Hello! Log in or Register   |  Help  |  Donate  |  Buy Shirts See all banner ads | Advertise on TheSamba.com  
TheSamba.com
 
Single Stage vs. Two Stage Paint
Page: Previous  1, 2
Forum Index -> Split Bus Share: Facebook Twitter
Reply to topic
Print View
Quick sort: Show newest posts on top | Show oldest posts on top View previous topic :: View next topic  
Author Message
Pacmanfever
Samba Member


Joined: January 29, 2013
Posts: 201
Location: Kansas
Pacmanfever is offline 

PostPosted: Mon Jun 23, 2014 9:12 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

We're facing this same question in the next month as we prep for paint; single vs two stage paint. Here is our situation:

1. Daily driver, high school student
2. Bus will live outside
3. Kansas climate

Personally I like the look and depth of single stage paint on old vehicles, but the PPG Concept paint looks interesting. I've sprayed base + clear on new vehicles myself where it wasn't a question what to use, this is the first time around on a Bus.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Gallery Classifieds Feedback
marklaken
Samba Member


Joined: March 19, 2004
Posts: 2416
Location: fort collins, CO
marklaken is offline 

PostPosted: Mon Jun 23, 2014 1:06 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

My take after lots of reading, car show viewing, and a little car painting:
Single stage is going to give you more of a vintage look. Base/clear is going to give you that custom look. A high quality BC/CC should give you more depth than single stage - but it can be overdone and come out looking like the car has been dipped in plastic. Single stage is more forgiving in that you can get decent depth when you do your initial buff, and you can easily buff away any fading in the paint. BC/CC, you are buffing the clear coat, so if the initial base coat isn't done well (or it fades), the CC buff won't help it much. Both will chip.

I sprayed an old truck with a TCP Global cheap acrylic urethane single stage yellow paint and left it outside - it noticeably faded after 2 years in the Colorado sun and snow. A quick buff and the color came right back.
_________________
Wish List:
1967 Wesfalia SO-42 Parts Needed: Kitchenette, Cot Poles

'65 rear left beetle fender

15" Bus Wheels in fair condition

Mark Laken
Fort Collins, CO
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Gallery Classifieds Feedback
wcfvw69 Premium Member
Samba Purist


Joined: June 10, 2004
Posts: 13382
Location: Arizona
wcfvw69 is offline 

PostPosted: Mon Jun 23, 2014 2:15 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I just painted my 67 bug with PPG Concept single stage. It's a very good paint and sprays nicely.

A couple of suggestions though-

1) Final sand your primer w/400-600 wet sand paper to insure all your sanding scratches are removed.

2) Seal the primer before spraying the color on. This will also help fill any tiny sand scratches before you spray the color.

3) Make sure you don't put any LARGE runs or sags while spraying it. I had a pretty good sag by the left side of my rear window. I thought "no big deal, I'll wet sand it off". Wrong..! The color seems to rise to the top a bit. After sanding it flat, it was obvious that the color was a bit off. I had to sand and repaint the entire roof.
_________________
Contact me at [email protected]
Follow me on instagram @sparxwerksllc

Decades of VW and VW parts restoration experience.
The Samba member since 2004.

**Now rebuilding throttle bodies for VW's and Porsche's**
**Restored German Bosch distributors for sale or I can restore yours**
**Restored German Pierburg fuel pumps for sale or I can restore yours**
**Restored Porsche fuel pumps or I can restore yours**
**Restored Porsche distributors or I can restore yours**
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Gallery Classifieds Feedback
Kombi
Samba Member


Joined: August 02, 2002
Posts: 562
Location: Edmonton, AB, Canada
Kombi is offline 

PostPosted: Mon Jun 23, 2014 9:06 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

--there is a reason cars are now painted with base/clear


Single stage paints will fade over time when exposed to the elements.
when buffing /polishing single stage paint you are removing the colour coat.

When scratched it is not as noticeable because unless it went all the way through you will still see topcaot colour.


2 stage- Base/Clear

More durable to the elements and resists fading better.

When buffing/polishing you are removing imperfections in the clear.

Scratches will usually show as white lines-a little wet sanding then buff and polish.

spot repairs and blends are easier to do with base clear.


If you are doing solid yellow and white it will look good in either single stage or base/clear.

I made my living from autobody and painting cars - my preference is base clear... but I also prefer to shoot water-base paints...

I'd recommend going with whatever the painter is most comfortable with.
putting 2-3 coats of single stage vs 2 coats of base +2 coats of clear won't save that much labor but material cost are generally less.
_________________
Air and Water are needed to survive,
you just can't live as long without air!

Air Riders, VW Club
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website Gallery Classifieds Feedback
nzvwfan
Samba Member


Joined: January 07, 2006
Posts: 145
Location: New Zealand
nzvwfan is offline 

PostPosted: Wed Jun 25, 2014 12:37 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I've been a car painter for 25 odd years and when I first started single stage was all there was .So it was a great paint but fast forward 25 years and I wouldn't touch it now its so labour intensive and you have to put on so many coats compared to two pack . Two pack gets a bad name because of armatures using it and getting really peely finishes and yes it can have a plastic shine .But sprayed correctly and wet sanded smooth then buffed it will come out looking like an original finish but with longevity .And in most cases be alot cheaper as there's far less product used
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Gallery Classifieds Feedback
Bruce Amacker
Samba Member


Joined: December 26, 2007
Posts: 1786
Location: Cleveland, Ohio
Bruce Amacker is offline 

PostPosted: Wed Jun 25, 2014 8:18 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I just shot my bus with PPG single stage Delfleet Essential and it came out great. Easy re-shoots with invisible blend lines when I screwed up. Easy wet sanding of runs and sags with no color change. Prep was mostly airfile with 220 and no sanding scratches showed through. Big flat areas got lots of high build primer and blocked with 280 and then 400 to get them flat.

Shoot the doors laying flat on a horse so you won't run them and can put more paint on, there's no visual difference on mine between the doors and vertical panels.

Don't worry about orange peel as it all comes off, wet sand after a few days with 2000 and buff, it gleams like new money. I've done both B/C and SS, I'm partial to SS unless it's a trailer queen done by a pro.

See the link below for lots of details and info, the paint stuff starts at about page 22.

Good Luck!
_________________
'66 Deluxe Bus
'65 Standard Bus
Build threads:
'66- http://www.leakoil.net/forum/viewtopic.php?f=23&t=2888&sid=54d8dedfb3822f99c7f2ea430cb4e856
'65- http://leakoil.net/forum/viewtopic.php?f=23&t=4263
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website Gallery Classifieds Feedback
crofty
Judas of the North


Joined: August 09, 2000
Posts: 19670
Location: Land of Whine and Phonies
crofty is offline 

PostPosted: Wed Jun 25, 2014 8:59 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.


Single stage, painted in 1998.
_________________
Your Vanagon sucks, Stop waving at me.

HamburgerBrad wrote:

I slept on crofty's tent once. I passed out drunk from two bottles of Everett's brother's wine.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website Gallery Classifieds Feedback
Big Bill
Samba Member


Joined: June 21, 2005
Posts: 1782
Location: Santa Rosa, Ca
Big Bill is offline 

PostPosted: Wed Jun 25, 2014 4:16 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

crofty I saw your bus at Red Barn in April, it looks great for 16+ year old paint job.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Gallery Classifieds Feedback
novetti
Samba Member


Joined: August 15, 2004
Posts: 469

novetti is offline 

PostPosted: Wed Jun 25, 2014 6:25 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

nzvwfan wrote:
so labour intensive and you have to put on so many coats compared to two pack .


If you are using Acrylic Lacquer, Duco or any solvent based paint then yes a lot more coats than 2 stage.

If you are using modern Single Stage (Polyurethane resin cured with with high solids pigment content) is actually less coats than 2 stage paint as you don't need to spray the extra coats for the Clear on top of colour.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Gallery Classifieds Feedback
Pacmanfever
Samba Member


Joined: January 29, 2013
Posts: 201
Location: Kansas
Pacmanfever is offline 

PostPosted: Wed Jun 25, 2014 9:00 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Bruce Amacker wrote:
I just shot my bus with PPG single stage Delfleet Essential and it came out great. Easy re-shoots with invisible blend lines when I screwed up. Easy wet sanding of runs and sags with no color change. Prep was mostly airfile with 220 and no sanding scratches showed through. Big flat areas got lots of high build primer and blocked with 280 and then 400 to get them flat.

Shoot the doors laying flat on a horse so you won't run them and can put more paint on, there's no visual difference on mine between the doors and vertical panels.

Don't worry about orange peel as it all comes off, wet sand after a few days with 2000 and buff, it gleams like new money. I've done both B/C and SS, I'm partial to SS unless it's a trailer queen done by a pro.

See the link below for lots of details and info, the paint stuff starts at about page 22.

Good Luck!


Bruce I just read your build thread and it is inspiring, your approach to so many different issues was brilliant. Very well done!
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Gallery Classifieds Feedback
crofty
Judas of the North


Joined: August 09, 2000
Posts: 19670
Location: Land of Whine and Phonies
crofty is offline 

PostPosted: Thu Jun 26, 2014 3:35 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Big Bill wrote:
crofty I saw your bus at Red Barn in April, it looks great for 16+ year old paint job.


Thanks.
_________________
Your Vanagon sucks, Stop waving at me.

HamburgerBrad wrote:

I slept on crofty's tent once. I passed out drunk from two bottles of Everett's brother's wine.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website Gallery Classifieds Feedback
mraible
Samba Member


Joined: December 27, 2013
Posts: 70
Location: Denver, CO
mraible is offline 

PostPosted: Fri Jan 30, 2015 9:30 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks for the advice y'all. We ended up going with single stage. Looks pretty good if you ask me!

Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.
THE BUS IS FINALLY PAINTED! by mraible, on Flickr

Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.
IT'S SO BEAUTIFUL! by mraible, on Flickr

Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.
I LOVE IT SO MUCH! by mraible, on Flickr

There's a good story about how it got to this stage.

----
I asked Jim Verhey at ReinCARnation to stop working on my bus in mid October. I didn't have a client lined up for November and couldn't afford to keep paying for it.

Today, I journeyed to Colorado Springs to talk with Jim. I hoped to convince him to give me a fixed bid to finish the project. When I got there, he surprised me with a finished paint job! You can imagine the look on my face when he opened the door and I saw this beauty!! HOLY SHIT - I LOVE IT SO MUCH!! The colors are perfect and paint job is exquisite!!

Jim said he felt bad for all I’ve been through with this project and finishing it was my Christmas Present. BEST CHRISTMAS PRESENT EVER!!

Story and more pictures on my blog: http://raibledesigns.com/rd/entry/the_bus_is_painted_holy
----

Cheers,

Matt
_________________
'66 Porsche Bus
'90 H6 Syncro
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website Facebook Twitter Gallery Classifieds Feedback
Display posts from previous:   
Reply to topic    Forum Index -> Split Bus All times are Mountain Standard Time/Pacific Daylight Savings Time
Page: Previous  1, 2
Page 2 of 2

 
Jump to:  
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum

About | Help! | Advertise | Donate | Premium Membership | Privacy/Terms of Use | Contact Us | Site Map
Copyright © 1996-2023, Everett Barnes. All Rights Reserved.
Not affiliated with or sponsored by Volkswagen of America | Forum powered by phpBB
Links to eBay or other vendor sites may be affiliate links where the site receives compensation.