2" narrowed front steering geometry

Northof49

Any problems? I can't figure out the source of my low speed turn tire squealing. My friend observed that the geometry looks wrong when I turn the tires sharply. I read some posts about 4" narrowing causing such a severe disruption to the ackerman geometry that you get wheel scrub on a turn. I'm wondering if this is my problem with a 2" narrowing as well, and what steps I can take to correct it.
_________________
1958 Karmann Ghia owner

esde · Posted: Sun Jul 27, 2014 5:51 pm Post subject:

Kind of depends on
1. If it's lowered
2. How it's lowered
3. Where you mounted the tie rods on the knuckles (top or bottom)
4. Did you use caster shims
5. What is your toe set at?

drscope · Posted: Sun Jul 27, 2014 5:54 pm Post subject:

2" narrowing will also mess with the Ackerman. Basic rule of thumb for proper Ackerman is that you need to draw an imaginary line from the center of the king pin (or ball joint) to the center of the rear axle.

The pick up point where the tie rod meets the steering arm MUST be on that line.

Anytime you narrow the beam, you move the center of the king pin in so the pick up point for the tie rod is no longer on the line.

You need to move the hole in the steering arms for the tie rod ends to get them back on the line and that will correct the Ackerman.
_________________
Mother Nature is a Mean Evil Bitch!

Northof49 · Posted: Sun Jul 27, 2014 7:46 pm Post subject:

I think I have discovered a blunder. It would appear that the pitman arm is not pointing straight back when the steering wheel centred and the wheels pointing straight ahead. I believe I am out by half a revolution at the steering box. Should be easy to correct. I see the notch in the collar on the steering box shaft is up when the steering wheel is upside down and the wheels slightly turned. Dang it.
_________________
1958 Karmann Ghia owner

VOLKSWAGNUT · Posted: Mon Jul 28, 2014 6:08 am Post subject:

A wise pair once said....

Northof49 · Posted: Mon Jul 28, 2014 7:19 am Post subject:

Tie rods adjusted and squealing is gone. The problem was that I didn't have the steering box centred. I accidentally flipped the steering wheel and was out by half a turn.

I still need to figure out why I have more turns of the steering wheel to the right than the left. Something must be hitting something. Should be easy to find.
_________________
1958 Karmann Ghia owner

VOLKSWAGNUT · Posted: Mon Jul 28, 2014 7:53 am Post subject:

Ball Joint or Link Pin?
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aka Ken {o\!/o}
Its your vehicle- stop askin' for approval-do what YOU like for cryin' out loud
Better to roll em' how you want and wear em' out-than lettin' em' rot out
Its about the going not the showing
Rebuilt to drive not decorate
WANTED: Local Eatin' Joints, Triple D for TheSamba contributions here http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=570510
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Usually and often edited

Northof49 · Posted: Mon Jul 28, 2014 7:55 am Post subject:

Ball joint
_________________
1958 Karmann Ghia owner

VOLKSWAGNUT · Posted: Mon Jul 28, 2014 8:13 am Post subject:

Did you adjust the stops?
And are you 100% sure you have the box centered.
Count the turns (lock to lock), then from the centered mark left and from the centered mark right..

http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=47934o..
_________________
aka Ken {o\!/o}
Its your vehicle- stop askin' for approval-do what YOU like for cryin' out loud
Better to roll em' how you want and wear em' out-than lettin' em' rot out
Its about the going not the showing
Rebuilt to drive not decorate
WANTED: Local Eatin' Joints, Triple D for TheSamba contributions here http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=570510
Search "VOLKSWAGNUT" on YouTube since you cant watch a "certain" BELT change video round here
Usually and often edited

Northof49 · Posted: Mon Jul 28, 2014 9:42 am Post subject:

It is the steering damper. End Needs relocating . It is fully compressing after one turn left. No good for parking lots.

Steers like a dream now that the pitman arm is centred. No more low speed scrubbing. Just need to flip my steering wheel so it's right side up again.looks like a 2" narrowing doesn't pose noticeable Ackerman problems.
_________________
1958 Karmann Ghia owner

VOLKSWAGNUT · Posted: Mon Jul 28, 2014 10:15 am Post subject:

Amazing.. an entire thread with you answering your own questions and finding your own problems... Laughing

If only more were like this... except... with searching the forums performed first..

Good job... at least you are looking and paying attention..

.
_________________
aka Ken {o\!/o}
Its your vehicle- stop askin' for approval-do what YOU like for cryin' out loud
Better to roll em' how you want and wear em' out-than lettin' em' rot out
Its about the going not the showing
Rebuilt to drive not decorate
WANTED: Local Eatin' Joints, Triple D for TheSamba contributions here http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=570510
Search "VOLKSWAGNUT" on YouTube since you cant watch a "certain" BELT change video round here
Usually and often edited

Northof49 · Posted: Thu Jul 31, 2014 6:51 am Post subject:

As a follow up, I was only getting one turn of the steering wheel to the left of centre, 1 3/4 turns right. I cut the steering damper mount loose on the beam to relocate it, but discovered that it's location was not the only limit on steering travel. What I discovered was that the steering arm swinging left, it hit the edge of the frame head. I had to grind a 1/2" deep recess in the edge of the frame head to allow full travel of the steering arm. After that, I relocated the mount for the damper on the frame. I now have 1 3/4 turns right, and just short of that to the left.

And best of all, no squealing tires. Now to figure out why one tire locks up during braking.
_________________
1958 Karmann Ghia owner


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