New Bus Axles

SurfCityRacing · Posted: Sun Mar 29, 2015 7:48 pm Post subject:

OK Mr. Campingbox,
We're leaning toward just pulling the trigger on these. But, damn, it's gonna hurt.

It's time we do something, we're due for another visit up north! Very Happy

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Riding with Surf City had me thinking "F'n Piercy" was your real name.

thericklang · Posted: Mon Mar 30, 2015 8:04 am Post subject:

$1k an axle sounds steep but tooling can costs alot these day. If they are using a proper spline roller which are special machines I can start to see the costs adding up for a 1 time customer job. Although im surprised that the company making the HD racing bug axles cant make a bus axle. Maybe get a HD bug axle with no spline ends and get a machine shop to spline the end to the rgb gear? A lack of good axles will be a problem in the coming years for the bus community...

cdennisg · Posted: Mon Mar 30, 2015 2:42 pm Post subject:

I wish I had a bus RGB axle here to compare to a beetle axle. In my mind I can see that it would be possible to machine a bug axle to work, but in reality I may be just dreaming. It's been awhile since I held those parts in my hands.
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BarryL · Posted: Tue Mar 31, 2015 8:26 am Post subject:

Is a Beetle spline the same size as an upper RGB gear spline? I guess they are.

Photos by Black58EuroBug and Crashbox.

Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.

They both have 12 splines.

campingbox · Posted: Tue Mar 31, 2015 8:46 am Post subject:

BarryL · Posted: Tue Mar 31, 2015 9:40 am Post subject:

As long as the inner spline line is the same as bus the different lengths shouldn't matter as long as the total contact spline is the same after machining. I bet they have a high Brinell hardness that might be tough to cut. Other than that it looks easy.

klcarrie · Posted: Tue Mar 31, 2015 10:08 am Post subject:

... Which begs the question:
Why not have Bus Axle Spade Ends ground down, re-heat treated and matched with the appropriate oversized fulcrum plates. Would that not be the most economical solution?

Sounds to me that the more modification to the bus the more expectation for damage to individual components; and when those components are not being reproduced/remanufactured, it serves only the bank to apply unnecessary technology to the application at hand: Long distance travel with minimal tolerance for breakage.

If one were to gauge the distances stock buses have traveled in their respective lifetimes, I would bet that many hard miles were achieved under stock transaxle setups.

That said, If one has money to test 'what else can be done', go for it. I always like to find out what are tangible improvements to these vehicles.

Just a thought.
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Pritchin'
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Currently looking for:

- Bay Bus Pinion Nut Socket

- 64-67 big nut (rear) drums and brake parts, 46mm axle nuts (Big Nuts)

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'55 Wolfburg Pannel Project
'55 Wolfsburg SC Project
'71 Westy

campingbox · Posted: Tue Mar 31, 2015 7:56 pm Post subject:

SurfCityRacing · Posted: Tue Mar 31, 2015 10:49 pm Post subject:

esde · Posted: Wed Apr 01, 2015 5:40 pm Post subject:

I was digging through the crates today, looking for some stuff that I know is there but can't find, anyway I took the opportunity to photo and mic an early type 1 short axle next to a type 2 swing axle.

Here's what I found measuring them. The outer diameter of the splined section on each is 30mm. On the type 2 there is a 2mm shoulder at the end of the spline, that bottoms the axle in the gear and sets the proper location of the axle spade within the side gear. On this stock type 1 axle, the section behind the collar, where that new shoulder would have to be, is only 30.5-31mm. So, there is enough material to shorten a type 1 axle, and cut the splines back, but you would need to press on a sleeve to give you the shoulder. Clear as mud right?

While thinking about it some more, it dawned on me that the HD chromoly axles in my beetle are much thicker than stock. I bet you'd be safe to get some of the $200 axles from car craft, and send them to be cut to type 2 specs. It's got to be cheaper than new axles from scratch.

cdennisg · Posted: Wed Apr 01, 2015 6:28 pm Post subject:

^^^ That photo answers a ton of questions. Thanks for posting it up.
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BarryL · Posted: Wed Apr 01, 2015 6:55 pm Post subject:

SurfCityRacing · Posted: Fri Apr 03, 2015 3:02 pm Post subject:

Thanks for posting that info on axle stats! Very helpful.
_________________
Riding with Surf City had me thinking "F'n Piercy" was your real name.

g3bill · Posted: Fri Apr 03, 2015 8:20 pm Post subject: Question? think its related

My 67 bus after driving for a few blocks or more would start this clunking sound like the reduction gears were trying to climb on top of each other as I felt the oil got thinner perhaps. After reading this thread I wonder if its the axle, does this ring a bell with anyone. I havent removed the reduction cover but did buy a junk yard tranny that came out of a bus that had the trans rebuilt a few months before the wreck.
...If it is the reduction gears I wonder if there being made or just used ones for now? After switching the trans would like to rebuild the old one.
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I have Dial-Up an a hole in my pocket:)......Where are the 3 Stooges when we need them:)
'67 Camper PT westfail w/tent, hammock, jump seat. uping the motor to 1900 w/88bore/78crank.
& will be using carb 34 pict 3 ....Someday?
'82 Toyota 4x4 5sp PU lb, daily driver
Many Corvairs /& 4 rag tops
'63 Chevy 20 Truck w/4sp 292
Want, white plastic end pieces for dash grab handle

64 ragtop volks · Posted: Fri Apr 03, 2015 8:42 pm Post subject:

mine would make a poping/clunk sound taking off in 1st gear.wasted the fulcrum plates and had hairline crack in the side gear as well.

g3bill · Posted: Fri Apr 03, 2015 10:25 pm Post subject:

Mine sounded something like that, [So might not be the reduction gears on mine, I hope.]
...If spline end is good can't that damaged flat area in pic above be welded and ground or machined to specs? What are the fulcrum plates, the part inside the trans that go on either side of the smashed end of axle, sorry for not knowing the parts names...

64ragtop, being a machinist you should be able to fix most everything:)
...Could be a dumb question but...Might you know if theres a way to tell if the fulcrum end of the axle is damaged without removing or disassembling as i'm not ready to pull the motor and transaxle. Thinking if i knew a axle was damaged I could look for one ahead of time? maybe indications like moving axle to feel play with reduction gear cover off or would this not be telling?
_________________
I have Dial-Up an a hole in my pocket:)......Where are the 3 Stooges when we need them:)
'67 Camper PT westfail w/tent, hammock, jump seat. uping the motor to 1900 w/88bore/78crank.
& will be using carb 34 pict 3 ....Someday?
'82 Toyota 4x4 5sp PU lb, daily driver
Many Corvairs /& 4 rag tops
'63 Chevy 20 Truck w/4sp 292
Want, white plastic end pieces for dash grab handle

esde · Posted: Sat Apr 04, 2015 5:27 am Post subject:

Just out of curiosity I was discussing this with a machinist buddy last night. For him to take a pair of axles, cut them to bus length, and machine the correct splines would not be difficult. I sounds like most of the job is setting it up, as the axle needs to be mounted in an indexing head, with the correct plate, so that the # of splines are correctly spaced. Then matching the cutter to the spline width, and machining the splines with a mill. A lot of setup, but a relatively straightforward process. Or you could call Moser or Currie, both respline lots of domestic axles. As long as they can still cut, and not roll the splines, it should be no big deal.

GLHTurbo · Posted: Sat Apr 04, 2015 10:51 am Post subject:

IRS?
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1957 Beetle
1966 Bus

SurfCityRacing · Posted: Sat Apr 04, 2015 12:32 pm Post subject:


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