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dhoffer Samba Member
Joined: October 20, 2014 Posts: 2 Location: Napoleon,Ohio
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Posted: Thu Oct 30, 2014 10:35 pm Post subject: tranny coolers |
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Has anyone used the 80$ tranny coolers from AutoZone? |
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Syncroincity Samba Member
Joined: April 15, 2007 Posts: 1557 Location: New York City
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dhoffer Samba Member
Joined: October 20, 2014 Posts: 2 Location: Napoleon,Ohio
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Posted: Fri Oct 31, 2014 6:12 am Post subject: |
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Russel, spectra, torqflow are a few they carry. Im not hung up on AutoZone, but i didnt know if it were necessary to spend 300 for a gowesty cooler. Not sure if its true, but i had seen somewhere that early vanagon and jettas with same transaxles didnt use a cooler. |
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MarkWard Samba Member
Joined: February 09, 2005 Posts: 17012 Location: Retired South Florida
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Posted: Fri Oct 31, 2014 7:02 am Post subject: |
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There were 010 Automatics that did not come with coolers/exchangers in early years in both VW and Audis. Unless I lived in a really cool climate, I would not delete a transmission cooler. No experience with aftermarket coolers. _________________ ☮️ |
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geodude Samba Member
Joined: May 24, 2012 Posts: 372 Location: Sacramento
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Posted: Fri Oct 31, 2014 7:20 am Post subject: |
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The short answer is you don't have to spend $300 on a gowesty unit. I made up my own and included a spin on transmission filter for less than $200. It just takes some research and fabrication. _________________ 1988 GL Camper
1991 Multivan — the basket case |
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ursaworks Samba Member
Joined: December 03, 2010 Posts: 127 Location: Chicago, IL, USA
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Posted: Fri Oct 31, 2014 7:49 am Post subject: |
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My thoughts after reading the amassed opinions and other technical info was that it was included to protect the transmission from the heavy load from the weight and expected use of the vehicle.
My argument (to myself) for deleting the original unit was to remove the opportunity for a failure in that system.
I added another cooling option as I have a heavily loaded Westy driving distances and challenging roads sometimes, clearly some engineer felt extra cooling was needed, and what can it hurt to have an ATF cooler?
The GW unit is expensive, others are available that use the same basic idea. Terry Kay sells probably the most low tech option, basicly a scoop that mounts on the bottom
One recent one that I find interesting.
http://www.foreignautosupply.com/parts-accessories/1-automatic-transmission-heat-sink/#.VFOdpPnF98E
others have built their own its not hard.
in the end deleting it may be the best option as it removes another point of failure but then again it may shorten the life of the trans.
for what it is worth that is what I came to
up to you.
Cheers _________________ 1987 2WD GL Automatic
Westfalia full camper
Vanistain engine
Last edited by ursaworks on Fri Oct 31, 2014 10:09 am; edited 1 time in total |
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PDXWesty Samba Member
Joined: April 11, 2006 Posts: 6235 Location: Portland OR
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Posted: Fri Oct 31, 2014 9:38 am Post subject: |
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geodude wrote: |
The short answer is you don't have to spend $300 on a gowesty unit. I made up my own and included a spin on transmission filter for less than $200. It just takes some research and fabrication. |
On one hand I understand this answer, beecause I also get a certain amount of satisfaction by doing things myself. On the other hand, a hundred bucks is not really a lot of savings when you factor in "research and fabrication" that you have to do yourself.
For me, this would be one item where it makes sense to buy a kit from one of the vendors and get it done fast with a tried and proven system. _________________ 89 Westy 2.1 Auto |
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Terry Kay Banned
Joined: June 22, 2003 Posts: 13331
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Posted: Fri Oct 31, 2014 11:11 am Post subject: |
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As crazy as the "Low Tech" cooler option I make, the crazy gizmo works, and my 87 Westy was the test unit.
The darn thing on a long highway ride in the summer at 70-75 mph would turn the ATF dark, & I could smell it was burnt.
Next ride I was going on I made up the scoop , hung it on the pan, loaded up with fresh Ford type F & a filter, 1100 miles down to Ky. & back, all was good--no burnt stinky fluid.
Go figure.
A guy does not have to blow 300 bucks to get the trans operating temp levels down.
The free air & the scoop work well & beyond my expectations.
For $30.00-- and some Type F --what the hay-- _________________ T.K. |
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kamzcab86 Samba Moderator
Joined: July 26, 2008 Posts: 7893 Location: Arizona
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Posted: Fri Oct 31, 2014 11:28 am Post subject: |
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PDXWesty wrote: |
On one hand I understand this answer, because I also get a certain amount of satisfaction by doing things myself. On the other hand, a hundred bucks is not really a lot of savings when you factor in "research and fabrication" that you have to do yourself. |
To give an idea of the potential cost, I spent $120 just on AN fittings and hoses for a cooler my dad gave me (leftover racing cooler that was never used):
There are a couple of good A/T cooler topics that list what fittings you need and such. Make up a shopping list, do a price comparison, and see how much you'll actually save. _________________ ~Kamz
1986 Cabriolet: www.Cabby-Info.com
1990 Vanagon Westfalia: Old Blue's Blog
2016 Golf GTI S
"Real knowledge is to know the extent of one's ignorance." - 孔子 |
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MarkWard Samba Member
Joined: February 09, 2005 Posts: 17012 Location: Retired South Florida
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Posted: Fri Oct 31, 2014 12:17 pm Post subject: |
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I am not 100% sure, but if you delete the cooler, you might have to add a loop in and out. I don't know if all the flow is through the cooler or it is parallel.
The factory exchanger actually does two things. It will get the transmission to temp quicker in cold climates and remove heat from the transmission via the cooling system.
If I were running an external cooler like pictured above, I think some sort of thermostat would be preferable in cold climates. And in case all the flow is through the cooler, I'd want to keep the hose lengths down so that you aren't running the transmission on startup waiting for pressure to come up as the lines and cooler fill.
For sure when the stock one fails internally it makes a huge mess. Yuck. _________________ ☮️ |
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Terry Kay Banned
Joined: June 22, 2003 Posts: 13331
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Posted: Fri Oct 31, 2014 1:00 pm Post subject: |
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Once the cooler & lines are primed & full of ATF, why would they empty out?
They wouldn't.
So the fear of running with no or low trans fluid is real low.
Once primed, always full. _________________ T.K. |
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kamzcab86 Samba Moderator
Joined: July 26, 2008 Posts: 7893 Location: Arizona
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Posted: Fri Oct 31, 2014 1:32 pm Post subject: |
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Terry Kay wrote: |
rsxsr wrote: |
And in case all the flow is through the cooler, I'd want to keep the hose lengths down so that you aren't running the transmission on startup waiting for pressure to come up as the lines and cooler fill. |
Once the cooler & lines are primed & full of ATF, why would they empty out?
They wouldn't.
So the fear of running with no or low trans fluid is real low.
Once primed, always full. |
What TK said. I had to add a bit of ATF after the cooler was installed. I've checked it twice now, and the level is still good. In removing the old, original cooler, I'm now driving my van without worrying about ATF getting contaminated with coolant and destroying the trans.
rsxsr wrote: |
The factory exchanger actually does two things. It will get the transmission to temp quicker in cold climates and remove heat from the transmission via the cooling system. |
The link provided earlier says (and my mechanic dad asked the same question FAS asks):
Quote: |
20 Years ago we asked the question: “Why would anyone design a factory cooler using antifreeze running at a higher operating temperature than the fluid it is attempting to cool (ATF)?”- makes no sense. We’ve heard all the answers and arguments.
The most common:
1. It helps the transmission fluid warm up to operating temperature faster- not true. They start off at close to the same temperature, with the tranny heating up much faster to start off. Even if it were the case, it should have been thermostatically controlled to kick off after operating temperature is achieved.
2. It keeps the transmission fluid at a lower more constant temperature - also, not true. Try mounting a temperature gauge on an earlier Bay Window automatic transmission. They constantly run 15-20 degrees cooler than their WBX counterpart without any cooler at all.
The bottom line is that the factory cooler is, and always has been, a completely flawed design.
http://www.foreignautosupply.com/parts-accessories/1-automatic-transmission-heat-sink/#.VFPucGcSFdd |
As far as "getting up to temp" on a cold start, even in Phoenix I don't start any of my VWs and immediately drive off. I let them get their juices flowing for a minute or two first. _________________ ~Kamz
1986 Cabriolet: www.Cabby-Info.com
1990 Vanagon Westfalia: Old Blue's Blog
2016 Golf GTI S
"Real knowledge is to know the extent of one's ignorance." - 孔子 |
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Syncroincity Samba Member
Joined: April 15, 2007 Posts: 1557 Location: New York City
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ursaworks Samba Member
Joined: December 03, 2010 Posts: 127 Location: Chicago, IL, USA
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