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ataraxia
Samba Member
Joined: March 19, 2010
Posts: 4504
Location: Illinois
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 Posted: Thu Oct 23, 2014 6:38 am Post subject: |
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| hoss wrote: |
| Erik G wrote: |
| all this talk about being undervalued - really? Not numbers matching, the body and pan dont match, the paint looks amateur... I havent seen interior pics but I would assume it's not correct either |
You know Erik.. you make a good point.
Is the car really undervalued at $10k? I think after reading up on it and finding the few photos I could, I think $10k is about top dollar on that car.
Early N body that is more rare than an S.. but not any more valuable, but on a later IRS auto pan.. with some rims.
What's the argument for it being worth more? Did it have an amazing original N interior with perfect dash? Custom 2110cc motor? |
Correct. Based on this - it's very likely OVERvalued. |
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vwfye
Samba Member
Joined: April 15, 2000
Posts: 7661
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| Posted: Thu Oct 23, 2014 8:28 am Post subject: |
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My N body on later pan with 2110 can't even bring the 6k asking price. now is this a 10k car?
_________________
64 No'back Speedster "Pearl"
1980s Sand Dragster "The Plunger"
LME "Little Giant Killer 3" |
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Erik G
Samba Member
Joined: October 16, 2002
Posts: 13271
Location: Tejas!
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| Posted: Thu Oct 23, 2014 8:32 am Post subject: |
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| vwfye wrote: |
| My N body on later pan with 2110 can't even bring the 6k asking price. |
It's not sea blue  |
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vwfye
Samba Member
Joined: April 15, 2000
Posts: 7661
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| Posted: Thu Oct 23, 2014 10:13 am Post subject: |
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| Erik G wrote: |
| vwfye wrote: |
| My N body on later pan with 2110 can't even bring the 6k asking price. |
It's not sea blue |
Ah, crap! You're right!
_________________
64 No'back Speedster "Pearl"
1980s Sand Dragster "The Plunger"
LME "Little Giant Killer 3" |
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Bobnotch
Samba Member
Joined: July 06, 2003
Posts: 22413
Location: Kimball, Mi
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| Posted: Thu Oct 23, 2014 12:27 pm Post subject: |
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| Bobnotch wrote: |
I agree 100%, as I've tried to stay out of this one (just been lurking).
It's a parts car now, as it'll be too expensive for the insurance company to repair it.  Why do you think the insurance company is jerking you around? They're trying to get out of paying way too much for an old car that isn't worth much (in their eyes). Afterall, it's just an old Volkswagen. Add in that right now it's not even a numbers matching vehicle, since you have an automatic pan under it, so it's not original, and thus worth even less. Insurance companies look for loop holes to get out of paying out. |
I posted this back on July 21st (page 5 of this blog). So it's definitely "over valued". Add in that you can buy many cars here on the Samba (in the classifieds) that are also not "numbers matching" for a lot less than 10K. Then you look at the car that are "numbers matching", and even a good portion of them are LESS than 10K. Insursurance companies don't give a damn about the color, they're job is to settle for as cheap as they can. They look for loop holes (things that you as an owner have done) to drop your coverage, even IF you did them with an eye toward safety. It's their job to. Even IF you still have the numbers matching pan, if it's not under the body at the time of the accident, the value drops (it's NO longer "numbers matching"). Does YOUR insurance company know it's not on it's correct pan? And IF so, would they have increased your coverage of it? or were you not telling them that you had swapped in an IRS and AT pan under the 65 "N" body shell? If so, then that's fraud, and they could cancel your coverage, and leave you hanging in the breeze.
Just a little something to think about.
_________________
Bob 65 Notch S with Sunroof
71 Notch ...aka Krunchy; build pics here;
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=249390 -been busy working
64 T-34 Ghia...aka Wolfie, under construction... http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=412120
| Tram wrote: |
| "Friends are God's way of apologizing for relatives." |
| Tram wrote: |
| People keep confusing "restored" and "restroyed". |
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blankmange
Type 3 Darksider
Joined: July 17, 2004
Posts: 11498
Location: Bloßer Stahl-preapocalyptic MidCoast
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| Posted: Thu Oct 23, 2014 1:20 pm Post subject: |
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| Bobnotch wrote: |
| Bobnotch wrote: |
I agree 100%, as I've tried to stay out of this one (just been lurking).
It's a parts car now, as it'll be too expensive for the insurance company to repair it. Why do you think the insurance company is jerking you around? They're trying to get out of paying way too much for an old car that isn't worth much (in their eyes). Afterall, it's just an old Volkswagen. Add in that right now it's not even a numbers matching vehicle, since you have an automatic pan under it, so it's not original, and thus worth even less. Insurance companies look for loop holes to get out of paying out. |
I posted this back on July 21st (page 5 of this blog). So it's definitely "over valued". Add in that you can buy many cars here on the Samba (in the classifieds) that are also not "numbers matching" for a lot less than 10K. Then you look at the car that are "numbers matching", and even a good portion of them are LESS than 10K. Insursurance companies don't give a damn about the color, they're job is to settle for as cheap as they can. They look for loop holes (things that you as an owner have done) to drop your coverage, even IF you did them with an eye toward safety. It's their job to. Even IF you still have the numbers matching pan, if it's not under the body at the time of the accident, the value drops (it's NO longer "numbers matching"). Does YOUR insurance company know it's not on it's correct pan? And IF so, would they have increased your coverage of it? or were you not telling them that you had swapped in an IRS and AT pan under the 65 "N" body shell? If so, then that's fraud, and they could cancel your coverage, and leave you hanging in the breeze.
Just a little something to think about. |
but, Bob..... it's sea blue!
_________________
póg mo thóin
Certified DHS Technician
Samba Member # 24517 |
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Bobnotch
Samba Member
Joined: July 06, 2003
Posts: 22413
Location: Kimball, Mi
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| Posted: Thu Oct 23, 2014 1:41 pm Post subject: |
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| blankmange wrote: |
| Bobnotch wrote: |
| Bobnotch wrote: |
I agree 100%, as I've tried to stay out of this one (just been lurking).
It's a parts car now, as it'll be too expensive for the insurance company to repair it. Why do you think the insurance company is jerking you around? They're trying to get out of paying way too much for an old car that isn't worth much (in their eyes). Afterall, it's just an old Volkswagen. Add in that right now it's not even a numbers matching vehicle, since you have an automatic pan under it, so it's not original, and thus worth even less. Insurance companies look for loop holes to get out of paying out. |
I posted this back on July 21st (page 5 of this blog). So it's definitely "over valued". Add in that you can buy many cars here on the Samba (in the classifieds) that are also not "numbers matching" for a lot less than 10K. Then you look at the car that are "numbers matching", and even a good portion of them are LESS than 10K. Insursurance companies don't give a damn about the color, they're job is to settle for as cheap as they can. They look for loop holes (things that you as an owner have done) to drop your coverage, even IF you did them with an eye toward safety. It's their job to. Even IF you still have the numbers matching pan, if it's not under the body at the time of the accident, the value drops (it's NO longer "numbers matching"). Does YOUR insurance company know it's not on it's correct pan? And IF so, would they have increased your coverage of it? or were you not telling them that you had swapped in an IRS and AT pan under the 65 "N" body shell? If so, then that's fraud, and they could cancel your coverage, and leave you hanging in the breeze.
Just a little something to think about. |
but, Bob..... it's sea blue! |
Yeah yeah, I know, it's a Sea blue "N" model Notch. Everything else said or done doesn't matter.
_________________
Bob 65 Notch S with Sunroof
71 Notch ...aka Krunchy; build pics here;
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=249390 -been busy working
64 T-34 Ghia...aka Wolfie, under construction... http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=412120
| Tram wrote: |
| "Friends are God's way of apologizing for relatives." |
| Tram wrote: |
| People keep confusing "restored" and "restroyed". |
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chizucc
Samba Member
Joined: August 16, 2012
Posts: 281
Location: Los Angeles
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| Posted: Thu Oct 23, 2014 2:20 pm Post subject: |
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| Bobnotch wrote: |
| Bobnotch wrote: |
I agree 100%, as I've tried to stay out of this one (just been lurking).
It's a parts car now, as it'll be too expensive for the insurance company to repair it. Why do you think the insurance company is jerking you around? They're trying to get out of paying way too much for an old car that isn't worth much (in their eyes). Afterall, it's just an old Volkswagen. Add in that right now it's not even a numbers matching vehicle, since you have an automatic pan under it, so it's not original, and thus worth even less. Insurance companies look for loop holes to get out of paying out. |
I posted this back on July 21st (page 5 of this blog). So it's definitely "over valued". Add in that you can buy many cars here on the Samba (in the classifieds) that are also not "numbers matching" for a lot less than 10K. Then you look at the car that are "numbers matching", and even a good portion of them are LESS than 10K. Insursurance companies don't give a damn about the color, they're job is to settle for as cheap as they can. They look for loop holes (things that you as an owner have done) to drop your coverage, even IF you did them with an eye toward safety. It's their job to. Even IF you still have the numbers matching pan, if it's not under the body at the time of the accident, the value drops (it's NO longer "numbers matching"). Does YOUR insurance company know it's not on it's correct pan? And IF so, would they have increased your coverage of it? or were you not telling them that you had swapped in an IRS and AT pan under the 65 "N" body shell? If so, then that's fraud, and they could cancel your coverage, and leave you hanging in the breeze.
Just a little something to think about. |
I'd been reading this thread off and on and did not know that....
Lady, take the money and run
_________________
1964 Notchback
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=543579 |
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VWGirl
Samba Member
Joined: June 03, 2003
Posts: 2462
Location: Powder Springs, GA
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| Posted: Mon Oct 27, 2014 3:35 am Post subject: |
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| hoss wrote: |
| Erik G wrote: |
| all this talk about being undervalued - really? Not numbers matching, the body and pan dont match, the paint looks amateur... I havent seen interior pics but I would assume it's not correct either |
You know Erik.. you make a good point.
Is the car really undervalued at $10k? I think after reading up on it and finding the few photos I could, I think $10k is about top dollar on that car.
Early N body that is more rare than an S.. but not any more valuable, but on a later IRS auto pan.. with some rims.
What's the argument for it being worth more? Did it have an amazing original N interior with perfect dash? Custom 2110cc motor? |
Actually it is a 4 speed pan with an automatic transmission. At the time of the build of the car no type 3 pan halves were available and this pan is original and rust free. Its not like i cant put it back on its rusty old pan any time i wanted. Maybe some day after i win the lotto i will... actually just looked at it yesterday and realized the original pan had 4 lug wheels on it too. But thats fine as i still have the wide 5 drums and wheels too. What exactly is the difference in the pans? The rear subframe that bolts on?
It does have the original interior. The dash of course is cracked, but thats not that hard to get fixed. The headliner is amazingly perfect. Seats show their age, but are good for 50.
I still cannot replace a straight rust free N model (or any really) for 10k. They simply dont exist in this part of the country, and shipping is expensive. Not to mention that i know whats under the paint of this car, i wouldnt know whats under the paint of another. Ive seen way too much bondo.
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Without love in the dream it will never come true |
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vwfye
Samba Member
Joined: April 15, 2000
Posts: 7661
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| Posted: Mon Oct 27, 2014 8:59 am Post subject: |
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yes you can. buy a straight rust free body with a crappy pan, add pan and you are under 10k. sorry, unless it is completely original at the time of the accident, it isn't original.
_________________
64 No'back Speedster "Pearl"
1980s Sand Dragster "The Plunger"
LME "Little Giant Killer 3" |
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notchback
Insensitive Jerk
Joined: December 16, 2003
Posts: 7024
Location: Behind the Zion Curtain
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| Posted: Mon Oct 27, 2014 2:53 pm Post subject: |
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| vwfye wrote: |
| yes you can. buy a straight rust free body with a crappy pan, add pan and you are under 10k. sorry, unless it is completely original at the time of the accident, it isn't original. |
X2. The insurance company don't give a rat's ass (and rightly so) if you have original parts, if you intend on restoring it, if you can make it original in less than a day, etc. It's all about what it is like right now. It is a totally unoriginal car. It's not worth 10K. It's about a 5K car at the most. Welcome to life.
http://www.nadaguides.com/Classic-Cars/1964/Volkswagen/Type-3/2-Door-Notchback/Values
NADA average retail for a '64 Notchback is $9050. Good luck getting that. That fact that it's an "N" doesn't concern them at all. The fact that is is no where near original does.
_________________
| zeen wrote: |
| Arguing with johnnypan is like mud-wrestling a pig. After a while you realize he just enjoys playing in the mud, winning the contest is not the point. |
FU#3 |
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vwfye
Samba Member
Joined: April 15, 2000
Posts: 7661
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| Posted: Mon Oct 27, 2014 3:12 pm Post subject: |
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The only way it is a 10k car is if you have a 'stated value' policy that both you and the insurance company have agreed to.
I've owned 5 notchbacks. 2 have had stated value policies that reached the 10k level. And, to get there, I had to have them appraised (at my expense), dozens of photos of their condition when insured and proof that they were not stored outside of a garage.
_________________
64 No'back Speedster "Pearl"
1980s Sand Dragster "The Plunger"
LME "Little Giant Killer 3" |
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Erik G
Samba Member
Joined: October 16, 2002
Posts: 13271
Location: Tejas!
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| Posted: Tue Oct 28, 2014 8:11 am Post subject: |
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| VWGirl wrote: |
| hoss wrote: |
| Erik G wrote: |
| all this talk about being undervalued - really? Not numbers matching, the body and pan dont match, the paint looks amateur... I havent seen interior pics but I would assume it's not correct either |
You know Erik.. you make a good point.
Is the car really undervalued at $10k? I think after reading up on it and finding the few photos I could, I think $10k is about top dollar on that car.
Early N body that is more rare than an S.. but not any more valuable, but on a later IRS auto pan.. with some rims.
What's the argument for it being worth more? Did it have an amazing original N interior with perfect dash? Custom 2110cc motor? |
Actually it is a 4 speed pan with an automatic transmission. At the time of the build of the car no type 3 pan halves were available and this pan is original and rust free. Its not like i cant put it back on its rusty old pan any time i wanted. Maybe some day after i win the lotto i will... actually just looked at it yesterday and realized the original pan had 4 lug wheels on it too. But thats fine as i still have the wide 5 drums and wheels too. What exactly is the difference in the pans? The rear subframe that bolts on?
It does have the original interior. The dash of course is cracked, but thats not that hard to get fixed. The headliner is amazingly perfect. Seats show their age, but are good for 50.
I still cannot replace a straight rust free N model (or any really) for 10k. They simply dont exist in this part of the country, and shipping is expensive. Not to mention that i know whats under the paint of this car, i wouldnt know whats under the paint of another. Ive seen way too much bondo. |
by this logic, this car is worth 15K because all it needs is paint and interior http://www.thesamba.com/vw/classifieds/detail.php?id=1661074
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Bobnotch
Samba Member
Joined: July 06, 2003
Posts: 22413
Location: Kimball, Mi
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| Posted: Tue Oct 28, 2014 8:24 am Post subject: |
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| VWGirl wrote: |
What exactly is the difference in the pans? |
The VIN number stamped into it.
That's what seperates matching numbers from non-matching number cars.
_________________
Bob 65 Notch S with Sunroof
71 Notch ...aka Krunchy; build pics here;
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=249390 -been busy working
64 T-34 Ghia...aka Wolfie, under construction... http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=412120
| Tram wrote: |
| "Friends are God's way of apologizing for relatives." |
| Tram wrote: |
| People keep confusing "restored" and "restroyed". |
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squaretobehip
Samba Member
Joined: August 23, 2004
Posts: 3686
Location: San Jose, CA
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| Posted: Tue Oct 28, 2014 12:04 pm Post subject: |
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This thread hasn't been locked yet?
_________________
1963 Notchback - Ruby Red
1963 Squareback - Pearl White
1965 Squareback - Baltic Blue
Follow ISP West on:
Facebook - www.facebook.com/ispwest
Instagram - @ispwest - www.instagram.com/ispwest |
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thom
Samba Member
Joined: October 12, 2000
Posts: 5943
Location: Sacramento
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| Posted: Tue Oct 28, 2014 3:34 pm Post subject: |
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So you have a mishmash of random parts, mis-matched pan/body/engine, crappy paint job, ratty interior, but supposedly a really nice headliner and somehow all that is supposed to be worth north of $10k?
_________________
-Thom
1956 Single Cab
1957 Porsche 356A Sunroof
1957 23-Window Deluxe
1957 Mercedes Westfalia single cab
1963 Unimog 404
1965 E-Type |
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blankmange
Type 3 Darksider
Joined: July 17, 2004
Posts: 11498
Location: Bloßer Stahl-preapocalyptic MidCoast
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| Posted: Tue Oct 28, 2014 3:52 pm Post subject: |
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| thom wrote: |
| So you have a mishmash of random parts, mis-matched pan/body/engine, crappy paint job, ratty interior, but supposedly a really nice headliner and somehow all that is supposed to be worth north of $10k? |
and it's sea blue, dammit....
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póg mo thóin
Certified DHS Technician
Samba Member # 24517 |
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D/A/N
Samba Member
Joined: August 13, 2010
Posts: 2227
Location: 11222
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| Posted: Tue Oct 28, 2014 4:48 pm Post subject: |
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| squaretobehip wrote: |
This thread hasn't been locked yet?
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I thought the exact same thing when I saw this topic back at the top of the list  |
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blankmange
Type 3 Darksider
Joined: July 17, 2004
Posts: 11498
Location: Bloßer Stahl-preapocalyptic MidCoast
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| Posted: Wed Oct 29, 2014 2:43 am Post subject: |
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| D/A/N wrote: |
| squaretobehip wrote: |
This thread hasn't been locked yet?
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I thought the exact same thing when I saw this topic back at the top of the list |
especially since the car has not been repaired, the owner refuses to post what AKK gave her as the estimate, etc....?
_________________
póg mo thóin
Certified DHS Technician
Samba Member # 24517 |
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blankmange
Type 3 Darksider
Joined: July 17, 2004
Posts: 11498
Location: Bloßer Stahl-preapocalyptic MidCoast
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| Posted: Mon Nov 17, 2014 5:56 pm Post subject: |
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so ..... surely, in the last two and a half weeks, there's been some progress?
an estimate perhaps?
or an offer by an insurance company?
we're waiting to see how very wrong we've been.....
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póg mo thóin
Certified DHS Technician
Samba Member # 24517 |
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