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Replacing Convertible Support Rails Explained
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2ndbeetle
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PostPosted: Sat Jul 06, 2013 3:41 pm    Post subject: Re: Super Beetle Convertible Braces from BUGSTUFF Reply with quote

Bugs'n'Pugs wrote:
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Here is a picture of a set of braces that I bought from a company called BUGSTUFF in West Brownsville, Pennsylvania. (BUGSTUFF can be contacted at (724) 785-7000 or [email protected].) The braces mount in the existing locations where the door hinges and the striker plate mount so that no welding is required.


Thanks `Bugs and Pugs,` I bought a set of the `door bars` and they fit perfectly. My rails are in place so I have my rails for half price on theSamba classifieds.
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far rider Premium Member
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PostPosted: Tue Jul 23, 2013 6:48 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Working on my 63. I replaced the drivers side heater channel but haven't done the support rail yet. Here's my issue when I open the drivers side door it drops a bit. To close it I have to lift up on it and then it closes and is lined up. My question is when I do replace the support rail will that make a difference so the door closes properly without lifting? Any help is appreciated.
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brystheguy
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PostPosted: Wed Jul 31, 2013 5:58 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

That sounds more like a worn hinge causing the drop. I would fix that first before I do the channel so then you can line it up accurately.

far rider wrote:
Working on my 63. I replaced the drivers side heater channel but haven't done the support rail yet. Here's my issue when I open the drivers side door it drops a bit. To close it I have to lift up on it and then it closes and is lined up. My question is when I do replace the support rail will that make a difference so the door closes properly without lifting? Any help is appreciated.
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far rider Premium Member
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PostPosted: Tue Aug 06, 2013 5:01 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks Bryson
I think my pins and hinges are ok. There doesn't seem to be any play in them.
I'm about to place the car back on the pan to see what happens with the body rear mounts. I'm hoping maybe a little shimming at that point will do the trick.
I'll post the results after I get some help lifting the body back on the pan.
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far rider Premium Member
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PostPosted: Tue Nov 05, 2013 5:50 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Figured out the issue with my doors. It was simply that the body was not level on the cart. One side still has the support channel the other side is rusted away. Embarassed Once I leveled the entire body both sides work great.
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laguest
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PostPosted: Sat Sep 20, 2014 10:03 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Not sure how active this thread is still, but I think I got myself into a bad situation.

The wife and I fell in love with a 67 vert so we picked it up, we are not big time bug people. Just looking for a fun car to drive to the beach. Took it to the local shop and they told me that the someone had removed the reinforcement rails and welded in box tubing for support. They also installed pans from a sedan so there is a jack hole.

The said they had never seen anything like this. They recommended putting new rails back in, I am waiting for them to get back to me on the cost for the work.

What has me stressed is everyone is pulling the body off to do the work. This car is not in bad shape and I am sure it will cost big $$ to pull the body, weld in the rails then reassemble.

From what I can see if they remove the box tubing what is left under it is not rusted.

Does anyone know if you can weld the reinforcement rails in place with the body still on?

Thanks
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Mike Fisher
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PostPosted: Sat Sep 20, 2014 10:46 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

You can replace up to 90% of the pans with the body still on the chassis except the front/rear 10%. If the box tubing repair doesn't hang down to low & is solid I would just use it as is?
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far rider Premium Member
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PostPosted: Sat Sep 20, 2014 11:13 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I agree. if the car sits good now, no sag, doors open and shut fine I'd leave it and drive it. Your home rails might even be stronger than replacements.
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far rider Premium Member
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PostPosted: Sat Sep 20, 2014 11:17 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

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Heres a cut away of a heater channel and support rail. Never done it but I think you could replace support rails without removing body if your heater channels are solid. Good luck
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laguest
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PostPosted: Sat Sep 20, 2014 11:53 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks, they didn't say anything at the shop about the car sagging. They did say that the passenger door does not align. When you open that door it drops down a bit.

I am going to try and take a bunch of pics and post them.

Whats a good way to see if the car is sagging right now?

Thanks again!
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laguest
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PostPosted: Sat Sep 20, 2014 9:24 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Here is a link to the bottom of the 67 vert we just picked up.
http://gallery.guestfamily.com/1967-Blue

Like I said in my other post we are not hard core bug people so we missed the fact that the reinforcement rails didn't get installed. They put in this extra support instead.

Trying to figure out if we leave it in, or have them weld in new support rails. I wont know the cost for the work until next week sometime.

While we like this bug if this is going to be an issue or cost us a ton of $$ then maybe its better to unload it, take a loss and find something a bit more solid.

Any advice would be appreciated.

Thanks
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far rider Premium Member
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PostPosted: Sun Sep 21, 2014 4:21 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I am not a professional but have worked on several convertibles. So what follows is just my ideas.
It's hard to tell without seeing the car but the repair seems ok. Do your door gaps seem equal top to bottom? On driver and pass side?
As far as the body lines off on the passenger door and the door dropping a bit that could be from when the original support rails went south and the body went a little out of align. Then the replacement metal was installed without realigning the body.
There is some adjustment in the door, did you try adjusting it?
What happens if you stand or put some good weight oh the threshold with the door open? If you see or feel the threshold give/sag, not good. If there is no movement, good. If the latter is the case I would drive the car as is and not worry. You'll never win 'most original' but who cares:)
Just an FYI; as you now know, Original vert pans would not have the Jack point on the pan. It would be in the support rail. Other than that the pans are the same. So not a big thing, just jack the car from other points.
Another major problem area on convertibles is the luggage area behind the back seat. Did you look under the rug there? Usually rusty.
Too bad the seller didn't point out the repairs.
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laguest
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PostPosted: Mon Sep 22, 2014 6:31 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks far rider, great info

The driver door has the same gap, the passenger a bit smaller at the bottom. I can take some pics and post later in the week. The guy I bought it from said he spent time trying to get the gaps even with the top down. The shop said with the top down they should be off a bit as you need to make the gap equal with the top up?

Looked behind the back and seat and its solid.

Had my wife stood on the door jam on the passenger side and jump up and down a bit, I didn't see anything flex, I then did the same (206 lbs) and she said nothing moved when looking at where the support rails are supposed to be.
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Mike Fisher
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PostPosted: Tue Sep 23, 2014 7:28 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

The square tubing tucks & looks fine. The C channel cross bar that is bolted on is the only part I might change. If the doors gaps are not rubbing/chipping the paint, then they are fine too. Paint the pans top & bottom with Master Series or POR 15.
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far rider Premium Member
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PostPosted: Tue Sep 23, 2014 9:17 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yeah, I'd leave what's there and drive/enjoy it. Good luck!
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PostPosted: Tue Sep 22, 2015 1:50 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Support rails are in. Finally got the body work done. 63 beryl green convertible finally in a coat of paint.
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YodaBug
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PostPosted: Wed May 11, 2016 7:51 am    Post subject: Re: Replacing Convertible Support Rails Explained Reply with quote

I found the link to BugStuff for the door rails.
http://www.bugstuffonline.com/product_info.php?products_id=1176
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ADDA
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PostPosted: Wed Feb 08, 2017 10:05 am    Post subject: Re: Replacing Convertible Support Rails Explained Reply with quote

I appreciate this is an old thread however I'm in the process of restoring my 63. I'm having some serious problems with door gaps on driver side about 15mm more at the top and 10mm more at the bottom compared to the passenger side isn't too bad and I can live with it. I was thinking of removing the body install new floorpans then chop out heater channels etc tack in new heater channels and marry up body and chassis then line body up with doors and when looks fine tack everything up brace and unbolt it and weld the heater channels and sill strengtheners that then put it back together .
If this car was in US it would of been cut up years ago whereas in UK early convertibles are hard to come by....and parts.
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far rider Premium Member
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PostPosted: Fri Feb 24, 2017 5:24 am    Post subject: Re: Replacing Convertible Support Rails Explained Reply with quote

Sounds good to me. I think if you do a search you'll find that's been done alteady. If I had to do mine over I think I would leave the doors in, maybe even tack them in place to be sure the end gap would be exact. I used internal bracing and was off a bit in the end. Another thing I would do different is when I replaced the front clip I used the fenders to line up bolt holes. My mistake was not also putting on the hood to get exact curvature. Good luck. Big job for sure but it can be done.
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Daverham
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PostPosted: Thu Oct 25, 2018 10:59 am    Post subject: Re: Replacing Convertible Support Rails Explained Reply with quote

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This is a really helpful image. But what's that little tube running through the bottom part of the rail?

Heater channel is up top... is the lower part something to do with charcoal canister? The defrost doesn't go through there does it?



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