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Metal Twister
Samba Member
Joined: January 24, 2013
Posts: 405
Location: licking, MO.
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 Posted: Tue Jul 15, 2014 10:02 pm Post subject: Original style reproduction seat frames... |
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| I manufacture custom seat frames for antique and classic vehicles. Im thinking about expanding into the VW market and was trying to get a feel for what was avaliable at the present time. We don't make exact replicas but I do build them to the original shapes using the zig zag springs instead of the old school coils. Once upholstered you wouldnt know the difference in most cases. I was wondering if there was any company's currently building replacement seat frames for the early VW's? I've spent some time seatching but Im coming up empty. I'm looking for either original style or aftermarket manufactures of seat frames? Thanks for the help in advance. M.T. |
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pb_foots
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Joined: April 15, 2010
Posts: 1089
Location: Ben Lomond, CA
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| Posted: Wed Jul 16, 2014 4:01 am Post subject: |
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When I needed new ones I couldn't find anyone either, but there are plenty of good ones at Interstate in Carlsbad and Elsinore. Might be a tough sell, VW people are notoriously cheap, except for the restoration guys who may balk at the zig zags.
What's your price target for a complete low back frame? |
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Metal Twister
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Joined: January 24, 2013
Posts: 405
Location: licking, MO.
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| Posted: Wed Jul 16, 2014 8:46 am Post subject: |
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| pb_foots wrote: |
When I needed new ones I couldn't find anyone either, but there are plenty of good ones at Interstate in Carlsbad and Elsinore. Might be a tough sell, VW people are notoriously cheap, except for the restoration guys who may balk at the zig zags.
What's your price target for a complete low back frame? |
I really appreciate the feed back. I havent even got as far as doing a time study to see how much labor costs would be. I was most curious in which models would be the best to first attempt for the air cooled guys. My main interested at this point is exactly what you posted. I was thinking the early bugs and maybe busses where the locks were not involved... Who knows, cant learn if ya dont ask? Thanks again |
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OB Bus
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Joined: February 09, 2003
Posts: 2537
Location: Ocean Beach in Beautiful BLUE California
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| Posted: Wed Jul 16, 2014 8:51 am Post subject: |
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Someone in Europe (Netherlands?) makes complete repro bus seats. Sorry I do not remember their name. Not cheap and the shipping to the US is going to be pricey.
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Metal Twister
Samba Member
Joined: January 24, 2013
Posts: 405
Location: licking, MO.
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| Posted: Wed Jul 16, 2014 9:17 am Post subject: |
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| Thanks Larry. I will see if I can find them. |
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EverettB 
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Joined: April 11, 2000
Posts: 69813
Location: Phoenix Metro
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Metal Twister
Samba Member
Joined: January 24, 2013
Posts: 405
Location: licking, MO.
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| Posted: Wed Jul 16, 2014 11:07 am Post subject: |
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Thank you very much... When you do the currancy conversion rate and then add in the shipping and handling there might be some room for another competitor here. I will be doing some research to find the deminsions on these seats and then see what I can do towards building a few. Any Pros or Cons on building them here in the states?
Thanks again |
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BerylGreen63
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Joined: July 17, 2010
Posts: 392
Location: San Diego
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| Posted: Wed Jul 16, 2014 3:50 pm Post subject: |
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| The bus seat repros are taking advantage of the lack of originals and in my opinion are over priced way overpriced. If you could get a product out in the 700-1000 range I think you would have buyers. Not every bus owner is concerned with the springs but might care about if the legs look original. As far as other models i don't see much of a market, bug seats are easy to find. |
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Metal Twister
Samba Member
Joined: January 24, 2013
Posts: 405
Location: licking, MO.
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| Posted: Wed Jul 16, 2014 4:09 pm Post subject: |
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| It looks like the springs are just purchased some where else and then coupled up with the frame for a package deal. I'm sure I could do much better than those prices for those frames. If I could find who they buy the springs from I wouldn't mind putting everything in a box together. I'm sure you can by the springs separate if I just supplied an original looking frame and send Mr customer to someone else for the springs that could work for me as well. |
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jwold
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Joined: September 30, 2008
Posts: 2088
Location: Portland, OR
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| Posted: Wed Jul 16, 2014 5:15 pm Post subject: |
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Just a thought...but what about re-springing original seat bases/frames?
The drivers seat of my 70 bug is worn out, but there's nothing I can really do about it to make it springy again, except add more foam padding or something or just replace the seat.
Plenty of folks rebuilding other vw parts, radios, wiper motors, carbs etc.
Why not have people ship you the seats, as cores? You don't need to reupholster them, just redo the metalwork. |
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EverettB
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Joined: April 11, 2000
Posts: 69813
Location: Phoenix Metro
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| Posted: Wed Jul 16, 2014 5:27 pm Post subject: |
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| BerylGreen63 wrote: |
| The bus seat repros are taking advantage of the lack of originals and in my opinion are over priced way overpriced. If you could get a product out in the 700-1000 range I think you would have buyers. Not every bus owner is concerned with the springs but might care about if the legs look original. As far as other models i don't see much of a market, bug seats are easy to find. |
To add to this:
For Bus seats Wolfsburg West did a repro middle seat for a few years but I can't remember how much it was, I think $450-$500?
I heard they stopped doing it because it didn't sell as well as expected but I believe the real issue was they made a 67-only seat. Making a 1-year only seat instead of a 58-63 seat or a 64-66 seat seems strange to me.
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Metal Twister
Samba Member
Joined: January 24, 2013
Posts: 405
Location: licking, MO.
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| Posted: Wed Jul 16, 2014 5:35 pm Post subject: |
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| jwold wrote: |
Just a thought...but what about re-springing original seat bases/frames?
The drivers seat of my 70 bug is worn out, but there's nothing I can really do about it to make it springy again, except add more foam padding or something or just replace the seat.
Plenty of folks rebuilding other vw parts, radios, wiper motors, carbs etc.
Why not have people ship you the seats, as cores? You don't need to reupholster them, just redo the metalwork. |
To be honest Its not worth the time and effort as a supplier. People are not willing to pay for the time and effort involved in re springing coil springs in seats. Its old technology that doesnt last. Back in the day labor was cheap as was the materials... Not anymore! Its just not cost effective, Nice yes, but not cost effective. |
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Metal Twister
Samba Member
Joined: January 24, 2013
Posts: 405
Location: licking, MO.
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| Posted: Wed Jul 16, 2014 5:36 pm Post subject: |
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| EverettB wrote: |
| BerylGreen63 wrote: |
| The bus seat repros are taking advantage of the lack of originals and in my opinion are over priced way overpriced. If you could get a product out in the 700-1000 range I think you would have buyers. Not every bus owner is concerned with the springs but might care about if the legs look original. As far as other models i don't see much of a market, bug seats are easy to find. |
To add to this:
For Bus seats Wolfsburg West did a repro middle seat for a few years but I can't remember how much it was, I think $450-$500?
I heard they stopped doing it because it didn't sell as well as expected but I believe the real issue was they made a 67-only seat. Making a 1-year only seat instead of a 58-63 seat or a 64-66 seat seems strange to me. |
What are the differences in 58-63 |
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hitest
Samba Member
Joined: September 30, 2008
Posts: 10296
Location: Prime Meridian, ID
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| Posted: Wed Jul 16, 2014 6:47 pm Post subject: |
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M.T.- I read this thread with great hopes- but have more questions unfortunately when comparing this thread to your website. First, let me compliment your site- very nice and helpful for the Ford hotrod world- another interest I have. I'm also glad you are researching your future offerings in the VW community.
The big problem I see, however, is the website states your seats will not accept factory seat upholstery kits (and their foam padding for that matter). This is a biggie- as the number of folks making freestyle upholstery (and seats) for VWs vs. using factory-duplicated patterns is very low. When folks freeform the seats- they do wraparound couches and other ghastly things (in buses). You simply have to make frames that accept factory-fitting upholstery (either repro'd factory vinyl or custom tweed/leather/inserts, doesn't matter) as many VW people are also DIYers when it comes to upholstery kits. If that is your plan all along- please forgive my soapboxing.
I would like to see the construction 'skeletal' picture of the seat bases you make- just to see if deeper thicker seats can be built with the current formula. If you decide to do bus seats (especially the front passenger buckets) you are sure to have a following.
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| EverettB wrote: |
I wonder what the nut looks like.
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'62 L390 151, '62 L469 117, '63 L380 113, '64 L87 311, '65 L512 265, '65 L31 SO-42, '66 L360 251, '68 L30k 141, '71 L12 113, '74 ORG 181
FU#5 |
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EverettB
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Joined: April 11, 2000
Posts: 69813
Location: Phoenix Metro
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| Posted: Wed Jul 16, 2014 6:52 pm Post subject: |
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| Metal Twister wrote: |
| EverettB wrote: |
| BerylGreen63 wrote: |
| The bus seat repros are taking advantage of the lack of originals and in my opinion are over priced way overpriced. If you could get a product out in the 700-1000 range I think you would have buyers. Not every bus owner is concerned with the springs but might care about if the legs look original. As far as other models i don't see much of a market, bug seats are easy to find. |
To add to this:
For Bus seats Wolfsburg West did a repro middle seat for a few years but I can't remember how much it was, I think $450-$500?
I heard they stopped doing it because it didn't sell as well as expected but I believe the real issue was they made a 67-only seat. Making a 1-year only seat instead of a 58-63 seat or a 64-66 seat seems strange to me. |
What are the differences in 58-63 |
58-63 is the same middle and rear seat for a Bus.
64-66 the leg by the cargo door is kicked out and the fold-down part fold down at an angle instead of straight forward.
Middle seat thread in Split Bus:
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=107848
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Metal Twister
Samba Member
Joined: January 24, 2013
Posts: 405
Location: licking, MO.
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| Posted: Wed Jul 16, 2014 7:39 pm Post subject: |
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| hitest wrote: |
M.T.- I read this thread with great hopes- but have more questions unfortunately when comparing this thread to your website. First, let me compliment your site- very nice and helpful for the Ford hotrod world- another interest I have. I'm also glad you are researching your future offerings in the VW community.
The big problem I see, however, is the website states your seats will not accept factory seat upholstery kits (and their foam padding for that matter). This is a biggie- as the number of folks making freestyle upholstery (and seats) for VWs vs. using factory-duplicated patterns is very low. When folks freeform the seats- they do wraparound couches and other ghastly things (in buses). You simply have to make frames that accept factory-fitting upholstery (either repro'd factory vinyl or custom tweed/leather/inserts, doesn't matter) as many VW people are also DIYers when it comes to upholstery kits. If that is your plan all along- please forgive my soapboxing.
I would like to see the construction 'skeletal' picture of the seat bases you make- just to see if deeper thicker seats can be built with the current formula. If you decide to do bus seats (especially the front passenger buckets) you are sure to have a following. |
First off let me thank you for taking the time to reply to the thread. I do want to make it clear that I Am Not Selling VW seats at this time. With that said I am only researching the possibility of doing so. If you looked at my web site you would of seen a custom seat page where folks tell me what they want. They supply me their measurement's and I build their seat from those measurements. The Bengels seat site is for HOT ROD Seat frames which are not original in any way other than shape. There are several companies that already build original replica seat frames for antiques and classics so there is no reason for me to go there. www.hotrodseats.com is for early modified vehicles. If I was to build seat frames for VW's it is obvious that I would build something that is as original as possible. If that ever happens I will be sure to either split my site into two and make it very clear what I will be offering. That is the beautiful thing about being a small business, You can turn the corner quickly and do what ever you want! LOL
All this to say let me decide if this is a path I want to go down. If so let me post what I have to offer and we can go from there. What I am doing now keeps me very busy and totally separate from anything I will be doing in the VW direction. Thanks again I truly do appreciate your thoughts and input. |
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hitest
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Joined: September 30, 2008
Posts: 10296
Location: Prime Meridian, ID
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| Posted: Thu Jul 17, 2014 3:50 pm Post subject: |
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Thanks M.T.- I look forward to an announcement sometime. I do hope your research shows a market- especially for bus seats. Or, sit back and watch a few of the classified ads for middle seats (in particular)- you will have a warm, fuzzy feeling when you know how people will kill each other to get their hands on the right bus seat- and what they'll pay! 
Good luck sir, Bradford
_________________
| EverettB wrote: |
I wonder what the nut looks like.
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'62 L390 151, '62 L469 117, '63 L380 113, '64 L87 311, '65 L512 265, '65 L31 SO-42, '66 L360 251, '68 L30k 141, '71 L12 113, '74 ORG 181
FU#5 |
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Metal Twister
Samba Member
Joined: January 24, 2013
Posts: 405
Location: licking, MO.
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| Posted: Thu Jul 17, 2014 5:18 pm Post subject: |
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I am a car builder by trade and honestly believe this stuff has gotten out of hand for the average guy to afford. No wonder the rat rod scene has grown so quickly... Who can afford to build a car with new parts any more. I keep an eye on the competition and make sure that I out business them in every aspect of our business. I promise you if and when I build these seats it will be as affordable as possible. What is the old saying an honest days pay for an honest days work. I do believe in making a fair profit in quanity... not a killing in a few. Keep an eye on the advertisements here as this looks like the place to get the word out first when its time.
Thanks, M.T. |
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