Help Identify noise

Rag00oll · Posted: Wed Oct 29, 2014 7:21 pm Post subject: Help Identify noise

Link

Just tell it to me like it is, i had it once make this noise over the summer. I had to change a flywheel seal and when i put it back in it was quiet for months until I had to replace the crappy seal i bought. I was hoping the engine pull I did today would shut it up, but apparently not.

Input shaft bearing? The trans is kinda leaky.

Throw out bearing rattling around? The noise literally goes away the moment my foot even touches the clutch pedal.

Thanks in advance.

SGKent · Posted: Wed Oct 29, 2014 7:47 pm Post subject:

no on the pilot bearing. it is turning the same speed as the input shaft when the clutch is engaged.

The TO bearing will normally squeal when the clutch is pressed rather than sitting with your foot off the pedal.

But now the bad news. Lousy recording but how did you make sure you got the right torque and endplay on the flywheel?
_________________
“Most people don’t know what they’re doing, and a lot of them are really good at it.” - George Carlin

Wildthings · Samba Member Joined: March 13, 2005 Posts: 50352

I am guessing you have excessive crankshaft end play. Tell us what kind of engine you have. Type 1 or Type 4, if a Type 4 maybe the fan is hitting the fan shroud expect when you depress the clutch a bit. There is supposed to be a spacer between the fan hub and the fan.

Rag00oll · Posted: Wed Oct 29, 2014 9:43 pm Post subject:

What about a bearing inside the transmission?

Not sure what my crankshaft endplay is, it's type 1 1600 SP btw. There's about 35,000 miles on this block that was rebuilt for me. I've seen some excessive endplay in my limited experience of a few years with vw's, and mine seems ok just eyeballing it... Wink

I used a torquemeister to get the gland nut to the right spec.

A guy in my local club watched the video and said it may be the TO bearing rattling around.

I don't have an endplay tool... however, i do have a set of calipers, can they be set up to measure endplay?

airschooled · Posted: Wed Oct 29, 2014 10:29 pm Post subject:

Wildthings · Samba Member Joined: March 13, 2005 Posts: 50352

With the engine hot and tranny in neutral push the pulley forward with you hands or use a bar. Then while you have your finger positioned between the pulley and block have someone push on the clutch pedal. Do you feel any movement? Repeat over and over until you are sure. The proper amount of end play is almost imperceptible, if the movement of obvious then it is excessive.

Yes your noise could be from the throwout bearing. It is probably not from the tranny.

Rag00oll · Posted: Wed Oct 29, 2014 11:09 pm Post subject:

It's a SP in a 71, I've got discs up front. SP parts were what I had when I ordered the block so i figured why the hell not keep it as a SP. And yeah, 35,000 miles in only 2.5 years...

I'll check the endplay in the morning, if it is too much am I correct in assuming there are different size shims? I'm also positive there are three shims on there now and always have been, considering I took a good look at them a month ago when I checked the oil passage behind the flywheel.

I'm gonna drop the motor regardless and replace the throwout bearing. Should only take an hour.

Also, hoping to drive this bus to San Francisco from Pittsburgh PA in about a week an a half.

airschooled · Posted: Wed Oct 29, 2014 11:16 pm Post subject:

Yes on three different sized shims. When the clutch pedal is pressed, the TOB (throw out bearing) is pressing the pressure plate (and flywheel and crankshaft) towards the rear of the bus. The flywheel is spinning around 4k RPM on an upshift, so with the flywheel at 4k, the first shim spins 3k, the second 2k, and the last shim at 1k RPM, followed by the stationary main bearing. The oil film between the progressively slower shims allows minimal wear on the mean bearing surface, but wear does happen- hence our end play adjustments! Clear as mud? Shocked

So your '71 SHOULD have a guide sleeve for the throw out bearing, yes? And your pressure plate should NOT have a collar. That's generally a more robust system, so my money is on end play for now. But your throw out bearing could have come apart and could be held in place by the sleeve so when you press the clutch pedal it all goes back together and functions. Maybe?
_________________
Learn how your vintage VW works. And why it doesn't!
One-on-one tech help for your Volkswagen:
www.airschooled.com

Rag00oll · Posted: Wed Oct 29, 2014 11:39 pm Post subject:

I had the motor out today to check out this noise...

I only made the noise louder. Drove me nuts.

Now I learned something new about what happens to those shims, I have another TO bearing, when I had the engine out today i did notice that the spring on the one side was loose and not in the slot but instead just riding around, hanging on by a thread to the lever arm. I'll replace it and report back, as well as what I think my endplay may be.

EDIT: Oh I should also mention that there were times driving today where I'd hit a bump and the noise would stop. Hit a bump again and it'd come right back.

airschooled · Posted: Wed Oct 29, 2014 11:41 pm Post subject:

airschooled · Posted: Wed Oct 29, 2014 11:47 pm Post subject:

Also: your end play could be such that the rear crank pulley is contacting the engine tin when the clutch pedal pushes the crankshaft that way. Fell the front (front of bus) side of the pulley for galling, and look for metal shavings below the belt.
_________________
Learn how your vintage VW works. And why it doesn't!
One-on-one tech help for your Volkswagen:
www.airschooled.com

Wildthings · Samba Member Joined: March 13, 2005 Posts: 50352

Try setting your clutch freeplay very loose and see if the noise goes away. If one or both springs on the throwout bearing are loose the throwout bearing could be bouncing against the fingers on the flywheel when it is only pulled back a short distance.

Rag00oll · Posted: Thu Oct 30, 2014 7:18 pm Post subject:

So, changed the TO bearing with a good one i had sitting around. And changed the pressure plate.

Noise was gone for about 20 miles, noise came back. But its not the same. Now it's way quiter and only did it off and on. I could step on the brakes and it would go away, but i had to have the radio completely off to even be able to hear it.

I checked the endplay too, judging on the 20 times i tried to measure it its sonewhere between .0035 and .005.

Rag00oll · Posted: Thu Oct 30, 2014 7:18 pm Post subject:

So, changed the TO bearing with a good one i had sitting around. And changed the pressure plate.

Noise was gone for about 20 miles, noise came back. But its not the same. Now it's way quiter and only did it off and on. I could step on the brakes and it would go away, but i had to have the radio completely off to even be able to hear it.

I checked the endplay too, judging on the 20 times i tried to measure it its sonewhere between .0035 and .005.


Hello! Log in or Register \| Help \| Donate \| Buy Shirts	See all banner ads \| Advertise on TheSamba.com

	Forum Index -> Bay Window Bus	All times are Mountain Standard Time/Pacific Daylight Savings Time
Page 1 of 1