Flywheel, Gland Nut, and Clutch Issues

[DuneSluggy]

Hi all, I will endeavor to keep this short and to the point:
I am rebuilding a buggy on a 63 chassis. I installed the engine and wired it for test fire but had the timing wrong so I was cranking it for a little while trying to troubleshoot. When at last I figured it out, the starter motor stopped engaging the motor but would still move the car while in gear. I was stressing out thinking something catastrophic had happened to my newly rebuilt engine and crank. I pulled the engine. Turns out the person I bought the motor from didn't torque the gland nut beyond hand tight so the flywheel had come loose enough that it was slipping on the crank.

I am fairly weak on the mechanics of the clutch and transmission. I am hoping someone can take a glance at these pics and tell me if any damage has been done or if I am missing any parts. I was under the impression there should be some dowels holding the flywheel to the crank so that there is something other than the friction of the two faces carrying the force of the motor to the flywheel.

Also, does it look like the front seal is leaking more than would be expected with a loose gland nut in the situation I described?

Thank you in advance for any help anyone can offer!

_________________
"Hard work always beats talent if talent doesn't work hard."
The Hellcat:
Coyote-clone buggy with 1835cc, stock carb....for now.

[Eric&Barb]

Hard to tell from here, but looks like it is not badly worn. Take out the flywheel seal and get a straight edge in there to see if it is still flat.

If the mechanic forgot the dowel pins and proper torque, would be very leery of the rest of the engine.....
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In Stereo, Where Available!

[DuneSluggy]

Thanks for the reply! When you say flywheel seal, can you give me any other pointers? I am furiously googling and flipping through John Muir's book trying to figure this one out.

Valid concern about the rest of the engine. Luckily, based on a few other things that have come up, it looks like the person I bought this from had a mechanic rebuild just the engine but didn't install the crank pulley or the flywheel. That appears to have been the PO's handiwork.
_________________
"Hard work always beats talent if talent doesn't work hard."
The Hellcat:
Coyote-clone buggy with 1835cc, stock carb....for now.

[Eric&Barb]

[trickdog60]

Your crankshaft seal should not be leaking. Replace it with a new one. If at all convenient, I would take the motor and flywheel (and preferably clutch and plate) to someone who knows VW engines. Then, I'd have them remove the crankshaft seal, install and torque the flywheel using 4 pins, check for end play, install a new seal, reinstall and torque the flywheel (make sure that if there are any marks or punches on the flywheel to line up with punches on the end of the crankshaft, they are lined up), install the clutch and pressure plate using a guide so the clutch plate is lined up correctly, and the bolts holding the pressure plate are installed correctly and torqued properly. Then, you'll be ready to install the motor.

[esde]

Were there dowels installed to pin the flywheel, or was it just on with the gland nut?!?! The only way it could slip, is with no pins, or broken ones..
just when you think you've seen it all...

[Cusser]

Never heard of "no dowels" before, learn something new every day here !!!

Obviously, you'll use only 4 dowels, you have an aftermarket 8-dowel flywheel. The holes will not line up any old way either, because the flywheel will have one hole that's offset. So go one over from that one, and then every other one from there.

Yes, I'd for sure bolt up and check/adjust the end play, very important. Then replace the oil seal too, sealer on its outside edge (Permatex Aviation, brown goo). After the seal is in, lube its inner surface with clean oil, and same for corresponding location on the flywheel itself.
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1970 VW (owned since 1972) and 1971 VW Convertible (owned since 1976), second owner of each. The '71 now has the 1835 engine, swapped from the '70. Second owner of each. 1988 Mazda B2200 truck, 1998 Frontier, 2014 Yukon, 2004 Frontier King Cab. All manual transmission except for the Yukon. http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/album_page.php?pic_id=335294 http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/album_page.php?pic_id=335297

[drscope]

I think you are very fortunate there were no dowel pins in place when the gland nut came loose! If there were it probably would have torn stuff up as far as the holes are concerned in both flywheel and crankshaft.

Maybe it’s just the pictures, but I’m not too happy with how the dowel pin holes in that flywheel look. A couple of them appear to be wallowed out already. If your dowel pin holes are wallowed out on that flywheel, discard it and replace it!

Remove that seal, if only because there appears to be debris sticking to it and you don’t want that debris getting into this area. Seals aren’t expensive, so replace it with a new clean one. Also make sure you go in there when the seal is out and clean everything with an oiled Q tip to get any other dirt or debris out of there.

Then set the crankshaft end play. Muier’s book tells you how to do that and it is VERY important! Set the end play with the flywheel you plan to use, as flywheel dimensions effect end play. Anytime you do a swap of the flywheel you need to reset endplay.

It’s good to have a selection of end play shims on hand if you are playing with this stuff. Most suppliers should sell various assortments.

After you set end play, install the new seal and before you install the crank shaft for the last time, oil the lip on the inside of the seal. If you don’t oil that lip that rides on the flywheel, sometimes it will burn the lip off when you first start it up before oil pressure gets up there. If that happens you will have a leaky seal.

Make sure you also have a way of properly torqueing the gland nut. The book tells you how to do that as well. End play and proper torque of the gland nut, snug fitting dowel pins and oiling the seal are all very important aspects to making this engine run well for a long time. Don’t overlook that!
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Mother Nature is a Mean Evil Bitch!

[DuneSluggy]

Thanks everybody for the replies. Drscope, you are right and I'm glad you noticed, the dowel holes are slightly worn and I was curious if this would be a problem. I will replace it. Any advice on which one would be a good choice for a moderately performance tuned dune buggy?

Another follow up question, can anyone give me a quick rundown on how to check end play with a dial gauge, or point me to a tutorial? I would be willing to buy or rent one over using the All-Thread jig in Muir's method.

Seriously can't say enough, thank you everyone for your help and advice! Someday I hope to be one of the guys giving answers instead of questions here!
_________________
"Hard work always beats talent if talent doesn't work hard."
The Hellcat:
Coyote-clone buggy with 1835cc, stock carb....for now.

[thomas.]

You can use feeler gauges with one of these tools.

http://www2.cip1.com/ProductDetails.asp?ProductCode=ACC-C10-7095

[Eric&Barb]

[drscope]

For a light weight dune buggy you should do alright with a lightened flywheel. It will make it rev up a little faster and be a little more peppy.

Muier's all thread and feeler gauge set up works pretty well. Or you can use a dial gauge on a magnetic base stuck to the flywheel and measure off the case.
_________________
Mother Nature is a Mean Evil Bitch!