Posted: Mon Sep 03, 2012 8:43 am Post subject: |
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30 inches width or less is needed to make it work (tucked in within the body, hanging lower of course the muffler can be wider). Converting inches to mm, that'd be 762. You're correct John, the width of the Vintage Speed muffler should work.
That would leave the exhaust flange change, and fore-aft location.
Mike
| John Moxon wrote: |
| tri356 wrote: |
| An original 356A muffler will not work - it's way too wide by several inches. |
The Vintage Speed 356 SS Exhaust looks as if it might fit...
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vwclap
Samba Member
Joined: April 21, 2004
Posts: 519
Location: Qc, Canada
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| Posted: Mon Sep 03, 2012 6:08 pm Post subject: |
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| tri356 wrote: |
Hi Claude,
Depending on what you are willing to accept, your biggest source of frustration could be fitting a muffler to that engine. If you are ok with an extractor type of exhaust, 4 pipes merging into 1, with a muffler hanging off to the side, then this is not such a big problem. If you want more of a stock look, then some of your choices are:
a) taking 356 exhaust flanges and welding them to a VW muffler
b) cutting 356 mufflers to make them fit within the space you have. The current reproduction of the 356A muffler is just about the correct width to fit within the ghia's body. There is just a slight cut that needs to be done to the right-side ghia body support bracket - the one that goes from the ghia apron to the underside of the engine surround metal.
Even with that, the muffler pipes attaching to the #2 and #4 exhaust ports still need to be cut, to bring the muffler 'in' towards the engine.
An original 356A muffler will not work - it's way too wide by several inches.
Mike |
Cutting and fitting an exhaust is OK...cutting the Ghia is not OK. We do not want to cut the Ghia body to fit the engine. Cutting the 356 tin or adapt a muffler is OK. In the thread from thesamba from John the lowlight seems to have no cutting in the engine area..that is what we want to do.
If you have a link that explain the problems we will have ...it will be great.
Claude
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Claude
cox 1956, 1962 et 1975
Split panel 1963
Samba 21 fenetres 1966
Ghia 1968
Sport Ghia 73
West 1970
Jetta 1992
Jetta TDI 2015
West Multivan 2002 |
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tri356
Samba Member
Joined: December 28, 2005
Posts: 319
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| Posted: Mon Sep 03, 2012 8:10 pm Post subject: |
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Here's what I did:
I don't believe all the model years have these support brackets - check to see if your car does. The other option would have been to drop the muffler more. But, I wanted ground clearance - too many times before, with lower mufflers, I've scraped the ground.
Mike |
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vwclap
Samba Member
Joined: April 21, 2004
Posts: 519
Location: Qc, Canada
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| Posted: Mon Sep 10, 2012 5:23 pm Post subject: |
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Thanks all for the replies
Claude
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Claude
cox 1956, 1962 et 1975
Split panel 1963
Samba 21 fenetres 1966
Ghia 1968
Sport Ghia 73
West 1970
Jetta 1992
Jetta TDI 2015
West Multivan 2002 |
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