My Fuel Injection Restoration Thread w/pictures

[Lahti411]

Are you talking about these seals?
http://vwparts.aircooled.net/Intake-Manifold-Gasket-Fuel-Injected-Type-4-p/022-129-707d.htm
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My cars: 1972 VW 411 Variant; 1973 VW 412 4d sedan

[ClassicCamper]

Thanks Lahti, (and Ray).. much appreciated this looks like it:

1) Do I need to put any type of sealer on this prior to installation?


2) Can anyone recommend a parts dealer who sells these things:

I know Bus Repo has them, but it says 1974 412, I'm assuming the 1973 and earlier T4's intake manifold tubes and plenum are a different size Unless, someone can confirm these can be used on a '73.



- Ron

[raygreenwood]

The 1974 412 had a 1.8l. I believe that the runner sizes of 411 and 412 1.7s and 1.8s were the same at the intake flange. I have never known there to be one unique for each engine size but will check the book. Ray

[ClassicCamper]

Hey Folks, received phenolic gaskets from 'airkewld.net'. The ones that were on my engine were just under 5 mil, the new ones are 8 mil. Here's what it looks like:

The intake runners seem to be aligned. Can anyone give me some advice as to which one is correct? OR can I just use the 8mm??

Danke!

Note: I cannot reuse/restore my old gaskets, they are cracked.

[raygreenwood]

They will both work but the thicker knes are correct. Ray

[ClassicCamper]

Appreciate the help, Ray. The core members of the 411/412 forum has been really helpful; I powered through most of the engine stip-down and prepped for paint. I wouldn't have taken on such a challenge without this group's help. For that, I say thanks.
****
I took out the gas heater and its fuel pump tonight. All the wires were cut but it looks like it was never used. We'll see, thats another topic. -Ron

[ClassicCamper]

I purchased new phenolic spacers for my 1.7 D-Jet engine. After combing through the forums, I've noticed that the old ones can be reused with high temp RTV sealer. However, what about the new phenolic spacers with paper gaskets? What is the best way to seal them to the runners and head? Thanks

[raygreenwood]

I have written quite a bit on this. You can sand down the existing gasket surfaces to clean surface or down to the phenolic if you need to. Do it on a granite plate or sheet of glass....on fine paper....like 400 as the lowest. Then clean them in acetone or a, similar clean solvent.

Get a hard rubber roller used for print making. ..should be $8-10....and can be used for many things. Take a sheet of glass....put a spot about 1" diameter of high temp, oil resistant, RTV like Permatex ultra black, gray or copper....and roll it out. It will take acminute or two to get the roller rolling. ...but very quickly you will see that it shears the RTV out as thin as its viscosity will allow.....I measured typically only a few microns with my wet thickness gauge.

Then roll this evevly on one side of the phenolic block. It should be fairly translucent and have even surface texture. Let it dry. Clean the glass plate and roller. Repeat for the other side.

Then roll pne more thin layer on the head side of the phenolic block....and roll a thin layer on the face of the runner itself......then assemble immediately. This makes a bonded layer of RTV less than .001"-.0015" thick. Seals fantastic. Better than the factory gasket. Ray

[ClassicCamper]

Yes I read your post about using the printing wheel, great stuff. If my existing gaskets were not cracked, I'd do that procedure. However. i have brand new ones with paper gaskets adhered to spacer. Can I roll the black RTV sealer on the new phenolic spacers with paper gasket?? I'd hate to sand them off each side.

[raygreenwood]

[ClassicCamper]

[raygreenwood]

Is that from Jeff Bowlsby? He does very nice work.

Also...that is acnewly built harness....correct?....because IMHO.....there is nothing but a few plugs that can be reused from old harnesses.....so not sure what a refurbished harness would be doing.

Also bear in mind......that harness is just about identical in every detail to the factory harness. Bowlsby did a good job of researching materials. My only minor disagreement with his technique from a couple of conversations way back when......is going with normal factory spec wire and sheathing. It will begin hardening up from heat and oil just like factory.

Yes....you have a perfect harness for about 10-12 years to come. But eventually you will be doing this again......the risks of driving museum pieces!
He does great work! Enjoy!.....Ray

[titan3c]

I'm just a little confused about the pcv. Exactly where is it? From what I read here it's on the air cleaner, and you mentioned a tip that most owners don't know what it is. I've looked at mine and see a round tip about half inch diameter------could that be what your talking about? I haven't removed the cleaner to inspect the other side yet. My engine idles, and runs perfectly, accelerates normally etc., but members of my club say they can hear an air leak of some kind. My hearing is not what it use to be, and I don't hear it. Just wondering if the pcv has anything to do with that.

[raygreenwood]

Just being thorough here.....you have D-jet injection ...correct?

Ok......look at the black square box with the wire clamp over the top. That is the oil breather. Are there any hoses leading to this box?

What air cleaner is your car using? Is it the gray plastic one with a paper element or the oil bath air cleaner?

How many turns outward is your idle screw on the throttle body?

Are all of your vacuum lines connected on the throttle body? There should be three small vacuum lines.

Is your throttle plate all the way closed?

Is the throttle kicker vacuum module retracted at idle and away from the throttle body lever at idle?

Is the AAR fully closed at idle?.....pull the hose from the outside end when its fully warmed up. If you feel any vacuum its not closed.

Next pull the 12mm hose that goes into intake boot BEFORE the TB. If you feel any vacuum here while its running and warmed up......and idling......then either the AAR is leaking....or the deceleration valve is leaking. If you tested the AAR as noted above......and its fine.....

Then
....if you have the electronic deceleration valve....its inlet hose should plug into the plenum from the left hand side near the amient air temp sensor. Pull the hose off crom tje opposite side of the valve. ....between the valve and the air inlet boot. If you feel any vacuum at the valve....the valve is leaking.


There is going to be some small hissing at idle. This is not a carburetted car. There is a minor amount of hissing that is at idle that is the air flowing, through the idle bypass screw at the TB.

Also......check the hoses that go between the cylinder heads and the air cleaner.

If you have the oil bath air cleaner...also check the small bore vacuum hose between the left side of the intake and the air cleaner. Just unplug it and plug the hose for a moment. If the hissing stops ....then the thermostatic switch on the air cleaner is leaking. Ray

[ClassicCamper]

In the middle section of the intake, you can see how the phenolic gasket covers some of the engine sheet metal. Is this okay? If not, what is the correct fix?

[raygreenwood]

Dremel tool with sanding drum. In the past I have clearanced the phenolic blocks. Last time I had the sheet metal off....I clearanced the sheet metal. Ray

[ClassicCamper]

My pcv valve allows air to be sucked into the plenum (but goes thru two right angle elbows to hopefully reduce oil being sucked into plenum). If you blow into the pcv valve, it will shut and not allow any air into the breather. Is this how its supposed to function?

[raygreenwood]

Yes.....its a one way valve....out of the crankcase...but not back in. Also.....really....its operation is problematic. Use it for now, but replace it with a fixed 2-3mm orifice in the line and the car will run and tune much better. It causes issues with the MPS.

Also.....the engkne has no problems with oiling. The combination of the draw through PCV through the heads, the zig-zag baffel cast into the engine block chimney....and the actual chimney piece that the PCV is mounted in... (which in itself is a very well designed oil baffel)....do very well to separate oil.

Generally oil found in the MPS....is from the oil bath air cleaner. Ray