Fender Beading for 1973 412?

[1973 412 WAGON]

will VW Bug Fender Beading fit my 412?

[raygreenwood]

Yes and no. It will physically fit....but will not look good at all and will not seal at all.

The type 4 uses essentially the same fender beading profiles as the type 3. In the front end under the headlights its a rounded "T" shaped top. From the hood/ fender line back to the wkndshield its similar enough to bug but a bit differnt in shape and was shaped by the specific piece and had more than one profile from start to finish on that part.
on the trailing edge of the fender it was a T top as well. On the rops of the rear fender it is a "P" shaped profile. The sections by the engjne lid I think are also the P shaped profile.

I gave up on fender beading for the type 4 a long time ago in the 90s when it was clear that not only is it very hard to find (really all there is is type 3 stuff).....and it Became clear after I used a few pieces.....that nothing was ever done to improve the materials of this beading.

The factory fender beading is vinyl. Vinyl sucks for this use....and I dont buy or use vinyl for any long term part. Vinyl starts shrinking the day it is born. It will always stop sealing due to shrinkage long before it visibly begins to curl and shrink.

I began looking for a better solution. I saw what a few 1930s/40s hot rodders and aircraft guys have done for their joint beading solutions. They apply a paintable long term caulk and carfully shape it through masking, application and sanding.

I liked their philosphy....and adopted it. That philosphy is..... that fender beading will never need to be removed.....unless the fender gets removed. On my 412 the only reason 5o ever remove a body panel after I get it painted is due to an accident. In that case....we will be doing paint work so the fender caulking will get removed/stripped as we do paint work.

I tested quite a few things and found that what is needed is a 25 year warranty architectural sealer/caulk. You can buy these at Home depot and other places. They are typically xylene based acrylic caulks. They come in several colors, remain pliable in any weather, are good against significant shrinkage for 25 years and are sandable and paintable.

I played for a while on my primered 412 back in 98/99 with applying it to the front seams under the headlights.

I masked with scotch tape and painters tape...exact lines about 1/8" out from each side of the beading slot between fender and body. I built the tape up to about .070" thick. Then use a thin nozzle just to fill the crack and a wide nozzle and plastic spreader to fill the trough between the tape masks.....make it smooth. Let partially dry and peel the tape mask. You are left with a nice but, squarish shaped "T" headed seal. Let it fully cure....then sand it wmoothly to dome the top a little using a soft fine grit sanding sponge and water.

I also tried a section of the rear over the top of the rear fender and made the P shaped top by masking the top of the fender ledge and the face of the chassis with tape ....and using a spreader card with a notch cut in it to shape the bead in one pull. Let dry....and sand with cut to shape soft sanding sponge.

After these experiments.....it was clear that I could form excellent fender beads that looked factory...especially after primer is applied.

What you also need to do long before you get to this stage is to perfectly align all fenders and doors and make sure you use cut to fi5 fender washers between fender and body to get spacing....because you no longer will have a fenxer between them. Also....for long term....after you get fenders aligned and bolted up....add sealer to each bolt as you screw them end. Seal the thread ends from under the fenders. ...and seal the gap between fenders and body Carefully from underneath with a 25 year marine sealer.....all of this before doing the fender bead seals from the top. Ray

[19super73]

Albert (bb412) has a work around that I am going to try.

_________________
1970 Campmobile [url=https://www.vw-mplate.com/mplate-47260.png]Click to view image[/URL]
1970 Fastback 1600 TL
1971 Doka [url=https://www.vw-mplate.com/mplate-14845.png]Click to view image[/URL]
1973 Super Beetle
1973 Westfalia [url=https://www.vw-mplate.com/mplate-31892.png]Click to view image[/URL]
1974 412 Variant
1975 La Grande Bug
1984 Vanagon

[raygreenwood]

That looks really nice. I saw that a while back. Its nice that its not covered by the paint is you like the look....but just be careful. It must seal...or there will be rust. It may need to be sealed to the body to prevent moisture from trapping.

As far as painting over that if you want to go that route....I would not do it. Its vinyl. Ray

[Kharon8]

[Lahti411]

I bought the beading from here:
http://www.vintagecarparts.co.uk/products/693-container-wing-piping-tee
They have the T-profile beading in black, white and silver. Material is similar soft plastic like the original and can be painted to match the cars' body colour.
_________________
My cars: 1972 VW 411 Variant; 1973 VW 412 4d sedan

[Kharon8]

Hello Lahti411!

Any idea how much is actually needed?

(I don't have old seals so very hard to measure too.)

Thanks!
_________________
Kharon -- '62 typ1, '63 typ14, '61 typ21, '65 typ34, '74 412, '75 typ26
FVWA.fi support group.

[Lahti411]

I just checked myold order and it was for 16 meters. I have two type 4 cars so half of that should be enough for one car. I think about 6 meters would be enough actually but i orderd a bit extra just to be sure.
By the way, i should have an extra front trunk seal you could use to find a decent substitute for your car. The profile is so common it should be available at Etra (a local rubber retailer here in Finland)
On this document on page 24 you can see something similar that was used as a seal in a 411/412 trunk:
http://files.kotisivukone.com/korjakumi.kotisivukone.com/tiedostot/108_Muotonauhat.pdf
The product 1082 541 could be quite close.
_________________
My cars: 1972 VW 411 Variant; 1973 VW 412 4d sedan

[Kharon8]

Thanks Lahti411!

Now I at least have an idea what I'm looking for.
_________________
Kharon -- '62 typ1, '63 typ14, '61 typ21, '65 typ34, '74 412, '75 typ26
FVWA.fi support group.

[titan3c]

Is there a way to tell if a material is vinyl or rubber?

[raygreenwood]

[titan3c]

I have the T shaped extrusion from the source in Lahti411's post, and it looks real nice it's not quite as wide as the original beading. I've had it on my car for several years now, and so far I'm not experiencing any shrinkage. But my car is always garaged when not in use which isn't very often, if that makes any difference.

After reading your comments I was just wondering if I should expect shrinkage, especially if it's vinyl. Bob

[raygreenwood]